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Old 12-14-2011, 05:01 PM   #31
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by JellyBean
Cam. He fits the mode of your typical qb. He has the proper skill set. You don't have to get players to fit around him, like what is going to happen with Denver in the off season. I would pick Cam over Tebow.
This isn't a real problem. It's not like you have a 6-foot SG and now you want a big point to cross-match. The general difference between the receiver you want for Tebow vs. the NFL norm, based on what we've seen in the NFL, is that Tebow's receivers will have to be guys that don't complain about a lack of touches (which is actually a trait you would want for other receivers, it's just more important in his case). You want receivers to be big, fast, good hands, smart, run good routes, tough, able to block, regardless of who your QB is. If Denver wants to be extremely run-heavy it in fact reduces the need to go get a star wideout, which means more resources ($) can go into the defense, which is Fox's specialty anyway.

That's why they let Marshall go for so little.

Personnell is most definitely not the issue. If there is a problem with Tebow it's the question of whether or not the offense can work in the NFL, not finding people to fit it.
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Old 12-14-2011, 05:16 PM   #32
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Wrong that wasnt why black QB's werent taken. Scott Frost was drafted as a safety for the Jets. QB's werent drafted if they ran option or wishbone or generally ran shotgun offenses regardless of skin. And yes I think Tommy Frazier was a better football player than Tebow.

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
It's not fair but black QBs in general were still uncommon in Frazier's day, one could get a chance but he'd better be a big-time passer. The reason (or excuse) why most black QBs got no shot is that they were runners. So Frazier being a black running QB had no shot. And on a side note, he wasn't better than Tebow at all.
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Old 12-14-2011, 05:36 PM   #33
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rameek
Wrong that wasnt why black QB's werent taken. Scott Frost was drafted as a safety for the Jets. QB's werent drafted if they ran option or wishbone or generally ran shotgun offenses regardless of skin. And yes I think Tommy Frazier was a better football player than Tebow.
Option QBs are running QBs. Shotgun QBs are frowned upon but a number of Spurrier's Gator QBs were at least given a chance. And you can think Frazier was better if you want, really doesn't matter much I barely remember his career but what I do recall of him was a running option QB who maybe could have played at another position.
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Old 12-14-2011, 05:51 PM   #34
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by Real Men Wear Green
Option QBs are running QBs. Shotgun QBs are frowned upon but a number of Spurrier's Gator QBs were at least given a chance. And you can think Frazier was better if you want, really doesn't matter much I barely remember his career but what I do recall of him was a running option QB who maybe could have played at another position.
When Florida QB's were drafted I think they had Florida connections on the NFL coaching staff. NONE were ever good enough for the NFL. You made it seem like black qb's are not drafted because they run. NO NFL QB's are drafted regardless of skin if they run option or wishbone and generally shotgun offenses. There are other reasons black QB's were never drafted.

How can you not remember a player but make a claim one is better than the other? You dont need to answer because this thread is about black vs white qb's.....



















Sarcasm:
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Old 12-14-2011, 05:54 PM   #35
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

What could Tommy Frazier do as a player in college football Tebow couldnt? He was a bigger home run threat than Tebow. But outside of that?

Edit: I dont want to derail the thread taklin Frazier vs Tebow tho.
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Old 12-14-2011, 06:15 PM   #36
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rameek
When Florida QB's were drafted I think they had Florida connections on the NFL coaching staff. NONE were ever good enough for the NFL. You made it seem like black qb's are not drafted because they run. NO NFL QB's are drafted regardless of skin if they run option or wishbone and generally shotgun offenses. There are other reasons black QB's were never drafted.
Not sure if you know this or not but the acceptance of black QBs in the NFL has been a gradual process. From Warren Moon, who in a fair world would have had career NFL stats almost on par with Dan Marino but was instead forced to first prove himself for years in Canada to Newton being the first pick and starting from Week 1 there has been a gradual shift in attitudes regarding race and the ability of black men to think and lead. In the mid 90s a QB who showed the ability to pass at a high level like Donovan McNabb would get a shot at the NFL but someone like Frazier who ran that Nebraska option attack (I don't have extensive memory of Frazier but I know that Osborne had them sticking to the option runs in NB) was not going to be taken seriously by the NFL. It was better than the attitudes in Moon's day but not as good for black QBs as it is now when Newton can run the spread option and a team will still draft him #1 with no hesitation in spite of no one regarding his offense as even slightly pro (although they do at least pass in it).

Quote:
How can you not remember a player but make a claim one is better than the other? You dont need to answer because this thread is about black vs white qb's.....Sarcasm:[/b]
That's offensive and stupid, I hope you don't mean what I think you mean about me. For the record it's not like I never saw Frazier I just didn't see much. I remember Lawrence Phillips, his troubled teammate who was the focus of the Husker offense who couldn't make it in the NFL because he caused too much trouble off of the field.
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Old 12-14-2011, 10:04 PM   #37
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rameek



Why didnt someone do this for Tommy Frazier that dude >>> Tebow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oO18ZbCLbE


not to be an ass, but wikipedia strikes again. -Frazier had been diagnose prior to the draft, with a potentialy life threatening disease, called crohn's...that could be one reason :'-( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tommie_Frazier

//tebow mania discussion has been awesomesauce
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Old 12-15-2011, 12:43 AM   #38
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Cam Newton...he's even a better runner than Tim Tebow
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Old 12-15-2011, 01:59 PM   #39
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

lol espn.com asking who you'd prefer...brady or tebow.
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Old 12-15-2011, 03:05 PM   #40
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by NoGunzJustSkillz
lol espn.com asking who you'd prefer...brady or tebow.

I saw that bull**** too and they made it seem like they were equals because they are both winning...
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Old 12-15-2011, 03:25 PM   #41
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Pats play Denver this weekend, they're just riding the hype.
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Old 12-15-2011, 03:37 PM   #42
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

Tebow or Bradford?
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Old 12-15-2011, 03:39 PM   #43
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

It's hard to say really at this point.

Positives with Cam:
Much more of a multi-threat at this point. Obviously much more dangerous of a runner.

Positives with Tebow:
Has proven to take much better care of the ball and I predict if they both have a career at starting quartback for a while that Tebows turnovers will be significantly less than Cam's. He's winning with much more ofa sub-par offense than what Cam is playing with.

I don't know who I'd pick at this point. Probably Tebow just knowing he's going to be working harder than anyone else. I don't think people should unanimously be saying Cam until Tebow has some real weapons.
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Old 12-15-2011, 03:44 PM   #44
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

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Originally Posted by UtahJazzFan88
Cam has every reason that he SHOULD be better, but Tebow is a better leader and overall smarter player. Cam has the skill set, and the tools, but can he utilize them correctly? The Carolina defense is pretty pathetic, and Rivera has done very shotty playcalling, Rivera should be running the ball more with Stewart & DeAngelo and letting Cam off with less pressure to make plays. Cam saying his teammates need to play to "his level" striked as being arrogant, and did no good to me.

please explain this.
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Old 12-15-2011, 04:01 PM   #45
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Default Re: Tim Tebow or Cam Newton

One who is 7-1 on the season with no help from the D
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