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Old 12-28-2006, 11:46 AM   #16
TMacsOneGoodEye
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The middle east was gonna erupt into violence either way if Saddam was hung or left alive. Those fanatical muslims just enjoy causing problems and making things difficult for the rest of the world since it gives them a sense of empowerment. I feel most sorry for the non violent muslims.

I just hope I can raise a family & they can hopefully raise theirs before the muslims blow this world up.
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Old 12-28-2006, 11:49 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Heilige
1. His followers will react no matter what is done. Hang, life in prison, community service, parole... ANYTHING.

2. As for how this affects Iraq. Those he killed will know he is gone for good. But more importantly, he needs to be punished. The Nuremberg trials didn't directly help Germany, but it showed the world the terrors inflicted by the Nazis, and brought the perpetrators to justice.

Imagine how that argument would have looked back then. "But if we execute these Nazi leaders, the Werewolf insurgency will grow, and Hitler's followers will seek revenge."

The fact of the matter is Saddam was captured and found guilty of crimes against humanity. The punishment is death. So in that regards, he has to die. I don't think there is any other sentence in this case.

How would the people Saddam killed know he is gone for good if they are dead in the first place?

Any how...your missing the point of what I was saying. We got him...yeee hooray...does he deserve to be hung...yes I agree.

My whole argument is that our reasons on attacking Iraq in the first place and going after Saddam are B.S.

Tell me why we did this? Was it because of weapons of Mass Destruction that we never found and KNOW other countries have?

And if Saddam is so bad why aren't we policing North Korea taking down Kim?

And what the f*ck happen to Bin Laden? You know the man who took down the World trade? We were suppose to catch him remember!?!?

My bottomline...the Bush Administration f*ct up big time with this war period. And this war was fought because of the hit made on the first Bush's head by Saddam.
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Old 12-28-2006, 12:23 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by crisoner
How would the people Saddam killed know he is gone for good if they are dead in the first place?

Any how...your missing the point of what I was saying. We got him...yeee hooray...does he deserve to be hung...yes I agree.

My whole argument is that our reasons on attacking Iraq in the first place and going after Saddam are B.S.

Tell me why we did this? Was it because of weapons of Mass Destruction that we never found and KNOW other countries have?

And if Saddam is so bad why aren't we policing North Korea taking down Kim?

And what the f*ck happen to Bin Laden? You know the man who took down the World trade? We were suppose to catch him remember!?!?

My bottomline...the Bush Administration f*ct up big time with this war period. And this war was fought because of the hit made on the first Bush's head by Saddam.


Lucky WMD wasn't the only reason for war then, eh?

You people keep forgetting sanctions, broken resolutions, etc, liberation, and creating a democracy to surround Iran. Plenty of other reasons.

The other reasons WERE given, and are other reasons we went over there. To say those weren't reasons is just ignorant. All you had to do was watch the news on CNN, and they went alot more in depth than just what Bush gave for his reasons.

I'm not saying WMD weren't a reason. They were. There were also others.

The UN sanction said if it weren't followed there would be action. Read up on it.

Saddam paid people 20000 dollars to blow themselves up, he has links to terrorists, even if not Al Qaeda.

If there are no WMD, then yes, that's bad. But I say blame bad intelligence.
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Old 12-28-2006, 12:31 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Heilige
Lucky WMD wasn't the only reason for war then, eh?

You people keep forgetting sanctions, broken resolutions, etc, liberation, and creating a democracy to surround Iran. Plenty of other reasons.

The other reasons WERE given, and are other reasons we went over there. To say those weren't reasons is just ignorant. All you had to do was watch the news on CNN, and they went alot more in depth than just what Bush gave for his reasons.

I'm not saying WMD weren't a reason. They were. There were also others.

The UN sanction said if it weren't followed there would be action. Read up on it.

Saddam paid people 20000 dollars to blow themselves up, he has links to terrorists, even if not Al Qaeda.

If there are no WMD, then yes, that's bad. But I say blame bad intelligence.

And you trust CNN?

First of all your other reason...sanctions etc. They are plenty of other countries doing the same. India and Pakastan were told not to make or invest in an arms race for WMD's but did and now HAVE nucular weapons...why didn't we go after those guys?

Korea went as far as shooting there missels out West to see how far they will go...why West you may ask...because that where the western coast of the USA is not to mention Hawaii. Did we go after them.....no.

My whole point is....Saddam is the lesser evil made out to be worst then he is.
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Old 12-28-2006, 12:35 PM   #20
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You people keep forgetting sanctions, broken resolutions, etc, liberation, and creating a democracy to surround Iran. Plenty of other reasons.

Bush couldnt even wait for Hans blix to finish his investigation before he began beating the war drums....

when blix's report didnt advocate a war, bush admin. tried to discredit him

read up on it if you forgot

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...031831,00.html

http://www.lossless-audio.com/usa/in...e=44765520.htm
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Old 12-28-2006, 12:53 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by crisoner
And you trust CNN?

First of all your other reason...sanctions etc. They are plenty of other countries doing the same. India and Pakastan were told not to make or invest in an arms race for WMD's but did and now HAVE nucular weapons...why didn't we go after those guys?

Korea went as far as shooting there missels out West to see how far they will go...why West you may ask...because that where the western coast of the USA is not to mention Hawaii. Did we go after them.....no.

My whole point is....Saddam is the lesser evil made out to be worst then he is.


North Korea doesn't have the infrastructure or delivery systems to put a really dangerous first strike together. Given the surveillance it would be under, it couldn't get one or two birds in the air before being nuked to kingdom come themselves.

North Korea has missiles that could conceivably reach the US West Coast. However, itís highly doubtful they have the light weight, sophisticated nukes that would be needed in order to mount a nuclear device on said rockets.
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Old 12-28-2006, 01:18 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by crisoner
And you trust CNN?

First of all your other reason...sanctions etc. They are plenty of other countries doing the same. India and Pakastan were told not to make or invest in an arms race for WMD's but did and now HAVE nucular weapons...why didn't we go after those guys?

Korea went as far as shooting there missels out West to see how far they will go...why West you may ask...because that where the western coast of the USA is not to mention Hawaii. Did we go after them.....no.

My whole point is....Saddam is the lesser evil made out to be worst then he is.

Oh, I don't know it might have something to do with the fact that Iraq has been given 12 years to disarm and has failed horribly. Whereas with North Korea it's not even clear if their intentions are hostile or a pathetic attempt to get more money and oil from the American's.

You won't support George Bush if/when he goes after Kim Jong Il either. It's called politics. If it were Bill Clinton in office, all I'd be hearing from the left would be: "Indeed! Saddam Hussein is a dangerous man!" No anti war protestors outside the white house when Clinton proposed attacking Iraq in 98. No one needed further information then.

Last edited by Heilige : 12-28-2006 at 01:20 PM.
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Old 12-28-2006, 01:23 PM   #23
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It's called politics.


nah...its called common sense


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If it were Bill Clinton in office, all I'd be hearing from the left would be: "Indeed! Saddam Hussein is a dangerous man!" No anti war protestors outside the white house when Clinton proposed attacking Iraq in 98. No one needed further information then.

you assume people who criticize bush, would not criticize clinton for making the same dumb decisions bush has...

sometimes dumb is just dumb no matter who is doing it....

its not a left vs. right issue
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Old 12-28-2006, 01:26 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Rasheed1
Bush couldnt even wait for Hans blix to finish his investigation before he began beating the war drums....

when blix's report didnt advocate a war, bush admin. tried to discredit him

read up on it if you forgot

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...031831,00.html

http://www.lossless-audio.com/usa/in...e=44765520.htm


That's nice but it's not the inspectors job to find weapons. It's their job to verify Iraq's disarmament.

You realize that you're argueing for a guy who just a decade ago invaded an innocent country himself in an attempt to control the oil market in the world. A guy who has over a dozen palaces built in his name while his people starve and live in poverty. A guy who gases his own citizens and dresses his soldiers in American uniforms while doing so to spread propaganda.

Maybe he didn't have WMDs when we went in, but the fact was the suspicion that he did arose from one simple point: he kicked out the UN weapons inspectors and wouldn't let them do their job. I don't care how long they had been there and hadn't found anything. The fact that he did that leads me to believe he had something to hide.

After getting his ass handed to him by the US in the Gulf War, Saddam realized he couldn't win a direct battle with the United States and coalition armed forces. The coalition forces had become even more powerful since 1991, and Saddams own were poorly equipped and smaller in numbers than in the previous decade.

In short, Saddam knew that he couldn't win the war militarily against the US. So, rather than wait for the inevitable, Saddam tried to win the war through politics.

Look at how the French, Russians, Germans ect. rallied to his side. Saddam realized that their support was his only hope of keeping his baath regime in power.

This explains his encouraging of anti-war protesters, his bribing of Scott Ritter, the interview with CBS, the re-admittance of weapons inspectors ect.

But if his WMD programs were discovered, it would be game over. His support from the European nations would no longer be feasible if his weapons of mass destruction were found. It would prove that the States were in the right and that he had been lying.

So, according to the captured in Iraq, Saddam ordered his WMD programs destroyed or hidden three days before the war started. He apparently hoped that, if he kept the war going long enough, popular opinion would turn against the war and save his ass.

If you want proof that weapons existed, explain the weapons labs already discovered in Iraq.

Last edited by Heilige : 12-28-2006 at 01:31 PM.
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Old 12-28-2006, 02:08 PM   #25
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North Korea has a huge army with nukes.....

That itself puts them over Saddam.

Would I support a war with them...hell no...not at the moment. You want World War 3 or some nuke war to go all out?

Clinton wouldnt of got us into this mess so we wouldnet have to worry about it.

But who cares about that thats all just a opinion. If Clinton made the same mistakes we will be all calling for his head as well.

Last edited by crisoner : 12-28-2006 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 12-28-2006, 02:44 PM   #26
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That's nice but it's not the inspectors job to find weapons.

I dont recall saying it was....

Quote:
You realize that you're argueing for a guy who just a decade ago invaded an innocent country himself in an attempt to control the oil market in the world. A guy who has over a dozen palaces built in his name while his people starve and live in poverty. A guy who gases his own citizens and dresses his soldiers in American uniforms while doing so to spread propaganda.

I dont remember defending Saddam...maybe thats because I didnt....

listing his crimes doesnt justify the Bush admins. actions...

it doesnt justify the mess that was made of iraq and the damn near 3000 american lives wasted in that country over Bush's lies...


Quote:
Maybe he didn't have WMDs when we went in, but the fact was the suspicion that he did arose from one simple point: he kicked out the UN weapons inspectors and wouldn't let them do their job. I don't care how long they had been there and hadn't found anything. The fact that he did that leads me to believe he had something to hide.


After getting his ass handed to him by the US in the Gulf War, Saddam realized he couldn't win a direct battle with the United States and coalition armed forces. The coalition forces had become even more powerful since 1991, and Saddams own were poorly equipped and smaller in numbers than in the previous decade.

In short, Saddam knew that he couldn't win the war militarily against the US. So, rather than wait for the inevitable, Saddam tried to win the war through politics.

Look at how the French, Russians, Germans ect. rallied to his side. Saddam realized that their support was his only hope of keeping his baath regime in power.

This explains his encouraging of anti-war protesters, his bribing of Scott Ritter, the interview with CBS, the re-admittance of weapons inspectors ect.

But if his WMD programs were discovered, it would be game over. His support from the European nations would no longer be feasible if his weapons of mass destruction were found. It would prove that the States were in the right and that he had been lying.

So, according to the captured in Iraq, Saddam ordered his WMD programs destroyed or hidden three days before the war started. He apparently hoped that, if he kept the war going long enough, popular opinion would turn against the war and save his ass.

^^^^none of this story has any relevance to 911 or Bin laden or our mission to catch the perpetrators of the 911 crme..

so while we waste time playing hide and seek with a 3rd world nation who had nothing to do with 911 and couldnt harm america if they tried..... the supposed 'real' criminals thumb their noses at us and the president all of a sudden catches amnesia over his tough talk in the days following 911

Quote:
If you want proof that weapons existed, explain the weapons labs already discovered in Iraq.

like I said, bush has done a good job wasting people's time, money and their lives with his lies.....

we should be spending our resources finding and capturing Bin Laden
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Old 12-28-2006, 06:47 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by brwnman
wow you know nothing about Iraq... nothing...


I know much much more then you..becoz I livre in lebanon/middle east..

Unfortunately its your media that stirs things up alot and presents things in a bias manner..
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