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Old 07-10-2011, 02:57 PM   #16
Blue&Orange
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
The logic behind locking players out is that when these guys aren't making any money they will capitulate just for the sake of earning a paycheck again. Especially some of these guys with fleets of luxury cars getting bottle service in the VIP every night with pet tigers and other such bullshit. If players are earning money during the lockout the Union will be able to hold out longer and thus get a better deal if the owners are truly willing to kill a season. You actually have it backwards: the more players that are willing to go overseas, the better it is for the NBPA because it shows the owners that they aren't the only option, that they have to compete for the services of the best players in the world.

Players look greedy? Lockouts/strikes always make both players as well as owners look greedy, why is a guy finding another job when his current employer won't let him work make him look any worse? Barely anyone will see things that way. When a lockout happens the players owe their teams that refuse to let them train/practice/play at their facilities and more importantly, aren't paying them any money in spite of their contracts, no loyalty whatsoever. It's for the individual player to decide whether or not he's willing to play in a different league. Williams isn't a bad guy for going to Turkey just like STAT isn't a bad guy for his decision to stay exclusive to the Knicks. It's not a moral decision, it's a business decision.
I agree you almost 100%. I only disagree in being better for the NBPA. You are talking about 1 player, europe can't absorb 2 billions in salary. It would be almost impossible for soccer clubs, with all the contracts they have in place, let alone the basketball clubs. Point is, the more NBA players go for Europe, the less options the ones that stay have, the quicker they concede.
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Old 07-10-2011, 03:01 PM   #17
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Blue&Orange
I agree you almost 100%. I only disagree in being better for the NBPA. You are talking about 1 player, europe can't absorb 2 billions in salary. It would be almost impossible for soccer clubs, with all the contracts they have in place, let alone the basketball clubs. Point is, the more NBA players go for Europe, the less options the ones that stay have, the quicker they concede.

I disagree, the next frontier for basketball would be China.


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Old 07-10-2011, 03:05 PM   #18
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Rowe
He mentioned some team in Israel.

They really treat you well over there if you're of the Jewish faith. I know that was a big factor in why Sylvan Landesburg turned down an unguaranteed Kings contract to play 1-2 years in Israel. Same reason Alex Tyus, undrafted PF from Florida, chose to sign in Israel.

I wouldnt be against Amare doing it, if he did.

Oh yeah...I totally forgot that he was Jewish. It makes more sense, but I'd still
be surprised if he went through with it.
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Old 07-10-2011, 03:20 PM   #19
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Blue&Orange
I agree you almost 100%. I only disagree in being better for the NBPA. You are talking about 1 player, europe can't absorb 2 billions in salary. It would be almost impossible for soccer clubs, with all the contracts they have in place, let alone the basketball clubs. Point is, the more NBA players go for Europe, the less options the ones that stay have, the quicker they concede.
Jeff Green can't go over there and make 8 mil. But he might be able to command 5 mill per season if the NBA's new CBA makes him a 3 mil player. Remember, we're not talking about a country, we're talking about a continent. In fact, there are also teams that'd pony up the $ in China, Japan, and maybe South America. How many Prokhorovs are out there in the world? I don't know the exact number but I'm pretty sure that there are wealthy team owners all over the world that will be willing to spend the money necessary to keep up with opposing owners that are now bringing in NBA stars. The NBA is the richest league but there are billionaires everywhere.

Also, do a little homework on the NBPA. Deron Williams is not leaving the Union, as soon as the labor issues are resolved his contract lets him return.

Finally,
Quote:
Point is, the more NBA players go for Europe, the less options the ones that stay have, the quicker they concede.
doesn't make sense. There are what, tens of thousands of pro ballplayer jobs around the world? Most don't approach NBA money but a lot of them would keep a player in a rich lifestyle, and European/Chinese/whatever teams would be willing to pay much more money if a guy like LeBron James was within reach. Lesser players would make less money but they'd still see big offers, big enough to compete with the NBA if they cut back salaries by a full third. And then, if more NBA players signed overseas it would actually weaken the competition for spots over here, making players more money as all of a sudden a #2 like, say Russell Westbrook now becomes a franchise player for a team that that is more desperate for a star than they would have been if some eccentric Italian billionaire with a toy basketball team gave Chris Paul 150 million.
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Old 07-10-2011, 04:10 PM   #20
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

Maybe he wants to chill out. Having parties and all. Next Kemp,maybe?
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Old 07-10-2011, 04:35 PM   #21
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by rodman91
Maybe he wants to chill out. Having parties and all. Next Kemp,maybe?
Yeah how exactly does Amare plan to focus on NY and Knicks when there are no games and no practices?
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Old 07-10-2011, 04:46 PM   #22
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

Guy's have a solid chance of getting hurt over in Europe, just like they do in practice here. Esp considering they wouldn't be in there teams training facility and you'll probably see alot of these guy's running random games.

Everyone would have been playing once the offseason ended in the NBA anyways. Might as get in game shape, add to your game, play in a league with structure.

If I'm NY I'm extremely worried about guy's like Melo. Guy's who like the spotlight just as much as basketball. Players who will be partying it up and taking a break from the game. I'd rather a guy risk injury oversea's than sitting around getting out of shape.

Either way 'Amare is surely focusing on the Knicks! You know during the lockout
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Old 07-10-2011, 04:55 PM   #23
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by niko
That's my guy! Finally someone who understands. (Plus you have to figure the Knicks owner wants nothing to do with this lockout, he's constantly wanting to overpay everyone. Teams want hard cap, NY wants no cap.)

Yes, i get how playing overseas could benefit some players but after the first player blows out an ACL in a spirited Turkish League game i'm thinking some people will come around to my thinking.

Good for the Knicks I guess. But a shame really, Europe could do with a big guy who actually can dunk the basketball, hard and in peoples faces. It's a damn warmup layup line over here!
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:09 PM   #24
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by rodman91
Maybe he wants to chill out. Having parties and all. Next Kemp,maybe?
Nah. Amar'e is a fitness freak. Always in great shape. Cousins is the most likely "Kemp" candidate in my opinion. Maybe Glen Davis and Zach Randolph too.
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:09 PM   #25
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Remember, we're not talking about a country, we're talking about a continent.
Who cares? I'm talking about 2$ billions in salary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
How many Prokhorovs are out there in the world? I don't know the exact number but I'm pretty sure that there are wealthy team owners all over the world that will be willing to spend the money necessary to keep up with opposing owners that are now bringing in NBA stars. The NBA is the richest league but there are billionaires everywhere.
You're forgetting the "owner format" isn't used that much outside of the US. Clubs are owned by the fans that vote for the president, that is the club "owner" until the fans decide he is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Also, do a little homework on the NBPA. Deron Williams is not leaving the Union, as soon as the labor issues are resolved his contract lets him return.
I never said he was. And homework on the NBPA? I donít get that comment and what it have to do with what I said, but whatever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Finally,doesn't make sense. There are what, tens of thousands of pro ballplayer jobs around the world? Most don't approach NBA money but a lot of them would keep a player in a rich lifestyle, and European/Chinese/whatever teams would be willing to pay much more money if a guy like LeBron James was within reach. Lesser players would make less money but they'd still see big offers, big enough to compete with the NBA if they cut back salaries by a full third. And then, if more NBA players signed overseas it would actually weaken the competition for spots over here, making players more money as all of a sudden a #2 like, say Russell Westbrook now becomes a franchise player for a team that that is more desperate for a star than they would have been if some eccentric Italian billionaire with a toy basketball team gave Chris Paul 150 million.
It makes no sense to you. Tell me why international players go to the NBA if there's so much money in Europe\China whatever. There's money to bring Lebron James in but there is none to keep the top international players? I guess that, somehow, makes sense to you.

You must think players go to the NBA because of itís beautiful eyes. Tell that to Ricky Rubio, the memo where money doesnít matter didnít reach him.

The real money it's on soccer. I would go as far as saying that NBA worldwide gets better TV ratings in the majority of the countries compared with their domestic leagues.

Owners couldn't care less about losing some talent, they have new, better one coming every year through draft. Owners yawned when heard Williams signed that deal, what they are offering the players right now, nobody else can offer.

So yes i don't see how it helps NBPA position.
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:13 PM   #26
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by NuggetsFan
Guy's have a solid chance of getting hurt over in Europe, just like they do in practice here. Esp considering they wouldn't be in there teams training facility and you'll probably see alot of these guy's running random games.

Everyone would have been playing once the offseason ended in the NBA anyways. Might as get in game shape, add to your game, play in a league with structure.

If I'm NY I'm extremely worried about guy's like Melo. Guy's who like the spotlight just as much as basketball. Players who will be partying it up and taking a break from the game. I'd rather a guy risk injury oversea's than sitting around getting out of shape.

Either way 'Amare is surely focusing on the Knicks! You know during the lockout

yeah, terrible. working out, getting ready for the season when it comes, not playing for a foreign team. what a jerk. Should go overseas and play games on his repaired knees.

i think all of you look at things from the rationale of what you are, a very knowledgable basketball fan. If you asked me who is responsible for the lockout, the owners. Do i blame Deron for going overseas? Not at all. I'd do the same thing. As a selfish net fan (if i was one) i wouldn't want him to, but from any other perspective, i get it. But casual fans, it comes off as money grubbing and looks bad. It really does.

And the only ones who will get jobs are the top level players. The players who will crack first are the ones who need the money, not the big money guys. That happened in the NHL, and in football last time, etc. (although big money guys crossed too). A vocal minority starts to complain and it weakens the union. If Deron, Kobe, etc. - big money FA's are getting paid during the lockout it will not help the union. Do you think really honestly Deron would stay in Europe? Unless there are jobs to go around all over, it's not leverage, it's a sideshow. The players who need the next check for their mortgage won't find jobs. If you are a European team, do you want a role player or Kobe?

I'm going to watch Deron in Europe but i am not a casual fan. The casual fans will not watch, and it will not give the players as much leverage as you think. Look at the hockey strike. There are real leagues, competitive leagues that pay MORE money and could take the real stars. And the threat of them signing didn't help them one bit.

Last edited by niko : 07-10-2011 at 05:16 PM.
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:17 PM   #27
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by niko
yeah, terrible. working out, getting ready for the season when it comes, not playing for a foreign team. what a jerk. Should go overseas and play games on his repaired knees.

Wasn't a shot at Amare. Just meant probably not going oversea's because he doesn't need the money. During the lockout, there's a great chance the last thing he's thinking about is the NY Knicks. Doubt the reason why he's not going oversea's is because he's focusing on the Knicks, since right now that's kinda impossible. More like focusing on himself.
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:31 PM   #28
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Rowe
I disagree, the next frontier for basketball would be China.


So you go from the Steve Francis and Marbury to the NBA top tier just like that?

Let me say that even the soccer second league in china have better attendance then the first basketball league. The average soccer player salary is $60.000 a year. At least some 4,5 years ago. I wonder how much less the basketball player gets.
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:50 PM   #29
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by NuggetsFan
Wasn't a shot at Amare. Just meant probably not going oversea's because he doesn't need the money. During the lockout, there's a great chance the last thing he's thinking about is the NY Knicks. Doubt the reason why he's not going oversea's is because he's focusing on the Knicks, since right now that's kinda impossible. More like focusing on himself.
my bad. this board seems to think players are going overseas as this selfless act to make them better basketball players instead of money grabs.

BTW, all of you do know the reason Deron is talking about this so much is not that he is in love with the idea, but to try to make a power play on the owners, right?
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Old 07-10-2011, 05:54 PM   #30
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Default Re: Amare says he will NOT go overseas, NY and Knicks are his focus.

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Originally Posted by Blue&Orange
Who cares? I'm talking about 2$ billions in salary.
Europe doesn't have to take in every single NBA player for this to be a problem for the owners. If four or five superstars go to Europe, that would be enough to ruin NBA for the fans and severely damage its earning potential.

Quote:
You're forgetting the "owner format" isn't used that much outside of the US. Clubs are owned by the fans that vote for the president, that is the club "owner" until the fans decide he is.

I don't think you know what you are talking about. The "owner format" is used in Europe, although there are more teams that are publicly traded. Lol at the idea that clubs are "owned by the fans." What fantasy Europe is this, where fans own clubs and decide who the "owner" is?

Quote:
It makes no sense to you. Tell me why international players go to the NBA if there's so much money in Europe\China whatever. There's money to bring Lebron James in but there is none to keep the top international players? I guess that, somehow, makes sense to you.

There is no money in the NBA if there is a lock-out. And there is a lock-out because NBA owners want to pay the players less. Is this hard to understand?

Quote:
The real money it's on soccer. I would go as far as saying that NBA worldwide gets better TV ratings in the majority of the countries compared with their domestic leagues.

Real money in America is in football, baseball, and NASCAR.

Quote:
Owners couldn't care less about losing some talent, they have new, better one coming every year through draft. Owners yawned when heard Williams signed that deal, what they are offering the players right now, nobody else can offer.

So yes i don't see how it helps NBPA position.
Just like your fantasy Europe, your fantasy NBA where a new Deron Williams comes into the league every year must be a reassuring place.
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