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Old 01-02-2011, 05:04 PM   #16
benJAMin
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SinJackal
I don't think Parker will continue to steal two a game, but he's made a conscious effort to get more steals (there are plenty of articles about it), so yes, I do think he will keep up his career year in steals.

Also, even if all 4 players were healthy, he loses far more than he gains with Dirk/Harden. I posted their averages thus far.

Also, you're using one argument but ignoring the one that goes the other way. Dirk has been shooting far above his career high in FG% (and it's been dropping slightly). Do you expect that to continue? His career high percentages? The only thing on Parker that's gonna drop is his steals, and that's only going to drop by maybe 0.2-0.3 a game at most (he's had 6 steals in his last 3 games, btw). Dirk's FG% is WAY above his normal average, and will absolutely drop by a significant amount. Right along with his PPG. And considering the trade took a lot of PPG away from him in the first place, that's not good news.

Meanwhile, for all the talk about Martin not being healthy, Dirk is the one who's injured now. Meanwhile Parker and Martin are still putting up big numbers.

So far, this was an awful trade. Let's see how the rest of the season pans out for him. I'll say it again. . .Dirk is the best player in the deal, but the combination of Parker/Martin is better than Dirk/Harden easily. Harden is basically what you'd pick up off waivers in a not so large league. Dirk doesn't make up for him. Parker is WAY better than Harden. Much bigger gap than Dirk over Martin.

Continuing to say things like "he's losing far more than gaining" or "this was an awful trade" or "the combination of Parker/Martin is better than Dirk/Harden easily" is simply statistically not true, evidenced again by BBM (which currently shows the OP taking a -0.05 numerical loss at this point). Using the OP's stat categories, Dirk is .11 better than KMart, and Parker is .16 better than Harden. Parker is not "WAY" better than Harden - you see that, right? It's not a "much bigger gap" than Dirk over KMart at all.

My timing couldn't have been poorer in calling out KMart while Dirk goes down no doubt, but I'll stand by my end of season predictions, including cumulative totals.
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Old 01-03-2011, 06:52 AM   #17
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

I haven't been following the entire thread, but I still think the Dirk/Harden side will win out by season's end.

Dirk is an elite player year after year, always consistent, and his current injury is really unusual for him. He'll likely come back and post similar numbers the rest of the way.

On the other hand, Kev-Mart will likely cool off at some point and is bound for an injury. I own him in several leagues and am trying to sell high on him right now. Parker's assists/steals are also higher than his career averages and I expect him to regress to his mean.
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Old 01-03-2011, 09:42 AM   #18
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

i say of worth of doings
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Old 01-12-2011, 07:40 PM   #19
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

First of all your team is very good I'm not sure how you got such a great team in a 14 person roster. Second, I think you made this trade just to make a trade, which is something you shouldn't necessarily do. As the people above said, Dirk is by far the best player in the trade, but James Harden is by far the worst player in the trade as well. As far as fantasy values go, Parker and Kevin Martin are more vital to a fantasy team than Dirk/Harden. Not to mention that Dirk has suffered the worst injury of his career, and has missed the most consecutive games of his career so there is no telling how good he will be the rest of the way. Harden is probably someone that you might even drop now that Durant is playing like an MVP again and consistently back in the lineup after early season injuries. I know you made the trade already so this doesnt mean much, but you're team is good enough where it might not hurt you all that much. Just for future advice, don't make trades just for names and evaluate all the intangibles before saying yes :)
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Old 01-13-2011, 10:28 AM   #20
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

keep them. martin is having a really good fantasy season. and parker kills harden
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Old 01-15-2011, 04:18 AM   #21
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

not close of trade man
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Old 01-22-2011, 04:32 AM   #22
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by benJAMin
Continuing to say things like "he's losing far more than gaining" or "this was an awful trade" or "the combination of Parker/Martin is better than Dirk/Harden easily" is simply statistically not true, evidenced again by BBM (which currently shows the OP taking a -0.05 numerical loss at this point). Using the OP's stat categories, Dirk is .11 better than KMart, and Parker is .16 better than Harden. Parker is not "WAY" better than Harden - you see that, right? It's not a "much bigger gap" than Dirk over KMart at all.

My timing couldn't have been poorer in calling out KMart while Dirk goes down no doubt, but I'll stand by my end of season predictions, including cumulative totals.

Do I need to bring up what each combination of players has done since he traded them?

He completely downgraded. And Dirk is STILL going to be troubled with that injury for AWHILE.

Meanwhile, Parker is 100% healthy, missing 0 games this year and never leaving a game for even a second due to injury. Martin has missed a grand total of 3 games this entire season, and is putting up the exact same averages he did when he traded him away. Parker is still averaging 1.5 steals and 7 assists a game, with a high FG% and has reportedly been working on his 3pt game at Pop's request by taking 200 threes every off day.. 3 in his last 3 makes in 4 attempts (last 3 games) since he began doing this.

Dirk: Was on the shelf for weeks, still troubled with injury. Harden is still little more than what you'd find on waivers depending on league size.


I hate to say I told you so. But I did. And Parker is certainly way better than Harden if the gap between Dirk and Martin, the player whom you say Dirk owns, is even bigger.

I compared their averages for you earlier. Other than rebounds, it's a downgrade pretty much across the board. So this .11 and .16 stuff you're talking about is deceptive. The Parker/Martin duo is much better, as I clearly pointed out to you earlier. He killed his assists and severely downgraded his points. Also, just as you're saying Martin's "been hot". . .it's been half a season. He hasn't "cooled off". Meanwhile, Dirk's FG% has been dropping as I said it would, and he hasn't even played 41 games yet. I guarantee it drops further by then. Meanwhile don't forget Parker's been scoring at a 52% rate this year too.

Also, Parker's last 4 games? 8 steals.

The more time that passes, the more right I'm looking.


I'm not even trying to just "be right", just trying to help you and the OP for future reference so you don't make bonehead mistakes like this in the future.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sportin_life
I haven't been following the entire thread, but I still think the Dirk/Harden side will win out by season's end.

Dirk is an elite player year after year, always consistent, and his current injury is really unusual for him. He'll likely come back and post similar numbers the rest of the way.

On the other hand, Kev-Mart will likely cool off at some point and is bound for an injury. I own him in several leagues and am trying to sell high on him right now. Parker's assists/steals are also higher than his career averages and I expect him to regress to his mean.

Disagreed about Parker. He will sustain his stats. They are increased because the Spurs' pace has increased. Parker is playing the exact same he always has. He's simply getting more chances at steals and assists now because the Spurs are playing faster and getting more possessions due to taking shots earlier in the shot clock and getting more transition buckets rather than grind it out the whole game.

Always go for players on high paced teams. Same as always go for players off the Rockies and Reds and Rangers when you need offense in MLB fantasy. Their hitters' ballparks lead to increased offensive stats.



Quote:
Originally Posted by lakeshow2011
First of all your team is very good I'm not sure how you got such a great team in a 14 person roster. Second, I think you made this trade just to make a trade, which is something you shouldn't necessarily do. As the people above said, Dirk is by far the best player in the trade, but James Harden is by far the worst player in the trade as well. As far as fantasy values go, Parker and Kevin Martin are more vital to a fantasy team than Dirk/Harden. Not to mention that Dirk has suffered the worst injury of his career, and has missed the most consecutive games of his career so there is no telling how good he will be the rest of the way. Harden is probably someone that you might even drop now that Durant is playing like an MVP again and consistently back in the lineup after early season injuries. I know you made the trade already so this doesnt mean much, but you're team is good enough where it might not hurt you all that much. Just for future advice, don't make trades just for names and evaluate all the intangibles before saying yes :)

This. Pretty much exactly what I was trying to say.
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Old 01-22-2011, 03:10 PM   #23
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

It looks like you put a lot of time into that post, with all those stats you've displayed both now and in the past. How about using the web to analyze some things for you and make it easier? BBM shows that the OP has still taken minimal losses despite Dirk missing games and Harden slumping, both according to averages and cumulative totals (-0.14). Feel free to use his league cats and plug it in yourself. With 40+ games to go (not to mention the jinx of Dirk missing an unprecedented amount of time behind me), I still stand by my predictions, and once again point out that, although you continue to reference some huge gap numerically, BBM doesnt lie. Rather than pointing out that posters in this forum are making "bonehead" moves, you should start using a tool like BBM to back up your statements.

There's no doubt that the Parker/Martin side have a slight statistical lead right now, and the last few weeks have definitely hurt my argument. Let's see how it all adds up after 82 games.
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Old 01-22-2011, 10:15 PM   #24
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Default Re: Dirk for Parker/Martin worth doing?

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Originally Posted by bladefd
Should I try to trade Deron Williams for somebody like Monta Ellis? He gives over 5 assists per game while being a better scorer. He doesn't shoot as high ft% of rebound as much or get as many assists as Williams. I know for sure that I am not winning the assists or ft% categories so should I try to improve my steals and scoring (+ he shoots a lot more than Deron so I expect him to make a higher volume of 3pt shots)?

Of course, I haven't made the offer yet but I have a feeling the other guy may do it. His worst categories are FTM, FT%, reb, and assists. He would improve all of that by acquiring Deron Williams. Of course, Deron Williams is the better player than Ellis so I would be taken a hit overall by improving my strengths and weakening my weaknesses.

No keep Deron Williams, he is one of the top PGs in the game and scores more efficiently than Monta Ellis. Deron is more consistent. I wouldn't trust Monta tooo much right now.
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