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Old 08-11-2010, 09:08 PM   #151
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by KB2009Champ
ariza has got to feel like a real dummy right now.

all that sheeeet the rockets promised him out the window.

smh.

fire your damn agent


Remember when he signed with Houston and all the Laker haters were saying how he would become a star with the Rockets
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Old 08-11-2010, 09:15 PM   #152
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
Because he's on a one year deal and Favors is nowhere near ready. The better question is why sign Sean May, obviously the discussions for this trade came out of nowhere. At least as far as Jersey being involved anyway.

Do the Nets really think they are competing right now for a title? If not, that's irrelevant.
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Old 08-11-2010, 09:35 PM   #153
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by Showtime
This was an incredibly short-sighted move which just sets the table for massive failure in two years. The team won't be contending, and Paul will leave, and the team will have already given away their future all star 20/10 PG and be ready to dump Ariza's deal.

So are you saying if NO didn't make the trade they would be contending in 2 years? Their a ways off and wouldn't have been contending anyway. Ariza will be good for them. They needed to trade Collison. They shouldn't be worried about a reserve PG. They need to worry about their starting 5 first.
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Old 08-11-2010, 09:43 PM   #154
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

NO's starting 5 got better , but they are taking a big risk in possibly having no good PG at all in the future and I think they could have done better than Ariza
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:06 PM   #155
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Im really liking Indiana now if they can try to package T.J, Dunleavy and Posey for a PF who can split minutes with crazy T I think their set.

Collison/Stephenson/Price
George/Rush/Stephenson
Granger/Jones
Crazy T/acquired PF
Hibbert/McBob
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:16 PM   #156
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by Simple Jack
Do the Nets really think they are competing right now for a title? If not, that's irrelevant.
No it's not. Favors is very raw right now and throwing him out there more than he can handle will be putting way too much pressure on him and may even diminish his confidence. We have to work him in. He'll still get plenty of time this year as it is and remember the guy is only 19 years old.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:23 PM   #157
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by tpols
No it's not. Favors is very raw right now and throwing him out there more than he can handle will be putting way too much pressure on him and may even diminish his confidence. We have to work him in. He'll still get plenty of time this year as it is and remember the guy is only 19 years old.

All rookies get severely limited minutes? There are plenty of players who are "raw" and get time to shine. Amare came out of HS and played 31 minutes his first year. This literally gives Favors no legitimate playing time.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:26 PM   #158
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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So are you saying if NO didn't make the trade they would be contending in 2 years?

No, I'm saying that at least when Paul leaves eventually, they will already have a quality PG who has all-star talent that they can go from there, whereas now they will have absolutely nothing unless they trade Paul in his last year and hope to get something in return.

It's the difference between having something to build on, and having nothing. As it is, this team just traded a future all star for a role player, and they will be in Cleveland's situation in 3 years: having zero direction, no franchise player, and no hope.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:27 PM   #159
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Question Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Tested this out in the trade machine...

(Four way Trade: DET, IND, GSW & CLE)
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=29rhtt9

Here is why it makes sense for the three teams:

Cleveland - they are going no where fast and need to start re-building as soon as possible. There three biggest contracts that extend beyond this year are Jamison, Mo and Varejao. You get rid of all of them in this deal, get Ellis as a star that will put people in seats for the next few years to build around along with sessions in the back court and a ton of cap space to work with at the end of the year.

Detroit - seems to make the least sense initially, but let me explain. They need to move beyond the old team (Tay and Rip are the hold outs). They also need to have Austin Day develop give Gordon more playing time and hope that Munroe is their PF of the future. With that said what they really need is a real point and a solid center. This gives them both (Biedrins and Mo) along with a potential back up starter at SF if George develops faster than Day.

Indy - basically the team continues making a splash this summer. They have Collision as a solid point, they have SF secured with Granger. Now they get a "Reggie-like" SG in Rip Hamilton who is a solid scoring options and provides veteran playoff experience. They also fill the whole at PF with Jamison which is much better than the options they have right now. The weakness here is that they might need more of a banger at the PF but they will at least have Varejao coming off the bench. This might put indy in even better position for the future. They would have nice mix of young talent and vets with playoff experience giving them a chance to actually do some damage in the playoffs.

Golden State - Biedrins wants out and they want to move Ellis. The two contracts tie up 20 mil in cap space. They get two contracts that expire next year (also making them players in free agency in the next few years - with Curry as the corner stone). They get a plug at the centre position which they need with Biedrins gone but avoid getting a long term contract of all the over paid centers out there. And they get to see how Tay fits in. A vet on the roster that is quite young that also provides defence, runs the floor and adds some size to the perimeter. They don't get a lot back here so may be this might need to be sweetened up a but for Golden State with a draft pick or two.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:34 PM   #160
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Wow, Indiana raped on this deal. They get the PG they always wanted in Collison and also get a good 3-point shooter who can also defend with Posey, and they just have to give up Murphy, which doesn't even hurt them much because they have Hansbrough ready to start and take his spot.

Great move by the Indiana front office.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:56 PM   #161
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

You know, its interesting. We all think NO should have done better for Collison but if you think about it, NO ran into a problem. The problem is this is the Golden Age of Point Guards. There's just too many good ones around.

Think about it. How many teams out there are truly desperate for a good starting PG? If you go through the list, not many.

I found two. Indiana and Charlotte. The Heat too, but they don't even need a PG. Maybe Atlanta if you don't like Bibby, but that's about it.

Everyone else has either a great PG or at least a "pretty good" one. How many teams were going to give up alot to get Collison? I think that actually hurt NO in their chances of landing someone better than Ariza. Too many good PG's floating around.


But one thing is clear. New Orleans just went "all in" on Chris Paul. Chances of him being traded are slim to none now.

Last edited by bagelred : 08-11-2010 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:02 PM   #162
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagelred
You know, its interesting. We all think NO should have done better for Collison but if you think about it, NO ran into a problem. The problem is this is the Golden Age of Point Guards. There's just too many good ones around.

Think about it. How many teams out there are truly desperate for a good starting PG? If you go through the list, not many.

I found two. Indiana and Charlotte. The Heat too, but they don't even need a PG. Maybe Atlanta if you don't like Bibby, but that's about it.

Everyone else has either a great PG or at least a "pretty good" one. How many teams were going to give up alot to get Collison? I think that actually hurt NO in their chances of landing someone better than Ariza. Too many good PG's floating around.


But one thing is clear. New Orleans just went "all in" on Chris Paul. Chances of him being traded are slim to none now.
I'm not complaining since Indy obviously did well, but if the current case is that you can't get good enough value for Collison, then you wait. They've got Paul for two more years, there's no need to rush into something.
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:05 PM   #163
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

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Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
I'm not complaining since Indy obviously did well, but if the current case is that you can't get good enough value for Collison, then you wait. They've got Paul for two more years, there's no need to rush into something.

I mean, I agree to an extent, but they are also trying to win games. Having Collison sit on the bench doesn't help you win games and doesn't make Paul any happier.

Ariza's a good player, but its not the splash you want to keep Paul around.
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:11 PM   #164
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simple Jack
All rookies get severely limited minutes? There are plenty of players who are "raw" and get time to shine. Amare came out of HS and played 31 minutes his first year. This literally gives Favors no legitimate playing time.

I don't think it cuts his minutes too much. He wasn't going to play a ton this year.
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:14 PM   #165
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Default Re: Hornets/Rockets/Pacers/Nets Trade w/Murphy, Ariza, Lee, Others...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Showtime
No, I'm saying that at least when Paul leaves eventually, they will already have a quality PG who has all-star talent that they can go from there, whereas now they will have absolutely nothing unless they trade Paul in his last year and hope to get something in return.

It's the difference between having something to build on, and having nothing. As it is, this team just traded a future all star for a role player, and they will be in Cleveland's situation in 3 years: having zero direction, no franchise player, and no hope.

I think keeping Collison around would have made Paul want to leave more. At least now there's a chance to keep Paul around. He wouldn't have stayed for sure with another PG of Collison's caliber around.
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