Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > NBA Forum

NBA Forum NBA Message Board - NBA Fan Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-22-2011, 12:20 AM   #46
Rake2204
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,921
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiasco
Going to take a lot more than a rehashed cover theme and athlete to make me purchase 2K12.

I could give a fuck about pre-order bonuses, there are so many terrible bugs (online and offline) from 2K11 that break the game which they NEVER addressed that makes me feel like this is just another money grab.

When you only release one fucking patch, that tells me as much as I need to know about how much they actually care about making a great game.
Is that a mostly online-based complaint?

I was a strictly offline guy and while I acknowledge the game wasn't perfect, I still have to say it's about as much fun as I've ever had with a basketball video game. I was more than satisfied.
Rake2204 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 12:21 AM   #47
Warriors fan
Banned
 
Warriors fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 243
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiasco
Going to take a lot more than a rehashed cover theme and athlete to make me purchase 2K12.

I could give a fuck about pre-order bonuses, there are so many terrible bugs (online and offline) from 2K11 that break the game which they NEVER addressed that makes me feel like this is just another money grab.

When you only release one fucking patch, that tells me as much as I need to know about how much they actually care about making a great game.
this will answer all your ?s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKPHi...eature=related

Last edited by Warriors fan : 07-22-2011 at 12:24 AM.
Warriors fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 12:37 AM   #48
Kblaze8855
Titles are overrated
 
Kblaze8855's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: I love me some me.
Posts: 13,585
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Going to take a lot more than a rehashed cover theme and athlete to make me purchase 2K12.

I could give a **** about pre-order bonuses, there are so many terrible bugs (online and offline) from 2K11 that break the game

No there arent.

The only issues that come up are server based or some guy having a saved game corrupted somehow. Anything else isnt widespread. Gameplay wise I never see a bug that isnt because some *** hacked his player and has a 10 foot guy doing something the animation is designed to apply to a 6 footer.

The issues with gameplay are only noticable because its so close to real basketball the flaws can be seen because you get to comparing it to reality when it isnt. It has little animation hiccups like your hand going through the ball but nto getting a block. Collision detection things that have never been right in sports games.

But it was easily...by a wide wide wide margin the closest a basketbal lgame ever came to perfect.

You have guys on the break pulling out eurosteps, pick and pops, a stick that controls how you come off a screen, drop step floaters, and so on at a level never approached.

It wasnt called the best sports game in a generation for nothing.

If it were not so close to perfect the imperfections wouldnt show. Its so close to real basketball that we look at it as something it isnt. It isnt real. Its just as close as you can get. Most of the exploits are humans being ***** not the game being poorly made.
Kblaze8855 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 12:41 AM   #49
ace23
*****
 
ace23's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 10,074
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
No there arent.

The only issues that come up are server based or some guy having a saved game corrupted somehow. Anything else isnt widespread. Gameplay wise I never see a bug that isnt because some *** hacked his player and has a 10 foot guy doing something the animation is designed to apply to a 6 footer.

The issues with gameplay are only noticable because its so close to real basketball the flaws can be seen because you get to comparing it to reality when it isnt. It has little animation hiccups like your hand going through the ball but nto getting a block. Collision detection things that have never been right in sports games.

But it was easily...by a wide wide wide margin the closest a basketbal lgame ever came to perfect.

You have guys on the break pulling out eurosteps, pick and pops, a stick that controls how you come off a screen, drop step floaters, and so on at a level never approached.

It wasnt called the best sports game in a generation for nothing.

If it were not so close to perfect the imperfections wouldnt show. Its so close to real basketball that we look at it as something it isnt. It isnt real. Its just as close as you can get. Most of the exploits are humans being ***** not the game being poorly made.
+1
ace23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 01:29 AM   #50
Kblaze8855
Titles are overrated
 
Kblaze8855's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: I love me some me.
Posts: 13,585
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

I remember a basketball game on the Atari. Thats right...the Atari. Yes...im old.

It was a ****ing stick with a square on it as the goal. Two players. The ball with a square. It had 3 sounds. Dribble, make, and miss.

And now people will complain about the smallest of errors as if the game is unplayable. 2K11 was the most realistic sports game ive ever seen....by a lot.
Kblaze8855 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 01:31 AM   #51
Fiasco
latsis4everô
 
Fiasco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: West Coast
Posts: 4,998
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
Is that a mostly online-based complaint?

I was a strictly offline guy and while I acknowledge the game wasn't perfect, I still have to say it's about as much fun as I've ever had with a basketball video game. I was more than satisfied.

I've played 75% offline. My online experiences haven't been any better.

Ardently supported the 2K franchise after Live 08 was a total drag. What the entire problem comes down to is the fact that there is zero middle ground in between the difficulties. Rookie, Pro, All-Star, Superstar, and Hall of Fame are really five separate names for two levels of playing: too easy or too hard. It's not as apparent in a quick game (offline or online) because you're in control of your entire team, but My Player was absolutely pathetic this year, despite the fact was supposed to culminate the idea of 2k11 which was "Be like Mike".

Before the patch, this game was doing fine. There were server issues (which isn't news to 2K fans), corrupted My Player files, and some AI tendencies/bugs but otherwise the core game was incredibly solid. Post patch, the entire thing turned into a shit fest and 2K did zero to address the problems, much less acknowledge them.

The problem is when you actually want a challenging basketball game that makes you think on a competitive level, instead of rehashing the Pick & Roll or the Drive & Dish theme people offline and online beat to death. When you want to play a game that actually requires you to know your team's playbook, know your players' tendencies/strengths and your opponents weaknesses to come away with a win... this is where 2K11 falls short. Drastically.

I've been harping on this since the game was released in November. Check the video game forum for the myriad of complaints. I'm not just pulling this out of my ass to be "that guy".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
No there arent.

The only issues that come up are server based or some guy having a saved game corrupted somehow. Anything else isnt widespread. Gameplay wise I never see a bug that isnt because some *** hacked his player and has a 10 foot guy doing something the animation is designed to apply to a 6 footer.

What modes have you been playing? Your experiences will definitely vary based on the types of modes you play and the difficulty you play them at. Dramatically.

Quote:
The issues with gameplay are only noticable because its so close to real basketball the flaws can be seen because you get to comparing it to reality when it isnt. It has little animation hiccups like your hand going through the ball but nto getting a block. Collision detection things that have never been right in sports games.

The issues in this game are astounding. I'm not worried about the aesthetic validity. Nobody is. 2K has some of the best work I've seen, especially when it comes to the NBA franchise.

If you're not comparing it to it's real-life counterpart, what is the point of evaluating it at all? 2K11 is a sports simulating game. That's the standard I hold it at. Do you feel differently?

Quote:
But it was easily...by a wide wide wide margin the closest a basketbal lgame ever came to perfect.

I respectfully disagree.

Quote:
You have guys on the break pulling out eurosteps, pick and pops, a stick that controls how you come off a screen, drop step floaters, and so on at a level never approached.

And while the additions were interesting, their efficiency in the game is ridiculous no matter who the player is. Shots that have special animations (primarily the spin dunk and spin layup) will fall at near 60% clip on higher difficulties. There is no parity between Chris Paul adjusting his layup midair, and Jeremy Lin: it will go in more likely than not.

Other beautiful issues with the game I've encountered (non hardware):

- Low post scoring
- Free throw shooting
- Three point shooting
- Ball security of 4's/5's
- Sluggish user controlled players
- Difficulty of stealing
- AI defensive awareness
- AI "gliding defense"
- Big men footwork
- Playcalling
- Inability to throw good pass/throwing incorrect pass in situation
- Pick & roll efficiency
- Shot stick timing
- Mutiple (read: million) My Player issues that are documented in the VG forum
- Dunking
- Being "pulled" into a block
- Jump balls (strictly My Player)

That's just off the top of my head. Of course, if you're casually gaming on simple difficulties then you won't encounter many issues, if any. Exploits haven't ruined my online playing at all. Maybe I'm just lucky.

*If you want me to flesh out a specific point, let me know.

Quote:
It wasnt called the best sports game in a generation for nothing.

It was titled Best Sports game by sites that are notorious for inflating scores with regards to "big game" franchises. Most user reviews are between 'good' to 'average', which is the true litmus test for any game.

Quote:
If it were not so close to perfect the imperfections wouldnt show. Its so close to real basketball that we look at it as something it isnt. It isnt real. Its just as close as you can get. Most of the exploits are humans being ***** not the game being poorly made.

I look at it as a game that failed to address the issues it introduced at its launch. I don't expect perfection, I expect what $69 should buy for me: 2K11 isn't it.

As for exploits: see the previous quote.

Last edited by Fiasco : 07-22-2011 at 01:33 AM.
Fiasco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 01:41 AM   #52
Rake2204
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,921
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Man, that's a bummer. I definitely feel you on the block "suck-ins" though.

And not saying the dunks are flawless, but what was your particular issue with them?

Out of honest curiosity, which basketball game has done it better in your opinion than NBA 2K11?
Rake2204 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 01:43 AM   #53
d.bball.guy
Heat fan since 2014
 
d.bball.guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,464
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
I remember a basketball game on the Atari. Thats right...the Atari. Yes...im old.

It was a ****ing stick with a square on it as the goal. Two players. The ball with a square. It had 3 sounds. Dribble, make, and miss.

And now people will complain about the smallest of errors as if the game is unplayable. 2K11 was the most realistic sports game ive ever seen....by a lot.
d.bball.guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 01:57 AM   #54
Kblaze8855
Titles are overrated
 
Kblaze8855's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: I love me some me.
Posts: 13,585
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
If you're not comparing it to it's real-life counterpart, what is the point of evaluating it at all? 2K11 is a sports simulating game. That's the standard I hold it at. Do you feel differently?

If you are trying to get basketball out of something that has to compress 50 thousand human actions into 8 buttons and make it simple you are just looking for something to complain about.


Quote:
And while the additions were interesting, their efficiency in the game is ridiculous no matter who the player is. Shots that have special animations (primarily the spin dunk and spin layup) will fall at near 60% clip on higher difficulties. There is no parity between Chris Paul adjusting his layup midair, and Jeremy Lin: it will go in more likely than not.

Of course there is. Lebron and Wade types will make contact layups at a rate nobody else will.


Quote:
- Low post scoring
- Free throw shooting
- Three point shooting
- Ball security of 4's/5's
- Sluggish user controlled players
- Difficulty of stealing
- AI defensive awareness
- AI "gliding defense"
- Big men footwork
- Playcalling
- Inability to throw good pass/throwing incorrect pass in situation
- Pick & roll efficiency
- Shot stick timing
- Mutiple (read: million) My Player issues that are documented in the VG forum
- Dunking
- Being "pulled" into a block
- Jump balls (strictly My Player)

That's just off the top of my head. Of course, if you're casually gaming on simple difficulties then you won't encounter many issues, if any. Exploits haven't ruined my online playing at all. Maybe I'm just lucky.

Again....you have 8 buttons to work with and it seems you want the entirety of possible human actions availiable.

Low post scoring? Most people dont even attempt it. Im a beast in the post. The only game ive even seen approach 2k11 far as what you can do in the post is like live 04. Might have been 03. But its rare. Unless you mean it being too easy...in which case id tell you nobody seems to notice other than the hackers on mycrew games.

You have issue with FTs?

Shot stick timing?

You are the kind of guy I think developers have to flat out ignore just to do their jobs. The level of detail ad depth.....just thinking of the effort that had to be put in to make that game? And you will write out a list of things that can be summed up by saying "Its not actually playing basketball".

I read a developer of some Madden game years ago talking about that. The closer you get to real the more the flaws stand out to people looking for things to complain about. make a joke of a game like Blitz people have nothing to say. Work your ass off to make it the greatest thing ever seen and people will ask why a guys hair doesnt move when he falls down.

If you are gonna bitch about jump balls you just dont want to be happy. Someone complaining about an issue like that will be playing in 2054 on a Super High Definition 6D Tv that actually transports you into an alternate dimension where you have the skills of Lebron and complain that Lebron could jump a little higher than they are letting you and the game is broken as a result.



Quote:
It was titled Best Sports game by sites that are notorious for inflating scores with regards to "big game" franchises. Most user reviews are between 'good' to 'average', which is the true litmus test for any game.

We must know very different users...

Perhaps the people I know play video games looking to enjoy themselves?



Quote:
I look at it as a game that failed to address the issues it introduced at its launch. I don't expect perfection, I expect what $69 should buy for me: 2K11 isn't it.

As for exploits: see the previous quote.

We were paying 50 dollars for Live 95 to have players on ice skates....

In 2002 my stepfather saw someone playing 2k on the dreamcast and thought it was real basketball.

Now near 2012 we have a game with 500 shots, custom dribbling styles, on the ball defense at a level you can draw a charge playing one on one, out of bounds lobs to the goal for a dunk with time running out, reverse pivot fadeaways in the post, created players with 80 custom details down to how they shoot a contact leaner going left or how they react to a hesitation dribble and 10 different Michael Jordans with season specific skillsets....

And people who cant be pleased are pissed off about one of the 400 custom Ft animations or something petty like that.

If you arent happy now you never will be. Gameplay wise there is little if anything left to really improve. Just tweak here and there to reduce things being exploited. Which again...is an issue of players being unfair. Not the game being wrong to include the animation.

Last edited by Kblaze8855 : 07-22-2011 at 02:01 AM.
Kblaze8855 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:26 AM   #55
Marv_Albert
GUESS WHO'S BACK
 
Marv_Albert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,498
Default Re: Official NBA 2k12 covers revealed: Jordan, Magic and Bird

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie2k6
i'm only feeling Jordan's.. should've changed the background colors for Magic and Bird's

This.
Marv_Albert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:26 AM   #56
PowerGlove
By Any Means
 
PowerGlove's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Atlanta/Toronto
Posts: 10,197
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

2k11 was garbage after a while.

Derek Fisher blocked amare stoudemire's...fast break dunk.
PowerGlove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:28 AM   #57
NuggetsFan
Nuggets/Avs/Broncos.
 
NuggetsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: NuggetNation.
Posts: 10,181
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
We were paying 50 dollars for Live 95 to have players on ice skates....

Not sure what this has to do with anything. You keep on bringing up past games, too much expectations but things evolve. You should expect more from 2k11 than '95. Just because 2k11 is great and miles ahead of past games and potentially the best basketball game of all time doesn't mean that it's perfect nor can't be critiqued while looking ahead to 2k12. That's what things do, advance.

As your for you thinking 2k11 there's not much to do, kinda funny. Hit me up in 2016 and we'll compare 'em. Just like when you gamed in '03 or '99 you'd be blown away by seeing 2k11. As for people being petty wanting more? It's human nature. If something's amazing, you want something better. If everybody was content things would never evolve. If everybody was satisfied with cell phone's 5 years ago we wouldn't have what we have now. Just because something's great doesn't mean you can't nitpick and want more.

Anyways same thing I always ask for in any basketball game is having them keep getting it closer and closer to the real thing. More realistic play. Hate playing a game and consistently hitting 60% of my shots. Deff heading down the right track tho so not many complaints.
NuggetsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:39 AM   #58
Rake2204
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,921
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by NuggetsFan
Not sure what this has to do with anything. You keep on bringing up past games, too much expectations but things evolve. You should expect more from 2k11 than '95. Just because 2k11 is great and miles ahead of past games and potentially the best basketball game of all time doesn't mean that it's perfect nor can't be critiqued while looking ahead to 2k12. That's what things do, advance.

As your for you thinking 2k11 there's not much to do, kinda funny. Hit me up in 2016 and we'll compare 'em. Just like when you gamed in '03 or '99 you'd be blown away by seeing 2k11. As for people being petty wanting more? It's human nature. If something's amazing, you want something better. If everybody was content things would never evolve. If everybody was satisfied with cell phone's 5 years ago we wouldn't have what we have now. Just because something's great doesn't mean you can't nitpick and want more.

Anyways same thing I always ask for in any basketball game is having them keep getting it closer and closer to the real thing. More realistic play. Hate playing a game and consistently hitting 60% of my shots. Deff heading down the right track tho so not many complaints.
I agree that there is a lot that can continue to be done to improve NBA 2K (and any and all basketball video games. . .the ones that still exist anyway). I personally just like to enjoy the ride in the meantime. I acknowledge 2K11's not perfect, but I sure don't take that game for granted either. I appreciate it for what it is and it provides a ton of entertainment.

I kind of feel bad for folks who just can't find enjoyment in anything until it reaches a level of perfection that will never arrive. And I don't mean I feel bad in a jerk way, I mean it's a legitimate bummer (also not saying you're one of those people, just speaking in general).
Rake2204 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:41 AM   #59
PowerGlove
By Any Means
 
PowerGlove's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Atlanta/Toronto
Posts: 10,197
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
I agree that there is a lot that can continue to be done to improve NBA 2K (and any and all basketball video games. . .the ones that still exist anyway). I personally just like to enjoy the ride in the meantime. I acknowledge 2K11's not perfect, but I sure don't take that game for granted either. I appreciate it for what it is and it provides a ton of entertainment.

I kind of feel bad for folks who just can't find enjoyment in anything until it reaches a level of perfection that will never arrive. And I don't mean I feel bad in a jerk way, I mean it's a legitimate bummer (also not saying you're one of those people, just speaking in general).
I'm definitely one of those people.
PowerGlove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-22-2011, 02:44 AM   #60
Kblaze8855
Titles are overrated
 
Kblaze8855's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: I love me some me.
Posts: 13,585
Default Re: NBA 2K12 cover art to feature Jordan, Bird, Magic

If a guy is saying he expects much more for a game that costs what it does....doesnt that imply that it costs a lot? Game costs the same they did when it was 10 blobs shooting a smaller blob. If the cost rose with the quality 2k11 would be 12 thousand dollars.

And if you played a 5 minute quarter game and made 45% of your shots the scores would end up 38-33. Im sure a lot goes into decisions like how easy it is to score and how it impacts the realism of the game. That aspect will never be realistic because nobody wants to play 4 12 minute quarters with a group of friends playing in rotation. you might not play for 5 hours. It might end up with both teams shooting 44-50% and scoring 90-105...but it would suck. Its a videogame at heart. For people to enjoy. gotta balance things out.

And really...how is listing how the jump ball works not petty?

Really?

The jump ball in my player games?

Just looking for something to bitch about that doesnt matter.

Calling a game that is closer to basketball than anything ever a broken game because of petty shit like that is just being impossible to please. Its looking for everything but whats right. The developers arent gonna address petty shit like that because they probably read it and do what I do. Scoff.

Cant please everyone. Some people wont let themselves be pleased.
Kblaze8855 is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:57 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy