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Old 02-10-2011, 01:36 AM   #451
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
Gilbert himself is a dipshit for writing it. And the organization as whole is even more of a dipshit for letting him release it. A letter to the season ticket holders maybe, but they put it on the frontpage of cavs.com. And I loved that letter. The numerous reasons for him to feel the way he did are obvious, it still remains extremely, EXTREMELY unprofessional and childish to do what he did. Gilbert and the organization deserve to have that letter thrown in their faces.
I hated the letter (although I agreed with most of what was in it). My biggest gripe about it was that it took the spotlight off of James' attention-wh0ring extravaganza and shined it directly on Gilbert and the Cavs. It also gave those that give James' a free-pass for everything he does in life a reason to say, "look... Gilbert didn't treat James right and this proves it." (although the fact is, James got whatever he wanted, which ended up being a problem in what it created with the ego-monster, but played no part in his deciding to leave)

It was completely unprofessional and I said that from the start, although I understand why he was fuming (it was completely understandable). What I don't get was why someone in the Cavs' PR department didn't throw themselves in front of the man.

Yep, Gilbert was a dipsh!t for writing it and the Cavs were dipsh!ts for allowing him to release it. But, the people who continue to prop it up as some kind of serious manifesto are also dipsh!ts. It was clearly a letter written in absolute frustration that was meant to rally the city and not a serious prognostication.

Here was what Gilbert had to say to Cavs' season ticket-holders last month (via Windhorst's article on ESPN today):

Quote:
In a January letter to season-ticket holders (of which the Cavs still had more than 10,000 going into the season) asking them to renew their tickets, Gilbert was frank. The pain from July may have dulled, but the optimism from October is long gone.

"Now that 2011 has arrived, the mission ahead has become clear" that the team will have to rebuild.

"How long will it take?" Gilbert wrote. "You know I would be misleading you if I attempted to answer that question. The only honest answer is: As long as it takes."

The letter, like Gilbert's missive last July, was written in Comic Sans. The sense of humor is admirable -- the Cavs and their fans are going to need it.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:48 AM   #452
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

We're basically in agreement. And I realize the letter was written out of frustration and probably a good bit of despair. Which is even more reason the organization should be laughed at, I don't care if he's the owner and his word is God, someone needs to say no and consider longterm ramifications. It was a complete mishandling on every single level and gives further credence to my view that Lebron and his group of idiot cronies were running the organization. They ran a very good GM and coach out of town all because they wouldn't bow to Lebron's whims.

Lebron was running that asylum and Cleveland let him.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:07 AM   #453
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
Really, the Cavs being awful this season does not invalidate that particular comment. In fact, I would wager that it was more of a swipe at James than it was a statement about the Cavs' immediate future. It is still the onus of James to prove Gilbert wrong by winning a title... And he may not.

Also, anyone that took that letter seriously is a dipsh!t.

It doesn't invalidate any of the comments, it would just seem extremely stupid for him to make any such comments, heated or not, if he was then going to tank this season. And that was my whole point, all I'm saying is that I don't believe they are trying to tank. Of course it was more of a swipe at James, I completely agree with that, however, I didn't take the letter serious in the sense that I believed what he was saying, but on the other hand it was serious to him. I believe it wasn't just out of anger but also about passion for his team and the fans - I truly believe he cares about the team, the fans, and their success and that he in no way envisioned his team being this bad, even after he had cooled off.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:11 AM   #454
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspiredLebowski
We're basically in agreement. And I realize the letter was written out of frustration and probably a good bit of despair. Which is even more reason the organization should be laughed at, I don't care if he's the owner and his word is God, someone needs to say no and consider longterm ramifications. It was a complete mishandling on every single level and gives further credence to my view that Lebron and his group of idiot cronies were running the organization. They ran a very good GM and coach out of town all because they wouldn't bow to Lebron's whims.

Lebron was running that asylum and Cleveland let him.

I can't help but think that they were both babies in the situation. Lebron with his larger than life self, but at the same time Gilbert with the same kind of larger than life persona, where he goes all out like that and attacks James without taking a second to think about what he's saying and the possible consequences and handling of it. He instead just blurted out what ever he felt like a big angry baby, and as RedBlackAttack said it took alot of attention and anger off of what many felt was a d!ck move by Lebron. Both idiots in their own right. And unfortunately for Cavs right now, it is their team taking the worse end of the aftermath.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:18 AM   #455
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

Quote:
Originally Posted by yeaaaman
I can't help but think that they were both babies in the situation. Lebron with his larger than life self, but at the same time Gilbert with the same kind of larger than life persona, where he goes all out like that and attacks James without taking a second to think about what he's saying and the possible consequences and handling of it. He instead just blurted out what ever he felt like a big angry baby, and as RedBlackAttack said it took alot of attention and anger off of what many felt was a d!ck move by Lebron. Both idiots in their own right. And unfortunately for Cavs right now, it is their team taking the worse end of the aftermath.
The difference is, there was no reason for James to treat the Cavaliers organization or the fans the way that he did. Gilbert's reaction was stupid and short-sighted, but it was prompted by James' inexplicable actions.

Although I disagree with it, I can at least understand why Gilbert did what he did. There was a lot of pent up frustration and outrage from the way the James conducted himself for the previous few months.

What I still don't understand is why James did what he did, other than being a completely self-absorbed pr!ck.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:19 AM   #456
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

i see the knicks as the only team to lose twice to the cavs in the last 39-40 games, pathetic
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:40 AM   #457
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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The difference is, there was no reason for James to treat the Cavaliers organization or the fans the way that he did. Gilbert's reaction was stupid and short-sighted, but it was prompted by James' inexplicable actions.

Although I disagree with it, I can at least understand why Gilbert did what he did. There was a lot of pent up frustration and outrage from the way the James conducted himself for the previous few months.

What I still don't understand is why James did what he did, other than being a completely self-absorbed pr!ck.

Which is worse, meh whatever, still doesn't make either right, and when you're the one who comes out looking worse it never helps the cause.

As for why Lebron did what he did, I don't think theres much to understand that we don't already know. He's got a huge ego, I'm sure espn was jumping at and encouraging the opportunity, and then there was all the money he apparently raised for those children, which is always going to be the fall back excuse, that he "did it for charity".
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:49 AM   #458
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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Which is worse, meh whatever, still doesn't make either right, and when you're the one who comes out looking worse it never helps the cause.

As for why Lebron did what he did, I don't think theres much to understand that we don't already know. He's got a huge ego, I'm sure espn was jumping at and encouraging the opportunity, and then there was all the money he apparently raised for those children, which is always going to be the fall back excuse, that he "did it for charity".
I'm not even talking about strictly 'The Decision.' In fact, I can guarantee you that the show wasn't even what enraged Gilbert. The thing that probably drove Dan over the edge was that he tried to communicate with James for months and LeBron refused to even dignify his calls and texts with a response. Keep in mind that this was a kid that Gilbert bent over backwards for during his ownership, including building the nicest practice facility in the NBA just down the road from James' mansion in Bath Twp. (between Akron and Cleveland) to make things easier for him.

Then, two minutes before James went on-air with Jim Gray, he had one of his lackies call Gilbert and tell him that he was leaving. He didn't even make the call himself.

That was just atrocious form.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:55 AM   #459
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
I'm not even talking about strictly 'The Decision.' In fact, I can guarantee you that the show wasn't even what enraged Gilbert. The thing that probably drove Dan over the edge was that he tried to communicate with James for months and LeBron refused to even dignify his calls and texts with a response. Keep in mind that this was a kid that Gilbert bent over backwards for during his ownership, including building the nicest practice facility in the NBA just down the road from James' mansion in Bath Twp. (between Akron and Cleveland) to make things easier for him.

Then, two minutes before James went on-air with Jim Gray, he had one of his lackies call Gilbert and tell him that he was leaving. He didn't even make the call himself.

That was just atrocious form.

Yea pretty sh!tty of him no doubt. Oh well I guess he wasn't surprised by Lebron leaving if the guy wasn't responding to him for months. In any case, people are going to forget about this in large part thanks to Gilbert's rage infused letter, and the possible future success of the heat. All that really matters is that you guys remember, and make sure you let him know you'll never forget, other than that what can you do.
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Old 02-10-2011, 02:58 AM   #460
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

LeBron was pretty much done in Cleveland when they never could get him a 20-something player to be a legit no.2 option.

I heard they had a shot at Amare, but went the Jamison route instead. Big mistake.

They had 7 years, they should've known that was coming. "The Decision" might've been a mistake, but the actual decision itself was never going to be any different.

Play with DWade + Bosh on a Riley built team in South Beach versus ..... Cleveland.

C'mon Gilbert. They bought into all that "Jordan stayed in Chicago through all the losing" ... uh yeah he did. But give credit where it's due too ... fat ass Jerry Krause absolutely *killed* it in the 1987 draft by getting Horace Grant and then dealing for the no.5 pick (Scottie Pippen).

The Cavs never, ever made a move to build a core group around LeBron that was legit and around his own age. Guys in their mid/late 30s like Shaq and Jamison doesn't cut it.

To all small market teams that draft star players (and this even goes for the Clippers) ... as soon as you draft that player, you are on the clock. You need to work your ass off to acquire at least one very good *young* no.2 option for that star player to grow with. If you can't do that, say bye-bye to that player a few years down the line.

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Old 02-10-2011, 03:07 AM   #461
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

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LeBron was pretty much done in Cleveland when they never could get him a 20-something player to be a legit no.2 option.

I heard they had a shot at Amare, but went the Jamison route instead. Big mistake.

Why the f#ck do people keep perpetuating this myth? It is a well-known fact that Kerr made it clear to Ferry that Stoudemire was not going to be traded for what the Cavs had to offer. They waited until the last minute with the deal for Amar'e on the table and, when it was clear that it wasn't going to happen, they made basically the only other move that they could (Jamison).

This revisionist history has got to stop. Windhorst even referenced it in his article today. All you have to do is go back and re-read what was said by both sides during last year's deadline. It was Phoenix's call.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave
They had 7 years, they should've known that was coming. "The Decision" might've been a mistake, but the actual decision itself was never going to be any different.

Play with DWade + Bosh on a Riley built team in South Beach versus ..... Cleveland.

C'mon Gilbert.

Honestly? I never would have imagined that James would want to play with Wade. It never made any sense to me and I can't believe he made that call. I'm completely over James' decision to leave Cleveland. In fact, I've really embraced disliking the guy, because he isn't the kind of athlete that I would normally root for.

However, it makes me sick to see he and Wade out there taking turns isolating. It is such a massive waste and a real travesty, imo.

My gripe with James isn't leaving Cleveland. At this point, I feel like -- if he didn't want to be here -- I'm glad he's gone. However, the way that he went about the whole thing (not just 'The Decision'), his attitude in the ensuing months and his decision to play with Wade have really ramped up my disdain for the guy.

I call it the AAU-ification of the NBA and I think it is the worst thing that could have possibly happened.

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Old 02-10-2011, 03:20 AM   #462
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

Quote:
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C'mon Gilbert. They bought into all that "Jordan stayed in Chicago through all the losing" ... uh yeah he did. But give credit where it's due too ... fat ass Jerry Krause absolutely *killed* it in the 1987 draft by getting Horace Grant and then dealing for the no.5 pick (Scottie Pippen).

The Cavs never, ever made a move to build a core group around LeBron that was legit and around his own age. Guys in their mid/late 30s like Shaq and Jamison doesn't cut it.

To all small market teams that draft star players (and this even goes for the Clippers) ... as soon as you draft that player, you are on the clock. You need to work your ass off to acquire at least one very good *young* no.2 option for that star player to grow with. If you can't do that, say bye-bye to that player a few years down the line.

If you don't see the differences between what the Bulls FO was facing and what the Cavs' FO was facing, I don't know what to tell you. James made it absolutely clear to management that the only way he would considering re-signing in 2006 was if the Cavaliers showed that they were serious about 'winning now' by going out on the FA market and spending serious money.

That led to the awful Larry Hughes signing, who was not high on the Cavs' list, but basically the only marquee guy that was left on the market. Had they not signed Hughes, James would have probably not re-signed the first time.

Then, he continued his mantra of 'winning now,' which put the Cavs' FO in a serious bind and made them completely unable to build through the draft. They had to trade first round picks to take on bloated contracts of veterans in order to appease James, who was constantly threatening bolting.

Do you honestly think that James would have re-signed if the Cavs had done what the Heat did, which is unload core players, toil in mediocrity for years with their sights on signing big names in the 2010 class? James would have been gone long before they had a chance to make any move.

Guess what else? The Cavs' strategy *was* working. The team wasn't like the Miami Heat. They weren't drifting around the .500 mark. They were an absolutely elite team battling with championship-level teams. Hell, with James playing at about half-speed, the Cavs still went six games with an incredible Celtics team playing their best ball in years. They were also up 2-1 in the series and looked to have control before the team leader (and consequently the team) checked out, mentally.

Gilbert was put in a position by James to win now or lose him. He built a team that did win now... And James still left.

Maybe the most ironic thing of all is that I'm supposed to believe that the Cavs -- who won 60 games in back-to-back years -- had a FO that wasn't worthy of keeping James, but the Miami Heat, who had been pretty miserable up to 2010 and were simply cutting salary (it takes no skill to cut salary) deserved the greatest FA class in NBA history.

James' constant pressure on the FO to make moves for veterans to win now and his absolute refusal to commit to the franchise was a large part of the reason why they never built a traditional powerhouse around James through the draft or through young, up-and-coming FAs. They were backed into a corner and now they are really paying for the James years.

Last edited by RedBlackAttack : 02-10-2011 at 03:24 AM.
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:22 AM   #463
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

If they don't beat the Wizards, they'll prolly beat my Rockets
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:34 AM   #464
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

http://www.didthecavswinlastnight.com/
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:36 AM   #465
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Default Re: Clevelands losing streak has finally broken the record. Where does the losing end?

Cleveland needs to clone 2 LeBron James, and they probably would win the NBA Championship in the next 10 years.
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