Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > NBA Team Forums > Chicago Bulls Forum

Chicago Bulls Forum Chicago Bulls message board - chicago bulls fan forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-19-2010, 03:21 AM   #1
Crazy Style
Bulls official mod
 
Crazy Style's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Chicago's Nearwest Suburbs
Posts: 1,880
Default Roger Mason?

Should we just get it over with and sign the best three point shooter available? I think it would probably make the most sense at this point, ecspecially with other options running low. He doesnt have the greatest FG%, but I'd take him over a guy like flip and most definatley Pargo . He'd be an upgrade and if he could be a 42-45% shooter and shoot around 40% from three as he did in 07/08 and 08/09 than that would be great for this team. He is a 38% career three point shooter and if you ignore his first three seasons where he barely ever played including a very short stint with the then horrible Bulls he's done alright. Outside of his big three point shooting ability, he is also a very good free throw shooter averaging 87% for his career. Finally his size is just right at 6'5 and weighing in at 212, no more of these guys that are either barely 6'2 or 6'3 playing the 2 gaurd position, unless they have the ability of someone like Gordon for example than no thanks. This year the Bulls will be a nice sized team and Mason could be the most logical next addition to expand this teams offense. Maybe they should sign him for like a 2 year deal and then they'll see if he's worth keeping after that. I would do this signing sooner than later because the Bulls could end up getting screwed with Korver being the only consistant good three point shooter on this team if they wait to long. Yea it's nice that Rose says that his perimeter shot is better than expected and yes Deng is taking more good three pointers and improving on that, but it's still not enough.

Last edited by Crazy Style : 07-19-2010 at 03:37 AM.
Crazy Style is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 10:55 AM   #2
ljsbb27
Local High School Star
 
ljsbb27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,186
Default Re: Roger Mason?

I would welcome a signing of Roger Mason. She just had a bad shooting year from behind the arc, but he wasn't getting consistent minutes so he wasn't allowed to get into a rhythm for the majority of the season and thats a big part of an outside shooter's game. I have no reason to believe that he can't regain his shooting touch. I know the Bulls have been interested in him for a while and the two sides have been in contact so hopefully something gets done soon before he chooses to go somewhere else. He would be a valuable piece here as he could play some PG as well as SG. Adding another 3-point shooter would really be helpful and he's pretty much the best at that from what's left. He's also a smart player and you can't have enough of those on a team. He's a willing defender too so Thibs will like him. Just seems to make alot of sense so we'll see.
ljsbb27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 12:31 PM   #3
Crazy Style
Bulls official mod
 
Crazy Style's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Chicago's Nearwest Suburbs
Posts: 1,880
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Lets get it done!
Crazy Style is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 02:39 PM   #4
Rose
Hero in a half shell
 
Rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Pole
Posts: 35,308
Default Re: Roger Mason?

He's had two years where he shot 40%, and 42%. and that's the only times he's shot at or above 40% they rest is the low 30s.
Rose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 07:12 PM   #5
ljsbb27
Local High School Star
 
ljsbb27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,186
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose
He's had two years where he shot 40%, and 42%. and that's the only times he's shot at or above 40% they rest is the low 30s.

Percentages aren't always a tell all though. Statistics are a good background and give you some insight into a players strengths and weaknesses but they don't always tell the whole story. This is the perfect case of such. You have to look deeper into it to find out probable causes and what actually led to those numbers.

The seasons in which you are referring to that he shot in the low 30's he averaged 6,12,14,and 7 minutes a game for those 4 seasons. Playing time contributes to everybody playing better, but especially for a shooter. A shooter has to develop a certain kind of rhythm in game action in order to shoot at a high percentage. It's hard to ask a player to shoot effectively when he's playing in such a small fraction of the games for entire seasons.

The two seasons in which he did shoot 40 and 42% he averaged 21 and 30 minutes a game.

This is just my opinion, but I feel like it definately has alot to do with it.

If we were to sign him I'd see him getting 20-25 mpg and I'd see him taking good shots created by Rose's drives and Boozer's pass outs ad shooting effectively.

Just what I think though.
ljsbb27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 07:29 PM   #6
Rose
Hero in a half shell
 
Rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Pole
Posts: 35,308
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ljsbb27
Percentages aren't always a tell all though. Statistics are a good background and give you some insight into a players strengths and weaknesses but they don't always tell the whole story. This is the perfect case of such. You have to look deeper into it to find out probable causes and what actually led to those numbers.

The seasons in which you are referring to that he shot in the low 30's he averaged 6,12,14,and 7 minutes a game for those 4 seasons. Playing time contributes to everybody playing better, but especially for a shooter. A shooter has to develop a certain kind of rhythm in game action in order to shoot at a high percentage. It's hard to ask a player to shoot effectively when he's playing in such a small fraction of the games for entire seasons.

The two seasons in which he did shoot 40 and 42% he averaged 21 and 30 minutes a game.

This is just my opinion, but I feel like it definately has alot to do with it.

If we were to sign him I'd see him getting 20-25 mpg and I'd see him taking good shots created by Rose's drives and Boozer's pass outs ad shooting effectively.

Just what I think though.

I agree stats aren't a tell all obviously. And I think that in seasons 1 and 2 obviously he's not going to shoot the 3 that well, or get a lot of playing time as a rookie second rounder. And he didn't get really any playing time in year 4. But last year he got a nice 19 minutes a game, and averaged 6 points and 39% three point shooting. Not really impressive. I really don't think we need another 3 point shooter at all. or a backup point guard. I think the team as is, is fine, unless rose gets injured. and then just trade for someone, with the cap room available it should be pretty easy to get a ramon sessions, DJ augustin type of guy
Rose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 07:58 PM   #7
ljsbb27
Local High School Star
 
ljsbb27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,186
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose
I agree stats aren't a tell all obviously. And I think that in seasons 1 and 2 obviously he's not going to shoot the 3 that well, or get a lot of playing time as a rookie second rounder. And he didn't get really any playing time in year 4. But last year he got a nice 19 minutes a game, and averaged 6 points and 39% three point shooting. Not really impressive. I really don't think we need another 3 point shooter at all. or a backup point guard. I think the team as is, is fine, unless rose gets injured. and then just trade for someone, with the cap room available it should be pretty easy to get a ramon sessions, DJ augustin type of guy

No not really impressive but not terrible either. Pretty solid player and I'd rather have the insurance to begin with then have to scramble and try to find a solution at the spur of the moment. We have the cap space to do it so I think we should maximize the level of talent on this team now.
ljsbb27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 08:00 PM   #8
Rose
Hero in a half shell
 
Rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Pole
Posts: 35,308
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ljsbb27
No not really impressive but not terrible either. Pretty solid player and I'd rather have the insurance to begin with then have to scramble and try to find a solution at the spur of the moment. We have the cap space to do it so I think we should maximize the level of talent on this team now.
Differences in opinion I guess. I can see your point.
Rose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 08:12 PM   #9
ljsbb27
Local High School Star
 
ljsbb27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,186
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose
Differences in opinion I guess. I can see your point.

I can see your point too. It's more of a matter of being safe than sorry I guess.
ljsbb27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2010, 08:46 PM   #10
Rose
Hero in a half shell
 
Rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Pole
Posts: 35,308
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ljsbb27
I can see your point too. It's more of a matter of being safe than sorry I guess.

Which I can understand entirely.
Rose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2010, 01:58 AM   #11
tamaraw08
Decent college freshman
 
tamaraw08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,697
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose
I agree stats aren't a tell all obviously. And I think that in seasons 1 and 2 obviously he's not going to shoot the 3 that well, or get a lot of playing time as a rookie second rounder. And he didn't get really any playing time in year 4. But last year he got a nice 19 minutes a game, and averaged 6 points and 39% three point shooting. Not really impressive. I really don't think we need another 3 point shooter at all. or a backup point guard. I think the team as is, is fine, unless rose gets injured. and then just trade for someone, with the cap room available it should be pretty easy to get a ramon sessions, DJ augustin type of guy

39% from the 3pt line is pretty good IMO. Actually you hit above 33% from that area, its equivalent of hitting 50% from the field. To simplify, when a player takes 3 3pt shots and make 1, he generates 3 pts= 1 pt per attempt.
3 pt shooting opens up the painter area for Boozer to operate.
3pt shooting unclogs the lanes so Rose and slash/penetrate and get layups or set up Noah/Boozer if the opposing team's frontline helps on Rose.
Right now, the Bulls only have 1 shooting guard in Brewer who shoots 23.4% from the 3pt line. Yes he is crafty, great defense, can hit 15-footers etc.
But still my main concern is his defender laying off (sagging in)about 3-5 feet off ronnie of say at the high post to clog those lanes for Rose and at the same time ready to double on Boozer who shoots a high % inside.
Noah's defender and Brewer's defender can basically play a mini zone inside. Incase some of you didn't see the Finals, this is exactly how Kobe neutralize Rondo by patrolling/roaming within the high post.
tamaraw08 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2010, 02:12 AM   #12
Rose
Hero in a half shell
 
Rose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: North Pole
Posts: 35,308
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamaraw08
39% from the 3pt line is pretty good IMO. Actually you hit above 33% from that area, its equivalent of hitting 50% from the field. To simplify, when a player takes 3 3pt shots and make 1, he generates 3 pts= 1 pt per attempt.
3 pt shooting opens up the painter area for Boozer to operate.
3pt shooting unclogs the lanes so Rose and slash/penetrate and get layups or set up Noah/Boozer if the opposing team's frontline helps on Rose.
Right now, the Bulls only have 1 shooting guard in Brewer who shoots 23.4% from the 3pt line. Yes he is crafty, great defense, can hit 15-footers etc.
But still my main concern is his defender laying off (sagging in)about 3-5 feet off ronnie of say at the high post to clog those lanes for Rose and at the same time ready to double on Boozer who shoots a high % inside.
Noah's defender and Brewer's defender can basically play a mini zone inside. Incase some of you didn't see the Finals, this is exactly how Kobe neutralize Rondo by patrolling/roaming within the high post.

Yeah and most people agree that holding your opponent to a point per shot attempt is pretty good. would you care if Kobe dropped 27 on 27 attempts? Hell no you'd be like damn, that was some rock solid defense, and CJ watson is very capable from three. I mean obviously it's ideal but he's not terrible. But I really don't see people sagging off brewer that much because if they do he's going to drive and either pass it off, or dunk it. Rondo doesn't have the speed to punish most of his defenders like Brewer does.

I also don't believe you have to shoot a ton of threes to win a game. Look at the Celtics. Ray's a legit three shooter, and pierce can hit his. But obviously Ray is no longer the lock on sharp shooter he once was and while still good he's more streaky. Pierce will hit one every now and again but isn't a threat. and the only other real three threat they had was...Nate? and that's more of if you don't guard him.

Lakers? Basically it's Kobe and Fish. Fish hits his sometimes but I wouldn't exactly say he's a well known three shooter that you have to guard from three but he'll knock down his open ones. Kobe? Kobe's pretty good and he'll definitely hit some threes on you but he's more known as a slasher and midrange shooter than a three shooter.

Meanwhile teams like the Magic and Suns get sent home early, and take a ton of threes a game. another case in point the Spurs of yesteryear. Ginobili got his, no doubt but he didn't take a lot of them. and then they had Horry in the corner and sometimes Finley. They just chose theirs carefully.

Which leads to the Bulls. Deng is going to knock down his open threes, especially the corner one. I actually LOVE that shot for him. and him being the third option now, I really think that's going to help him out in that department. Rose is going to hit his open ones, especially this upcoming year I have faith, but there's nothing really proving that. Korver? I don't believe I need to say anything about him. watson? Not a bad three shooter. not ideal. But like I said before most teams that win titles in recent histories don't knock down a lot to win their games. They just take the smart ones.
Rose is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2010, 02:56 AM   #13
ljsbb27
Local High School Star
 
ljsbb27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,186
Default Re: Roger Mason?

More outside shooting sure couldn't hurt, but I don't think its absolutely necessary in order for us to be successful. I was more wanting to sign Mason before the Watson pickup as I felt he would be valuable in regards to being able to play SG as well as some PG. But having Watson eliminates the need for another PG. So all in all if we sign Mason fine, but if we don't I won't be particularly upset now that we have Watson.
ljsbb27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2010, 10:17 AM   #14
drwax26
High School Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 832
Default Re: Roger Mason?

I think we should def sign mason. We would then have watson, mason, korver who are all capable of hitting multiple 3s in a game. Then maybe deng and rose who could hit prolly 1 3pt fg a game which would not make us a liability in the shooting department.
drwax26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2010, 06:04 PM   #15
tamaraw08
Decent college freshman
 
tamaraw08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,697
Default Re: Roger Mason?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rose
Yeah and most people agree that holding your opponent to a point per shot attempt is pretty good. would you care if Kobe dropped 27 on 27 attempts? Hell no you'd be like damn, that was some rock solid defense, and CJ watson is very capable from three. I mean obviously it's ideal but he's not terrible. But I really don't see people sagging off brewer that much because if they do he's going to drive and either pass it off, or dunk it. Rondo doesn't have the speed to punish most of his defenders like Brewer does.

I also don't believe you have to shoot a ton of threes to win a game. Look at the Celtics. Ray's a legit three shooter, and pierce can hit his. But obviously Ray is no longer the lock on sharp shooter he once was and while still good he's more streaky. Pierce will hit one every now and again but isn't a threat. and the only other real three threat they had was...Nate? and that's more of if you don't guard him.

Lakers? Basically it's Kobe and Fish. Fish hits his sometimes but I wouldn't exactly say he's a well known three shooter that you have to guard from three but he'll knock down his open ones. Kobe? Kobe's pretty good and he'll definitely hit some threes on you but he's more known as a slasher and midrange shooter than a three shooter.

Meanwhile teams like the Magic and Suns get sent home early, and take a ton of threes a game. another case in point the Spurs of yesteryear. Ginobili got his, no doubt but he didn't take a lot of them. and then they had Horry in the corner and sometimes Finley. They just chose theirs carefully.

Which leads to the Bulls. Deng is going to knock down his open threes, especially the corner one. I actually LOVE that shot for him. and him being the third option now, I really think that's going to help him out in that department. Rose is going to hit his open ones, especially this upcoming year I have faith, but there's nothing really proving that. Korver? I don't believe I need to say anything about him. watson? Not a bad three shooter. not ideal. But like I said before most teams that win titles in recent histories don't knock down a lot to win their games. They just take the smart ones.

Rondo doesn't have the speed to punish defenders? Are you kidding me?
Who said the Bulls need to shoot a ton of 3's. Its the idea of "mixing it up" and taking what the defense is giving you.
You really don't think Fisher's 3 pt shooting doesn't have any bearing at all.
It's funny how Phil would always have legit clutch shooter from Hodges and Paxson to BJ Armstrong, to Steve Kerr to Horry and Fisher etc etc.
I agree that Allen is not as consistent anymore but its a fact that his defender is sticking to him making the defense STRETCH, freeing up KG inside and allowing Pierce and Rondo to slash. btw, Allen's defenders continue to stick to him bec a 3 pt shot is very crucial, if you are leading by 3pts you pad it to 6, hit another one after a stop, you bring it to huge 9 pt cushion.
Did it occur to you that Boston is aware of this and this is a reason why they signed him to a hefty extension?
3 pt attempt also lead to longer rebounds increasing the chances of the offensive team to get an offensive rebound.All top teams have legit 3pt shooters.
Lastly, Mason is not ave 33%= 1 pt per 3pt shot, as mentioned, he is averaging 39%, that's 6 more(18 pts) per 100 shots or 9pts per 50 shots. I was explaining that IF you hit 33% in essence you are generating 1pt per shot, that is actually decent as compared to other players who is ave bet 42-45% from the field.

Last edited by tamaraw08 : 07-22-2010 at 06:10 PM.
tamaraw08 is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:49 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy