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Old 10-30-2010, 02:58 AM   #16
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
Sarcastic just stop...you had all offseason to hype up our young players and say how promising they are and how Melo isnt worth all three.The season is here now and reality and common sense has taken center stage.Other than Chandler,they havent done jack $h!t to warrant passing up a guy who is a perrenial allstar and one of if not the purest scorer in the league (I go back and forth between him and Durant).Dude is like Bernard King with 3 point range and a handle.

As for Arenas,trust me on this one...BAD BAD IDEA!!!I live in the DC area and dude is a basket case.He's a locker room cancer and a coaches nightmare. He's like a milder TO in that he just cannot n will not ever learn to shut up.I mean you have a huge gun charge and suspension,they remove your banner from the Verizon center and the 1st thing you do when you come back is have an interview and tell everyone you lied to the coach about being injured because Nick Young needed more PT than you.Cmon...dude is psycho.

N as for just waiting...have u not learned from LeBrick?You dont think trading for Melo is more of a guarantee than if we sit back and wait while every team gets a crack @ him?Luol Deng's contract and Joakim Noah kept Chicago from gettin him.You dont think theyll find someone to take Deng especially now that they dont have to get rid of Noah? You dont think the Nets will try to make a push @ Melo?You dont think the Rockets will either?The Clippers may even get in the race.Melo has a crib in LA.

Bottom line is,if we get Melo via trade,the chances of him signing elsewhere even if he doesnt sign a deal right away are significantly less than if every team has a an qual crack @ him.You know this and I know this so let's quit w/ the song and dance.N yea our depth doesnt look good given the proposed roster you made but guess what....neither doesnt our current team.So you cant sit around and wait for ppl to become superstars "hopefully".I'd rather be proactive and take the guy who already is becuz last time i checked the guy who is producing the most on our team is the guy we respect the least!

I will continue to stress this until you offer up a valid defense:

Where else would Melo sign longterm to play after this season? He & his people are making it clear he wants to join Amare with the Knicks.

No team can trade for him now unless he works out an extension to play there. Until he does so or his people say he is interested in doing so, I wont think any other option is valid.

The difference between Melo & LeBron's situation? LeBron had many suitors with as much cap space with as big of plans as we had. Carmelo doesn't in 2011.

New Jersey fell through.
LAC doesnt have the contracts needed to get a deal done.
Houston doesn't have the talent needed to get a deal done.
Chicago is not going to find a team to take Deng's contract and give them the prospects/picks needed to send to Denver.

How am I wrong? The only thing keeping Melo from joining the Knicks is time.

Last edited by Rowe : 10-30-2010 at 03:04 AM.
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Old 10-30-2010, 11:48 AM   #17
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Valid defense? I've come up with multiple arguements and your argument from jump is that "he's made it clear he wants to be a Knick." Show me one quote we HE said that.Not Spike,Not Chris Broussard...not some indirect quote you twisted to HOPE thats what he meant...where does Carmelo Anthony say I want to be a New York Knick and will not sign anywhere else?

It's the foolish sit on your hands and do nothing approach that has Amare lookin lonely and hoping Chandler can sustain his recent success.

New Jersey fell through but so did we.Just because a deal doesnt happen the 1st time around doesnt mean it wont ever happen.

The Clippers could very easily get a 3rd team involved if they dont have contracts that add up (i havent checked)

Houston has more talent than we do.Check their record and ours over the last year.

The Bulls can find someone to take Deng's contract or buy him out or something. It's not like it's impossible.Deng isn't a bum.They could trade him to a team for a conditional 2nd round pick.Theres dumb teams every year that take on bad contracts.Shoot,we were one of them.

As for the cap space,we were the only team to have enough space to sign 2 max guys in the beginning of the offseason.You see how quick that changed.This dumb @$$ team out here where I'm @ was dumb enough to take on Kirk Hinrich's contract despite having Arenas and John Wall.

Last edited by franchize : 10-30-2010 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 10-30-2010, 01:49 PM   #18
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
Sarcastic just stop...you had all offseason to hype up our young players and say how promising they are and how Melo isnt worth all three.The season is here now and reality and common sense has taken center stage.Other than Chandler,they havent done jack $h!t to warrant passing up a guy who is a perrenial allstar and one of if not the purest scorer in the league (I go back and forth between him and Durant).Dude is like Bernard King with 3 point range and a handle.

As for Arenas,trust me on this one...BAD BAD IDEA!!!I live in the DC area and dude is a basket case.He's a locker room cancer and a coaches nightmare. He's like a milder TO in that he just cannot n will not ever learn to shut up.I mean you have a huge gun charge and suspension,they remove your banner from the Verizon center and the 1st thing you do when you come back is have an interview and tell everyone you lied to the coach about being injured because Nick Young needed more PT than you.Cmon...dude is psycho.

N as for just waiting...have u not learned from LeBrick?You dont think trading for Melo is more of a guarantee than if we sit back and wait while every team gets a crack @ him?Luol Deng's contract and Joakim Noah kept Chicago from gettin him.You dont think theyll find someone to take Deng especially now that they dont have to get rid of Noah? You dont think the Nets will try to make a push @ Melo?You dont think the Rockets will either?The Clippers may even get in the race.Melo has a crib in LA.

Bottom line is,if we get Melo via trade,the chances of him signing elsewhere even if he doesnt sign a deal right away are significantly less than if every team has a an qual crack @ him.You know this and I know this so let's quit w/ the song and dance.N yea our depth doesnt look good given the proposed roster you made but guess what....neither doesnt our current team.So you cant sit around and wait for ppl to become superstars "hopefully".I'd rather be proactive and take the guy who already is becuz last time i checked the guy who is producing the most on our team is the guy we respect the least!


It's 2 games into the season and Randolph hasn't even played yet. Gallo will get better. And besides, those guys haven't even started peaking yet. They are all like 21 and 23 years old.

Again, I am willing to give up 2 of them, but not all 3 for one player. It would be one thing if we had no leverage, but that is not the case. We don't have to give into Denver's demands. They are the ones who are on the lower ground. If the offseason comes and they have not moved him, they will be begging us to do a sign and trade for a second round pick.
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:15 PM   #19
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
Valid defense? I've come up with multiple arguements and your argument from jump is that "he's made it clear he wants to be a Knick." Show me one quote we HE said that.Not Spike,Not Chris Broussard...not some indirect quote you twisted to HOPE thats what he meant...where does Carmelo Anthony say I want to be a New York Knick and will not sign anywhere else?
So you want to be in denial of all the signs?

Everyone from Spike Lee to Fat Joe have come out saying that Carmelo has told them he wants to be a Knick and play with Amare. He cant publicly demand a trade, nor can he go public saying he wants to be a Knick. They have been working the backchannels for weeks if not months trying to get him to New York, but Denver doesn't want what we can offer.

Why do you think there has been talk about trading Chandler for a 1st rounder? We're a borderline Playoff team trading our 2nd leading scorer, do you not think they are considering it because they know Melo is a realistic possibility?

Quote:
New Jersey fell through but so did we.Just because a deal doesnt happen the 1st time around doesnt mean it wont ever happen.

The Clippers could very easily get a 3rd team involved if they dont have contracts that add up (i havent checked)

Houston has more talent than we do.Check their record and ours over the last year.

The Bulls can find someone to take Deng's contract or buy him out or something. It's not like it's impossible.Deng isn't a bum.They could trade him to a team for a conditional 2nd round pick.Theres dumb teams every year that take on bad contracts.Shoot,we were one of them.

Once again, you're still driving these same arguments.


New Jersey fell through because they dont have the contracts to do a Melo deal. This is why they tried to involve Utah to part with AK47's expirer. The Nuggets had scouts at their early preseason games watching Favors, obviously he would be the center piece of any deal. The problem is that the Nuggets dont want to take on an expirer that costs them more money this season than keeping Melo. Not to mention Melo has never mentioned wanting to play for the Nets and there hasnt been any signs pointing him there. He wants to go to a major market and win with stars, there isn't any other star in New Jersey.


The Clippers are in the same boat, but it hasn't even been reported if they are interested anyways. You think Donald Sterling is going to pay Carmelo what he wants? Not to mention they dont have the contracts needed. Obviously they would have to give up Gordon & Aminu, but they would need to find a team to give Denver an expirer while parting with Kaman in the process for nothing. Do you think Melo wants to go to LA to play with an aging Baron Davis and Blake Griffin?

If the Bulls bought out Luol Deng, they would still owe him a majority of his salary over the duration of his contract. Do you know how NBA contracts work? Luol Deng isn't a bad player, but hes overpaid and they havent been able to find any team willing to take his salary off their hands. This was the main problem holding up any Noah/Nuggets deal. There isn't 1 team in the NBA who wants Deng at that price for 4 more years. Now they can't trade Noah, considering he just signed a 5 year extension. They were only even considering moving Noah due to him having crazy contract demands. So them being any sort of factor in a Melo deal came to an end.

Houston isn't a factor unless Melo wants to go there. With Yao's career basically over, I dont see any reason why he would go there.



Quote:
As for the cap space,we were the only team to have enough space to sign 2 max guys in the beginning of the offseason.You see how quick that changed.This dumb @$$ team out here where I'm @ was dumb enough to take on Kirk Hinrich's contract despite having Arenas and John Wall.

The cap space factor was irrelevant by the time the offseason began. We could've signed 2 big time players but Donnie didn't want to add 2 stars for the sake of doing it unless we got LeBron. Why do you think we didnt go after Joe Johnson or Carlos Boozer or even Chris Bosh?

The Bulls traded away Hinrich so they could sign Korver, Brewer, and Bogans. Looking back on it, they got caught up in Broussard's reports regarding LeBron.

But back to what I was saying previously, you can not compare this Melo situation to that of LeBron. LeBron was only rumored to be interested in NY as far back as 07/08 as we made plans to purge off the costly veterans who didnt fit. Thus beginning the talk of the summer of 2010. When we did so, so did multiple teams. We ended up competing with several teams, but we had nothing to show for ourselves except playing in New York. In the end, LeBron chose Miami due to having stars already in place. Heading into the summer of 2011, we dont have that competition. And we have something to show for with an established star player in Amare already in place as well as New York.

There is nothing we can do to get Melo via trade, so I dont understand why you keep talking about us sitting on our hands. If Denver wanted what we had, the deal would've been done during the summer. Basically the only option of him joining the Knicks would be during the summer, unless Melo gets dealt to 1 team, and then gets dealt to us before the deadline.

I'd rather we wait to see whatever happens.
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:19 PM   #20
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarcastic
It's 2 games into the season and Randolph hasn't even played yet. Gallo will get better. And besides, those guys haven't even started peaking yet. They are all like 21 and 23 years old.

Again, I am willing to give up 2 of them, but not all 3 for one player. It would be one thing if we had no leverage, but that is not the case. We don't have to give into Denver's demands. They are the ones who are on the lower ground. If the offseason comes and they have not moved him, they will be begging us to do a sign and trade for a second round pick.
Exactly.

When Denver actually has a legit trade partner for Melo, and Melo is open to signing an extension there then I could see our front office reacting in an inspired manner to find any way to get him to NY.

If we do trade some of those young guys(Randolph, Gallo, Chandler, Douglas) I'd rather it be for Chris Paul or Deron Williams. Having an Elite PG in this system is more crucial than adding another scorer in the frontcourt like Melo. That Elite PG makes everyone on the court better, and if we had those 2 scorers in the frontcourt he could make each guy even more dangerous.
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:41 PM   #21
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

The only difference here is the Nuggets getting Stojakovic instead of Chandler. If I'm Denver, I WANT Chandler.

Knicks are losing 4 players there to only recover 1. Someone else has to come to New York.
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Old 10-30-2010, 03:56 PM   #22
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

I'm hearing both sides, and I agree with the points of both sides.

I do think Walsh is looking to find a way to acquire Melo.

The only choice Denver has in this would be to take something or lose Melo for free.

I think it will go down like Amar'e.

A 5 year sign and trade to New York.

Denver gets a huge trade exception like PHX did.

I do think Melo wants to win, but wants the Knicks just as much.

But a gutted Knicks team with Melo, is no better than the team without him.

I think he comes in the summer.

But that doesn't mean just wait for him.

Like I said, I believe Walsh is working the phones.

Franchize BTW, you know just as much as we all do, that Melo cannot demand a trade, or say "I want to be a Knick."

But he can tell associates and friends that.

What they do with the info isn't tampering.
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Old 10-30-2010, 04:55 PM   #23
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Here I would be willing to do this if they want 3 players: trade Chandler, Randolph, and Landry Fields.

Let us keep Gallinari, and they are still coming away with some nice pieces that are cheap.
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Old 10-30-2010, 05:50 PM   #24
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarcastic
Here I would be willing to do this if they want 3 players: trade Chandler, Randolph, and Landry Fields.

Let us keep Gallinari, and they are still coming away with some nice pieces that are cheap.

Why are you so adamant about clutching Gallo??
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Old 10-30-2010, 06:46 PM   #25
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by knickscity
Why are you so adamant about clutching Gallo??

He is a great shooter and would be a good third option after Melo, and Amare.

I am willing to give him up, but not along with Chandler as well. I would give up Gallo + Randolph if that would get the job done, and honestly that is a very fair offer. Denver is not going to get 100 cents on the dollar for Melo.
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:03 PM   #26
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarcastic
He is a great shooter and would be a good third option after Melo, and Amare.

I am willing to give him up, but not along with Chandler as well. I would give up Gallo + Randolph if that would get the job done, and honestly that is a very fair offer. Denver is not going to get 100 cents on the dollar for Melo.

Just a little problem here.

Danilo Gallinari - SF
Carmelo Anthony - SF

Neither has the ability to defend a shooting guard. If you put either one of them at power forward we will be even worse at rebounding because we move STAT to center.

I'd rather keep Wilson, on the bench or in the starting lineup.
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Old 10-30-2010, 07:16 PM   #27
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

But that's my issue.

Gallo isn't a great shooter. And if he was he would be the second option.

Melo s a great shooter. Making him our possible second option.

A third option doesn't have to be great, but has to be consistent.

And that's not Gallo.
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Old 10-30-2010, 09:00 PM   #28
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

I am ok with giving up Gallinari too, as long as we can keep Chandler. I would give up one, but not both.
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Old 10-31-2010, 03:57 AM   #29
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by knickscity
But that's my issue.

Gallo isn't a great shooter. And if he was he would be the second option.

Melo s a great shooter. Making him our possible second option.

A third option doesn't have to be great, but has to be consistent.

And that's not Gallo.

If we got Melo he'd be our #1 option, with Amare as #2(1B).

Anyways I'd rather gut our team if it assembled Amare/Melo/CP3 and allowed us to use the MLE in the summer to attract some vets. Hopefully we still have young guys like Walker & Fields left if any deal went down.

I think that core with help can beat Miami.
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Old 10-31-2010, 06:11 AM   #30
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Default Re: A Carmelo Anthony trade thought

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowe
If we got Melo he'd be our #1 option, with Amare as #2(1B).

Anyways I'd rather gut our team if it assembled Amare/Melo/CP3 and allowed us to use the MLE in the summer to attract some vets. Hopefully we still have young guys like Walker & Fields left if any deal went down.

I think that core with help can beat Miami.


The ordering of superstar really doesn't matter.

Although Melo would be joining Amar'e.

Amar'e still is the better offensive option, but isn't doing it now because of the double and triple teams he is seeing.

Melo scores more.

I don't think that 3 beat the Heats 3 in a seven game series though.

But it wouldn't be a cakewalk either.
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