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Old 06-23-2011, 03:01 AM   #121
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by Nastradamus
I like the draft rater by the way DD24, but it does miss on big men a lot , as it qualitfies in the article. Could be the case with THompson, who may not have a defined role. I need more O from my PF, especially paired with JJ.

Even Hollinger says the draft rater has it's flaws. It's not perfect but it does a good job. What it likes is a ton of data. So with the one and done guys it doesn't capture enough data, especially with someone like Kyrie Irving who was injured most the year and only played a few games.
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Old 06-23-2011, 03:40 AM   #122
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Rip for Chandler should have happened.....

So if we're predicting the future here, who's your pick for next year?

Haha, I'll go with an optimistic pick...

Selecting 15th overall (not too optimistic) the Detroit Pistons select Jeremy Lamb from the University of Connecticut.

UConn player? Check. Huge wingspan? Check. Rail thin? Check. How could Joe resist?

Stuckey - Lamb - Daye - Thompson - Monroe
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Old 06-23-2011, 10:36 AM   #123
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by Kombo
Haha, I'll go with an optimistic pick...

Selecting 15th overall (not too optimistic) the Detroit Pistons select Jeremy Lamb from the University of Connecticut.

UConn player? Check. Huge wingspan? Check. Rail thin? Check. How could Joe resist?

Stuckey - Lamb - Daye - Thompson - Monroe

Lamb is a good guess. He was smart to stay in school one more year. It's likely he could even be a lottery pick next year. At first this year he would have been a 2nd rounder, but when everyone pulled out of the draft he probably would've been a late 1st rounder.

There's so much size next year in the draft. I forgot about how much there is. I'd almost rather just go after a PG this year now. Anyhow, I think Detroit will be in the lottery again next year. If we don't see Hamilton get traded today I don't think it will happen before the deadline, and I don't see us getting an impact player in the draft that's going to turn things around. I think the team is slightly better than the level they performed at but I still forsee a pick around 10.

A PG like Marquis Teague could be available around then. Depending on Duke's season a big guy like Mason Plumlee could be anywhere from 10-20. We already were looking at Terrence Jones this year so I think next year he'll be in the mix. Tyler Zeller and John Henson should both be there too. Austin Rivers could be in the mix. I want to see if he's more of a PG or SG in college. Something tells me it's more of a SG so I'm not sure how well his game will translate to the NBA because he's undersized for that position. There's going to have to be some PG's that have their stock rise next year. Who that is I'm not sure yet, but right now it looks like everybody in the NBA will be drafting SF, PF's or C's... haha. Teague might be a nice fit here though, another one of those Calipari PG's. He supposed to be better than Brandon Knight....
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Old 06-23-2011, 12:55 PM   #124
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by dd24
Lamb is a good guess. He was smart to stay in school one more year. It's likely he could even be a lottery pick next year. At first this year he would have been a 2nd rounder, but when everyone pulled out of the draft he probably would've been a late 1st rounder.

There's so much size next year in the draft. I forgot about how much there is. I'd almost rather just go after a PG this year now. Anyhow, I think Detroit will be in the lottery again next year. If we don't see Hamilton get traded today I don't think it will happen before the deadline, and I don't see us getting an impact player in the draft that's going to turn things around. I think the team is slightly better than the level they performed at but I still forsee a pick around 10.

A PG like Marquis Teague could be available around then. Depending on Duke's season a big guy like Mason Plumlee could be anywhere from 10-20. We already were looking at Terrence Jones this year so I think next year he'll be in the mix. Tyler Zeller and John Henson should both be there too. Austin Rivers could be in the mix. I want to see if he's more of a PG or SG in college. Something tells me it's more of a SG so I'm not sure how well his game will translate to the NBA because he's undersized for that position. There's going to have to be some PG's that have their stock rise next year. Who that is I'm not sure yet, but right now it looks like everybody in the NBA will be drafting SF, PF's or C's... haha. Teague might be a nice fit here though, another one of those Calipari PG's. He supposed to be better than Brandon Knight....


Lol I just went to NBADraft.net to look at their 2012 mock. They have Detroit taking Lamb, that makes me feel wildly uncreative now.

I haven't paid too much attention to the HS class that is incoming. So I just went with a guy who seemed to be rising at the end of last year.

Next year should be pretty good though as you have what? 5 or so guys that should have been in this years draft that should go in the lottery next year? At least Barnes, Sullinger and Perry Jones.
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:45 PM   #125
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

Bobcats just thumped ahead of us with the three team trade.

Does this change who might be left at #8?

I think this also stops us from getting a center. Kwame Brown and Diaw front court isn't going to cut it.

I see them going Kanter (super outside shot), Valanciunas, and if these guys aren't around then taking Kemba. Kemba could bring some excitement to a team with potentially the most boring roster in the league.
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:59 PM   #126
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by Kombo
Lol I just went to NBADraft.net to look at their 2012 mock. They have Detroit taking Lamb, that makes me feel wildly uncreative now.

I haven't paid too much attention to the HS class that is incoming. So I just went with a guy who seemed to be rising at the end of last year.

Next year should be pretty good though as you have what? 5 or so guys that should have been in this years draft that should go in the lottery next year? At least Barnes, Sullinger and Perry Jones.

I do really like those guys that pulled out of the draft this year. I think it will be nice to have another year in college to evaluate them too. I think there's a lot of talent with the freshman coming in but I don't like their size. So I think they'll be really good in college but I question how some of their games will translate. A 6'5" or 6'6" small forward just isn't what I want on my NBA team. I think a SF should be 6'8" - 6'9". Also there's a lot of 6'9" PF's. You guys know how I feel about those in the NBA, lol. I'll take one for a nice rotation player off the bench but it's near impossible to build a front court around one. Ask the Chicago Bulls about that..... When I look that the PF's who have a chance to win a title (Dirk, Gasol, Amare, Garnett, Bosh, etc) they're all bigger and taller. Size matters. That's why a guy like Anthony Davis projects to be so high next year. Of course he needs to put on some weight to be effective in the NBA too.... He's built a little too much like Austin Daye right now, just with a better post up game and less range. I like a guy like Quincy Miller (who's a freshman) but I think he'll go higher than what the Pistons will have for a pick. Michael Gilchrest can score the ball but this goes back to my size issue.... he's only 6'7" and he's a SF. It's borderline. I just don't see him matching up well against guys like Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Paul Pierce, etc. Not that a lot of people do but at least a guy like Prince is long enough to give those people troubles. Anway the freshman I do like I think will get drafted before the Pistons will have a pick. I think we'll end up being around 7-10 again.
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Old 06-23-2011, 06:09 PM   #127
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by Kombo
Bobcats just thumped ahead of us with the three team trade.

Does this change who might be left at #8?

I think this also stops us from getting a center. Kwame Brown and Diaw front court isn't going to cut it.

I see them going Kanter (super outside shot), Valanciunas, and if these guys aren't around then taking Kemba. Kemba could bring some excitement to a team with potentially the most boring roster in the league.

I like the trade for Milwaukee. Stephen Jackson is more talented than anybody they would have received in this draft. Him, Jennings, and Bogut is a nice core.

I hate the trade for us because that means there no chance of Kanter or Valanciunas falling to us. Of course, most people think Utah is actually going to select Kanter now, which means Cleveland will select Valanciunas with the #4 pick. I think that means the Bobcats probably wanted Biyombo. I'm cool with picking Thompson but at #8 it's a touch high. I think it's in our best interest to trade down now. All we're ending up with is a rotational guy anyhow. May as well stock up on them so we have some more trade pieces that someone might like to go along with Rip.....
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Old 06-23-2011, 06:17 PM   #128
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by dd24
I do really like those guys that pulled out of the draft this year. I think it will be nice to have another year in college to evaluate them too. I think there's a lot of talent with the freshman coming in but I don't like their size. So I think they'll be really good in college but I question how some of their games will translate. A 6'5" or 6'6" small forward just isn't what I want on my NBA team. I think a SF should be 6'8" - 6'9". Also there's a lot of 6'9" PF's. You guys know how I feel about those in the NBA, lol. I'll take one for a nice rotation player off the bench but it's near impossible to build a front court around one. Ask the Chicago Bulls about that..... When I look that the PF's who have a chance to win a title (Dirk, Gasol, Amare, Garnett, Bosh, etc) they're all bigger and taller. Size matters. That's why a guy like Anthony Davis projects to be so high next year. Of course he needs to put on some weight to be effective in the NBA too.... He's built a little too much like Austin Daye right now, just with a better post up game and less range. I like a guy like Quincy Miller (who's a freshman) but I think he'll go higher than what the Pistons will have for a pick. Michael Gilchrest can score the ball but this goes back to my size issue.... he's only 6'7" and he's a SF. It's borderline. I just don't see him matching up well against guys like Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Paul Pierce, etc. Not that a lot of people do but at least a guy like Prince is long enough to give those people troubles. Anway the freshman I do like I think will get drafted before the Pistons will have a pick. I think we'll end up being around 7-10 again.

I think I'm overly sympathetic to height most the time. If I had a team, I'd be very comfortable the the Marion's and Gerald Wallace's getting most their minutes at the 4 and Iggy getting his time at the 3 instead of the 2. I wouldn't even want to try Derrick Williams at the 3. Ironically, I don't like small guards (besides Thomas, Joe D and Vinnie of course :P ).

I think my disdain for small guards is that I don't like guys littler than me having so much success when I use height as my coping mechanize for not being a star SF or NFL Quarterback lol...
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Old 06-23-2011, 06:22 PM   #129
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by dd24
I like the trade for Milwaukee. Stephen Jackson is more talented than anybody they would have received in this draft. Him, Jennings, and Bogut is a nice core.

I hate the trade for us because that means there no chance of Kanter or Valanciunas falling to us. Of course, most people think Utah is actually going to select Kanter now, which means Cleveland will select Valanciunas with the #4 pick. I think that means the Bobcats probably wanted Biyombo. I'm cool with picking Thompson but at #8 it's a touch high. I think it's in our best interest to trade down now. All we're ending up with is a rotational guy anyhow. May as well stock up on them so we have some more trade pieces that someone might like to go along with Rip.....

I think that would be ideal. I mean if the Houston trade works out, who wouldn't prefer any combo of say Donatas Motiejunas, Alec Burks, Jordan Hamilton, Kenneth Faried, etc. over simply Thompson just to throw some names out there.
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Old 06-23-2011, 06:47 PM   #130
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

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Originally Posted by Kombo
I think I'm overly sympathetic to height most the time. If I had a team, I'd be very comfortable the the Marion's and Gerald Wallace's getting most their minutes at the 4 and Iggy getting his time at the 3 instead of the 2. I wouldn't even want to try Derrick Williams at the 3. Ironically, I don't like small guards (besides Thomas, Joe D and Vinnie of course :P ).

I think my disdain for small guards is that I don't like guys littler than me having so much success when I use height as my coping mechanize for not being a star SF or NFL Quarterback lol...

I've actually always like Marion's game. Mainly because he's been such a versatile defender and he hasn't always got the credit he's deserved for it. The thing with him is he's a situational guy now. He's not a full time starter. It really depends on the team they play. He was perfect for that Miami series because they don't have a big man in the middle. So Miami tried to go small ball but the problem is Dallas could do that too. It made so Marion could guard James which is a pretty good matchup. As long as Marion was a starter getting big time minutes he never could get a ring though. I expect the same from Gerald Wallace. They're really good players. I don't want to make anyone think that I think they aren't. It's just when you're putting together a championship team you need big PF's and length in the middle. Look at the difference having Haywood and Chandler in the middle changed things for Dallas. Oh, and they have a 7' PF. Same for the Lakers. A 7' PF and a 7' C. Pretty much the same story for the Celtics. KG and Perkins. If we look back at the Spurs when they were good it was Duncan and a 7' footer next to him. Even if we look at the year the Pistons won it, they had Rasheed at 7', Okur (7'), and Wallace who was 7' with the fro, lol. Big Ben is about the one exception but he really did D up like a true 7 footer. So whenever I look to build a championship team I want a solid PF around 6'10 to 7'. Monroe fits that for us. We need a 7' center. Valanciunus is a guy with a solid back to the basket game who has the frame to put on a bit more muscle. I think he's going to be really solid. I need a SF who can match up with the guys I talked about before. I like my PG to be about 6'3" but with the rules today I'd take a guy who is 6'1" and a special player like a Chris Paul type. SG I think you have to be 6'6" or 6'7". I look at how Rip just used to give people fits with his length. It's how we used to be able to beat up on the Magic and Heat back in the day. Wade was short and Orlando always had a small back court. I look at how Kobe does that same thing to people, or Ray Allen (both at 6'6"). This year was an odd one just because of the matchup with two teams that had small back courts. Wade is the one exception in the league to me at SG, at least as far as offense from an undersized standpoint. He still doesn't play good D as far as I'm concerned. Terry wouldn't have had the success he did against a team with a SG that could D up. That's why when I look at Stuckey playing SG it scares me. He just isn't going to be a guy who can lead a team to a championship at that position. He's not Dwayne Wade. He's a really poor mans D-Wade. He doesn't shoot the lights out from outside like Terry so he can't even be the guy who comes off the bench to hit those outside shots when the big men get double teamed. But at PG he gives opposing teams PG's fits when he's guarding them. He can penetrate and create. The problem with this is since he's the only one on the team that can he's needed to carry the scoring load, rather than distribute the ball. That's given him a bad name. In a perfect world we would have never got BG, Rip wouldn't have been injured, and we would have had a solid back court with Rip and Stuckey and there wouldn't have been any drama......

Overall I look at championship teams and they pretty much all seem to have guys at that height at each position. There's a few that obviously are built slightly different but those are also just freak of nature type guys who don't come around often.
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Old 06-23-2011, 09:29 PM   #131
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

I was a bit disappointed when Valanciunas didn't slip down but once Knight did I was elated. I quit considering him as the pick a while ago when it appeared he was a top 5 lock. I knew the talent in this draft was at PG too. Like I mentioned before, next year there isn't much for PG's. This year is a good year to select one and then go big next year. Heck I was talking about Walker or Fredette falling.... I think this definitely means there will be changes in the back court in Detroit. Obviously we can quit wondering about Terrico White. We've got Knight, Stuckey, Bynum, Hamilton, and BG so White wouldn't see any chance of cracking the lineup. I would think Hamilton or BG has to go. Maybe they let Stuckey walk but I doubt it. They tendered his contract so I think he'll stay. Stuckey is a bit under sized for SG but a Knight/Stuckey back court is definitely an upgrade. Knight has all kinds of potential so I'm crossing my fingers.
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Old 06-23-2011, 10:39 PM   #132
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

How did we not just take Jeremy Tyler? We need a big man..... now we have another guy who plays the same position as Daye and Jerebko..... I'm very disappointed in that one. It's not that I don't like Singler. It's just where is this guy supposed to fit in? I would have rolled the dice on a true C.
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Old 06-23-2011, 11:36 PM   #133
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

Wow, Brandon Knight. Did not expect him to be there at all. We now have a go to guy in the 4th.

This makes me want to resign Stuckey even more. If BG can find his groove again, Knight-Stuckey-Gordon rotation with some Bynum could be deadly.

I'm not overly excited about Singler. If I was drafting in the second round I'd take a big just about everytime. Chances of them working out is so low, if they do work out I'd rather get a big that can give me 15 a game than a SF. Could be worse though.
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Old 06-24-2011, 12:56 AM   #134
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I like that we have our future PG. I'm not sure a back court of Knight/Stuckey or Knight/BG is ideal though. It'll work for the time being. People are now saying since Utah has so many bigs and we have so many guards a Milsap for Rip trade makes sense. Milsap is a hard working gritty kind of guy that Detroit would like. I don't forsee winning any titles with a starting lineup of Knight, Stuckey, Prince, Milsap, Monroe. That sounds like an above average team that will kind of get stuck there for a while.

I don't think Singler will make the team. He'll be in the D-league or overseas. Unless both T-Mac and Prince leave, which with their selections it doesn't seem like they expect that. It seems like Dumars is banking on resigning Prince at this point.

I completely agree about going big in the 2nd round. Tyler was there just like I've wanted all along. That really let me down. I would've been so happy with Knight and Tyler. Nonetheless, I'm really happy Knight slipped down to us. We've lucked out the last two years.
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Old 06-24-2011, 01:18 AM   #135
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Default Re: Piston draft prospects

Gotta say I like Knight. I had a feeling Biyombo might go in front of us. A lot of teams were trying to downgrade him late IMO. I think Toronto would have snagged him if Cleveland had gone Valanciunas.

I love the idea of Knight and Stuckey in a backcourt. One of Rip or Gordon has to go as soon as possible. Rip for some size in the backcourt would probably be ideal.

I don't love Singler admittedly, but getting a guy who is likely to have some sort of NBA career at 33 isn't so bad. Tyler would have been interesting, but he clearly wasn't as intriguing as some of us thought. I think Honeycutt would have been a STEAL though. Too bad they didn't go for him.

I love the idea of Ben for Jefferson. Both are bad contracts for their respective teams at overcrowded positions. Utah too Burks, but he is a SG/SF hybrid IMO and can't shoot a lick. Ben would be a nice compliment off the bench.

I have always expected Tmac and Prince to both leave, but we don't really have a SF so Prince could be brought back after all. I hope not though. Give Daye the minutes, pick up a veteran back up and sprinkle in some Jerebko and maybe Rip. Something like Maxiell for Dahntay Jones would make me happy. Get a SF with some D skills and clear up our bad PF logjam. I wouldn't expect much impact from a guy like Jones or anything.

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