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Old 05-11-2011, 10:52 AM   #1
Rameek
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Default NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Quote:
BERMAN: Knicks' duo isn't as 'super' as Heat's

LeBron James and Dwyane Wade showed Monday night in Boston what “superstars’’ do.

They don’t just dominate on one side of the ball. They have a presence on both ends.

Forget James’ 35 points and Wade’s 28. The Heat's superstar tandem was all over the court Monday night in their massive 98-90 overtime victory over the Celtics: defending, rebounding, knocking balls away.

James collected 14 boards, many of them difficult, and three steals. Wade snatched nine boards on a club that has no legit center, just like the Knicks. But the duo willed Miami to a great win on the road, with Chris Bosh playing a supporting role.

We too easily throw out the word “superstar’’ to describe the NBA’s elite players. On Twitter Monday, I noted that with the announcement of the two All-Defensive Teams, 43 players received at least one vote. Not one Knicks player did, however. Not Carmelo Anthony. Not Amar’e Stoudemire. Not Chauncey Billups.

I classified Anthony and Stoudemire as Grade A stars, but falling just short of “superstar’’ status. They just don’t do it on both ends like James, Wade, and even Chris Paul, a second-team All-Defense selection. Dwight Howard, Derrick Rose, Kobe Bryant and Kevin Durant also made my “superstar’’ list, with Dirk Nowitzki on the bubble.

Anthony is a super scorer and he had some genuinely solid nights on the defensive end with the Knicks. Just not enough. You don’t notice him like you notice James, Wade and Bryant bearing down to defend, creating havoc. And though everyone wants to remember Anthony's courageous night in Game 2 in Boston, he shot 37 percent in the series and the Knicks were the only team to get swept in the first round.

After the series, Knicks coach Mike D'Antoni said Anthony's next step is to become a triple-double threat each night.

Stoudemire can block shots now and again, but that’s the only time you notice him on the defensive end. He should be a much better rebounder. Some scouts feel he never learned the fundamentals coming straight to the NBA out of high school.

Anthony and Stoudemire have become “superstars’’ as far as their celebrity status, with appearances on the national talk shows from Letterman to Lopez. Stoudemire gets a spread in Vogue. Anthony, who's made it out of the first round once, and his celebrity wife, La La Vazquez, get on “The View.’’

But Monday night in Boston you saw the difference. You saw two basketball “superstars’’ strut their stuff in the ways it takes to win a gritty playoff game on the road against a champion.

’Melo and Amar’e still aren’t there yet.

http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/knicks...CdlaNxg 1HDzJ

You all know I totally agree with this. I dont think Melo nor Stat are superstars.

What are your impressions?
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Old 05-11-2011, 12:03 PM   #2
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Completely right. Their not superstar status. Their good players. Amare with his size should grab rebounds, and be aggrassive like Dwight. Why would Amare be considered trade bait? Because we don't need two big men doing the same role. If he can rebound and play defense maybe we can fill other positions up.
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Old 05-11-2011, 12:45 PM   #3
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Durant made a superstar status but Melo isn't even though Melo has more rebounds and assists on a same shooting percentage.
Also Durant doesn't play any better defense than Melo.

This is a joke.

I also think Kobe isn't any better than Melo right now.Maybe you will disagree with me but I think Melo is more complete player than Kobe right now.
1st all-defensive team my ass.
His defense is the most overrated thing that I have ever seen.

Rose better than Melo ? Also very debatable.

I agree that Wade,LeBron and Dwight are real superstars,but Kobe and Durant aren't any better than Melo now.

Last edited by Clutch : 05-11-2011 at 12:49 PM.
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Old 05-11-2011, 01:43 PM   #4
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Articles like this really amaze me.

It would take Berman to state the obvious....

LeBron and Wade are the two of the five best in the game.

But it isn't just because of them alone.

They have always been in a situation where playing defense is a must, especially wade being under Riley's ingrained system.

LeBron also had one of the best minds on defense in Mike Brown for most of his career, and now has Riley's protege in Spo.

To see these guys perform isn't by accident.

I have met Berman personally, and like I said to him in his face.."He don't know shit, he's a hypocrite".

I had a thirty minute conversation at the Garden, back in 2007 with him, and later with Alan Hahn, while doing my tour assignment.

It was a game against the Mavs and Berman told me personally he thought Dirk was a superstar because of his uncanny scoring ability.

I specifically asked him "don't you want you superstar to do more than that?"

His answer was, "when you score like he does, he doesn't have to do anything else.".

I was literally like "wow".

I then asked him what does he call LeBron and Kobe then?

He said "another level".

Of course we discussed further which I can't put on here, but I told him he really needs to watch the games more and take the blinders off.

Of course the conversation didn't end on a positive note, but Alan Hahn and myself had a great conversation.

Bottom line though......

Melo is a superstar, Amar'e isn't.

But not for the reasons that Berman gave.

The attention they bring to any teams defense is all that needs to be seen.

Melo has shown he can only be contained when the opponents entire team channels their defense towards him, and even then it may not work.

That is a superstar to me.

Amar'e not so much, put a big on him that will lean and be willing to sacrifice his body and Amar'e can be easily taken out of his game.

That is a very good player, maybe elite, but not superstar.

But both players haven't had the luxury of playing for a coach or system that has anything remote to a defensive scheme at all, and I can't knock them for that.

If Berman thinks that Kevin Durant is a superstar, then no way he can say Melo isn't with a straight face.

No different with Dirk over Amar'e, although I don't think either is.

There is a difference to being the best in the game and being superstars.

LeBron and Wade are both.
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Old 05-11-2011, 04:00 PM   #5
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

If your nitpicking because players aren't James and Wade...yea you're right. But then again who is?You could very well make a case that they are the 2 best players in the game.(I have LeBron tied for second and Wade about 4th).I think Melo's performance versus arguably the best defensive team in the league (The Celtics) cements him now as a superstar.Say what you will about the popular rhetoric regarding Melo's defense but you have to admit he stepped up his defense in big games and his rebounding has been impressive. He also showed that he is probably the most unstoppable scorer in the league.

Amare isn't a superstar but he is a star and undoubtedly the one of the best pf in the league.He can compete at a high level with any player in the league and despite his defensive woes,is just as talented.

Therefore,both players are certainly considerations, if not locks, in anyone's top 10.At the end of the day,everyone can't get the best player in the league.What's worst is the Golden Girls decided to team up which makes the odds even less.So Knickscity is right,it's a ridiculous yet obvious statement. Thank you captian obvious for pointing out the fact that we don't have those guys but neither do 28 other teams.
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Old 05-12-2011, 01:34 AM   #6
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

I think this article is spot on and I really hope Amare and Melo take note that if they want to ranked amongst the games elite they have got to improve their defence.

I haven't seen heaps of Melo before this year but he gives the impression of someone who thinks his talent alone is enough, he lacks that intensity and will that Kobe and KG epitomise and that James and Wade have shown against the Celtics.

I would love to see the Knicks bring Ewing back as a coach so he could sit them down and tell them how much it hurts to have fallen just short.
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Old 05-12-2011, 01:51 AM   #7
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrich2000
I think this article is spot on and I really hope Amare and Melo take note that if they want to ranked amongst the games elite they have got to improve their defence.

I haven't seen heaps of Melo before this year but he gives the impression of someone who thinks his talent alone is enough, he lacks that intensity and will that Kobe and KG epitomise and that James and Wade have shown against the Celtics.

I would love to see the Knicks bring Ewing back as a coach so he could sit them down and tell them how much it hurts to have fallen just short.
I'm calling bull on this.

All of KG's intensity didn't get him a ring as that guy, or even out the first round until he had TALENT around him.

I don't recall Kobe winning when Smush Parker was his backcourt mate either.

Bottom line...you have to have talent around the star players to win

I truly feel Amar'e should have at least made the finals 1 of those years.

Melo never had the chance to be in a winning situation.
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Old 05-12-2011, 04:31 AM   #8
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Quote:
Originally Posted by knickscity
I'm calling bull on this.

All of KG's intensity didn't get him a ring as that guy, or even out the first round until he had TALENT around him.

I don't recall Kobe winning when Smush Parker was his backcourt mate either.

Bottom line...you have to have talent around the star players to win

I truly feel Amar'e should have at least made the finals 1 of those years.

Melo never had the chance to be in a winning situation.

Yeah obviously that intensity alone doesn't win you a championship, that's not what I said.
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Old 05-12-2011, 10:07 AM   #9
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

My thing is when did it become bad to get two of the best players in the world? I think the sports media is part of the reason why the NBA isn't the most popular sport in the league.They overglorify roleplayers and bums and overcriticize the stars.It would have been more popular for the Knicks to stick with tryna make Gallinari and Chandler a dynamic duo while we hover around the 7th seed every year.That's sad.

NBA media loves mediocrity.Why? Well look closely...half of the analyst were just that in their playing career. Tim Legler,Greg Anthony,Jon Barry,Kenny Smith,Brent Barry,Brevin Knight, Eric Snow,Dennis Scott etc. These guys make me nauseous with their hour long speeches about players doing the little things and praising guys like Rajon Rondo and Kendrick Perkins.End of the day,it's about talent and cohesion.The Knicks of last year didn't have enough talent so it didn't matter how long they'd been together.PPL want to point out that guys liek Melo haven't won anything.What about the fact that theres only been one team that one a ring in the last 20 years that didn't have a big time star on it. The Detroit Pistons.N I still say the only reason they won is because Shaq n Kobe were fueding.

It's time to put the focus back on the players that impact they game the most.Im not saying overlook "the little things" but let's not underappreciate the BIG THINGS...like the fact that we now have 2 players that on any given night can get you 30 and possibly 40.Let's also not forget that we can go out and sign yet another superstar OR stack our team with incredible depth. To some my rant up,let's stop acting like having two of the best players in the NBA is a liability.
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Old 05-12-2011, 01:56 PM   #10
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
My thing is when did it become bad to get two of the best players in the world? I think the sports media is part of the reason why the NBA isn't the most popular sport in the league.They overglorify roleplayers and bums and overcriticize the stars.It would have been more popular for the Knicks to stick with tryna make Gallinari and Chandler a dynamic duo while we hover around the 7th seed every year.That's sad.

NBA media loves mediocrity.Why? Well look closely...half of the analyst were just that in their playing career. Tim Legler,Greg Anthony,Jon Barry,Kenny Smith,Brent Barry,Brevin Knight, Eric Snow,Dennis Scott etc. These guys make me nauseous with their hour long speeches about players doing the little things and praising guys like Rajon Rondo and Kendrick Perkins.End of the day,it's about talent and cohesion.The Knicks of last year didn't have enough talent so it didn't matter how long they'd been together.PPL want to point out that guys liek Melo haven't won anything.What about the fact that theres only been one team that one a ring in the last 20 years that didn't have a big time star on it. The Detroit Pistons.N I still say the only reason they won is because Shaq n Kobe were fueding.

It's time to put the focus back on the players that impact they game the most.Im not saying overlook "the little things" but let's not underappreciate the BIG THINGS...like the fact that we now have 2 players that on any given night can get you 30 and possibly 40.Let's also not forget that we can go out and sign yet another superstar OR stack our team with incredible depth. To some my rant up,let's stop acting like having two of the best players in the NBA is a liability.


Great post.
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Old 05-12-2011, 08:55 PM   #11
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Why thank you
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Old 05-12-2011, 11:25 PM   #12
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
My thing is when did it become bad to get two of the best players in the world? I think the sports media is part of the reason why the NBA isn't the most popular sport in the league.They overglorify roleplayers and bums and overcriticize the stars.It would have been more popular for the Knicks to stick with tryna make Gallinari and Chandler a dynamic duo while we hover around the 7th seed every year.That's sad.

NBA media loves mediocrity.Why? Well look closely...half of the analyst were just that in their playing career. Tim Legler,Greg Anthony,Jon Barry,Kenny Smith,Brent Barry,Brevin Knight, Eric Snow,Dennis Scott etc. These guys make me nauseous with their hour long speeches about players doing the little things and praising guys like Rajon Rondo and Kendrick Perkins.End of the day,it's about talent and cohesion.The Knicks of last year didn't have enough talent so it didn't matter how long they'd been together.PPL want to point out that guys liek Melo haven't won anything.What about the fact that theres only been one team that one a ring in the last 20 years that didn't have a big time star on it. The Detroit Pistons.N I still say the only reason they won is because Shaq n Kobe were fueding.

It's time to put the focus back on the players that impact they game the most.Im not saying overlook "the little things" but let's not underappreciate the BIG THINGS...like the fact that we now have 2 players that on any given night can get you 30 and possibly 40.Let's also not forget that we can go out and sign yet another superstar OR stack our team with incredible depth. To some my rant up,let's stop acting like having two of the best players in the NBA is a liability.

You are right and there has been plenty of media making the argument you rightly criticise, but the article posted above doesn't argue that. In fact the article is premised on the idea that Amare and Melo could be as good as Wade and James and they could take the Knicks to the elite level, but to do that they need to improve their defense.
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Old 05-13-2011, 02:10 AM   #13
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

Or just sign Dwight.
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Old 05-13-2011, 08:24 AM   #14
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

its funny how when a player who used to be regaurded as elite status superstar joins the knicks, media suddenly shoots em down to a lower status.

if melo went to like another team not named the knicks, melo would not have to read about this bullshit.
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Old 05-13-2011, 11:11 AM   #15
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Default Re: NY Knicks Duo isnt that SUPER

I agree.Furthermore,maybe Melo not being LeBron is a good thing.Sure LeBron is better but what it we couldn't get a 3rd star here?Maybe it's good that we dont have the guy who runs away from challenges and needs a slaughter allstar team to win.Remember my old quote "If you can't beat em'...Bron em'!"
I'm not saying Melo is better but not only am I completely over us not getting LeBron,I actually liek having Melo around more.Him and Amare are so much more fun to watch on and off the court.LeBron james is probably the best player in the game right now but you know what...he's a sissy and a narcissistic asshole.F all three of em'.One thing we did win with was getting Amare instead of Bosh.Originally it seemed like Bosh would be the better choice but we clearly saw this year who can change a game and who takes a back seat.
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