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Old 01-08-2012, 11:38 PM   #31
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOBB
Pull up articles on that please.

http://dallascowboystimes.com/2011/0...y-left-tackle/
Very first sentence of the article
Quote:
In Tyron Smith’s conference call with the Dallas media, he said the Cowboys told him they want him to be their left tackle of the future.

Case closed?
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Old 01-08-2012, 11:41 PM   #32
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsfan1357
http://dallascowboystimes.com/2011/0...y-left-tackle/
Very first sentence of the article

Case closed?

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Old 01-08-2012, 11:49 PM   #33
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
YOU'RE THE BROWNS!!!...GO FOR IT!!!
What does that even mean?

I don't want to throw the franchise quarterback tag on a guy who is that small and comes from that kind of collegiate offense. He has probably never run a pro-style offense in his life, let alone the WCO that this FO and coaching staff is trying to install.

I have no interest in RGIII. None.

And, I disagree completely that Colt is 'horrible.' He was playing behind probably the worst right side in the NFL and definitely trying to throw to the worst crop of WRs in the league. Also, it isn't even like he had a running game to take pressure off of him and keep defenses honest since our line was decimated before the season even started and then our first, second and third string RBs were injured for the majority of the season.

Blaming that meager offense on Colt is ridiculous, imo. I'm still unsure about whether or not he could be a good starting QB in this league. He has been dealt an absolutely awful hand thus far.

I would take Luck if we had the opportunity, because he is less of a risk. Outside of that, I have no interest in taking a QB in the first three rounds of this year's draft. There are enough holes and enough 'can't miss' prospects in this year's draft that can fill those other holes.

This is absolutely not the year to go after your franchise QB, unless you have the chance to take Luck.

Oh... And I couldn't care less about RG3's "world class speed." If he tries running around in the NFL like he did in college with his tiny frame, he will get broken in half... Especially considering we play in the AFC North.

No. Interest. In. RG3.

Last edited by RedBlackAttack : 01-08-2012 at 11:52 PM.
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Old 01-09-2012, 12:00 AM   #34
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCY
I agree CB isn't a huge need, but saying the Browns had a good defense this year isn't really genuine. They didn't play against a great offense all year, just 4 games against teams in the Top 15 in scoring offense (San Fran, Houston, Baltimore x2). They were terrible against the run, and teams could simply run the whole game as Cleveland's inept offense didn't force opponents to put a lot of points on the board.
The whole defensive unit finished the season in the Top 10 in the league. And, they were forced to work from behind the 8-ball in most cases, because our anemic offense forced them to be on the field for the majority of every game.

And, we have focused on building a defense in Holmgren/Heckert's first two drafts.

Joe Haden and TJ Ward were our first two picks in 2010.

Phil Taylor and Jabaal Sheard were our first two picks in 2011.

The time has come to get real-deal playmakers on offense. I'm not saying devote the whole draft to the offensive side of the ball, but the first couple of picks should address our most pressing needs, which happen to be offensive holes (OL and WR).

Also, if they don't re-sign Hillis, they are going to need to address the RB spot, too. Hardesty surely can't carry the load.
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Old 01-09-2012, 12:18 AM   #35
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsfan1357
http://dallascowboystimes.com/2011/0...y-left-tackle/
Very first sentence of the article

Case closed?
No...read the article, it says he was drafted to play right tackle in 2011 but him switching is "possible"


Guess who is going to play RT next year?....SMITH

Jerry might have told him what he wanted to hear, but giving Doug Free a huge contract let's everyone know the truth.
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Old 01-09-2012, 12:22 AM   #36
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
Every starting position in the NFL is important. Nobody said RT is not important.
Then why is drafting one high "sketchy"

There are 2 tackles...like there are 2 CBs...should the Jets never take CB Hugh since Revis is on number ones?
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Old 01-09-2012, 12:36 AM   #37
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Do you have confidence in Greg Little being a number 1 caliber wideout, RBA?

I only ask because while drafting a wideout in the first round is nice, and surely would be a welcomed route by Brown's fans....is it all that smart? Haven't there been enough examples of mid to later round wideouts becoming very good, even great players? More so than probably any other position?
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Old 01-09-2012, 12:52 AM   #38
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
The whole defensive unit finished the season in the Top 10 in the league. And, they were forced to work from behind the 8-ball in most cases, because our anemic offense forced them to be on the field for the majority of every game.

And, we have focused on building a defense in Holmgren/Heckert's first two drafts.

Joe Haden and TJ Ward were our first two picks in 2010.

Phil Taylor and Jabaal Sheard were our first two picks in 2011.

The time has come to get real-deal playmakers on offense. I'm not saying devote the whole draft to the offensive side of the ball, but the first couple of picks should address our most pressing needs, which happen to be offensive holes (OL and WR).

Also, if they don't re-sign Hillis, they are going to need to address the RB spot, too. Hardesty surely can't carry the load.

Well I think the Top 10 finish is pretty misleading for the reasons I mentioned. I do agree that it is the best unit on the team by far and needs less attention than the O, but it's still an average D overall IMO.
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Old 01-09-2012, 02:24 AM   #39
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
Do you have confidence in Greg Little being a number 1 caliber wideout, RBA?

I only ask because while drafting a wideout in the first round is nice, and surely would be a welcomed route by Brown's fans....is it all that smart? Haven't there been enough examples of mid to later round wideouts becoming very good, even great players? More so than probably any other position?
No, I don't have any confidence in Greg Little ever becoming a viable WR1, which is why I'm so adament about us getting a true game-breaking receiver early in this draft.

You are right that there are plenty of examples of really great receivers being had after Round 1, but look at the absolute best WRs in the game, year-in and year-out... Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald and Andre Johnson. All of these guys were high first round picks.

I feel like we've tried to get one of those incredible bargains at WR later in the draft for the last few years and haven't been successful. This year, there are three guys that are pretty clearly above the rest... Blackmon, Jeffery and Floyd.

If we were able to get any of these three, I would be incredibly happy... However, even within this group, I feel there is a gap between Blackmon and the other two. He reminds me of a more rangy Greg Jennings. I've been enamored by this guy since the beginning of the 2010 season and now we may be in position to get him.

If we drafted Blackmon and took care of the right side of our line, I feel that THEN it would be fair to judge McCoy's performances as an indicator of whether or not he will succeed as a starting QB.

With the team that we had last year, I honestly think that you could put Tom Brady out there and he wouldn't have a ton more success. Our guys just cannot get separation. If your WRs literally cannot get open, what is a QB supposed to do? Of course, he is supposed to check-down, run, take the sack or throw it away... None of those choices are all that appealing.

No, I don't think that the QB was the problem this season. He may not be the answer, but I don't know that for sure yet... And I want to be sure before we spend the No. 4 overall pick on a risky replacement.

I do think that Greg Little could become a nice WR2 and MoMass could even be a viable WR3 if they had a guy across the field like Blackmon or Floyd or Jeffery. I think people would be shocked by the leaps that Browns offense would take with that kind of threat on the field.

I'd love to stumble into a Mike Wallace later on in the draft, but I sort of feel like, if that were going to happen, it would have already happened with Little, Robiskie or MoMass. Now, it is time to go after the clear stud.

Hey, I'm not opposed to taking WRs with BOTH of our first round picks. That is how week our receiving corps are. I would be fired up about a Blackmon/Floyd tandem with Little moving to the WR3 slot.

I can't emphasize enough just how badly this team needs talent on the outside.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCY
Well I think the Top 10 finish is pretty misleading for the reasons I mentioned. I do agree that it is the best unit on the team by far and needs less attention than the O, but it's still an average D overall IMO.

Well, we can get away from the general statements about the defense and focus on the individuals that are actually out there...

Start with the defensive line...

LDE -Jabaal Sheard
DT - Phil Taylor
DT - Ahtyba Rubin
RDE - Jayme Mitchell

That is a very nice, very young defensive front. Taylor and Rubin are one of the best young inside tandems in the entire league. Jabaal Sheard just had a rookie season in which he led all rookie defensive linemen in sacks (8.5) and he is a complete and total stud... A possible future star in this league. Mitchell impressed me toward the end of last season. He has a nice motor and he is also relatively young (6th season). There is certainly no reason to address this unit early in the draft... It is stout.

Linebackers...

SLB - Chris Gocong
MLB - D'Qwell Jackson
WLB - Kaluka Maiava

The weakest part of our defense is probably these outside linebackers. But, that said, Gocong showed some things in the second half of the season and Maiava is still young enough to become something in this league. D'Qwell, meanwhile, truly is amongst the best MLBs in the NFL and he should have gotten serious consideration for the Pro Bowl after the year he had. He led the NFL in solo tackles and led all MLBs in tackles for loss.

Could we use an explosive WLB and use Maiava as a backup? Sure. But, that isn't exactly a dire need at the moment.

Secondary....

LCB - Joe Haden
RCB - Sheldon Brown
SS - TJ Ward
FS - Mike Adams

Haden, Ward and Adams make up a very young, very good core in the secondary. Haden is as good as it gets for young CBs and Ward, while injured this past season, has shown that he can be the kind of dynamite SS that the AFC North is known for. Mike Adams really impressed me this past season, as did young Usama Young, who filled in admirably for Ward for the majority of the season. The weak link is Sheldon Brown, only because he is probably a bit too long in the tooth to be a full-time corner in the NFL.

Yeah, we could use another excellent young CB to put across from Haden, but it isn't exactly a necessity. The reason that this unit excelled in coverage wasn't because teams were having "too much success running the ball to bother throwing." It is because this unit was really, really good, especially Haden, who was going against the other team's best WRs all season and, more often than not, closing the door on them.


So, in summation, the two areas on the defense where we could use some help in the draft is RCB and OLB. However, when you have this much young talent on a defense, they can make up for a couple of deficiencies in a couple of spots.

The Browns were the youngest team in the entire NFL last year, with 1/3 of the roster being in either their first or second year. This defensive unit is the main reason why... And, they performed well under difficult circumstances. They will continue to get better, too.


A similar breakdown of the offense would yield much more troubling results.

Last edited by RedBlackAttack : 01-09-2012 at 02:27 AM.
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Old 01-09-2012, 11:03 AM   #40
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
What does that even mean?
it means what you knew it meant...and no offense was intended

Browns franchise hasn't had any success of any sort in a long long time...I mean fck it, might as well take risks on players with ridiculous upside like Griffen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
And, I disagree completely that Colt is 'horrible.' He was playing behind probably the worst right side in the NFL and definitely trying to throw to the worst crop of WRs in the league. Also, it isn't even like he had a running game to take pressure off of him and keep defenses honest since our line was decimated before the season even started and then our first, second and third string RBs were injured for the majority of the season.

Blaming that meager offense on Colt is ridiculous, imo. I'm still unsure about whether or not he could be a good starting QB in this league. He has been dealt an absolutely awful hand thus far.
I agree that Colt hasn't been given a fair shot and almost any QB would fail in his situation...similar to Bradford this year

I just don't have faith in Colt as an NFL QB...yet
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Old 01-09-2012, 11:11 AM   #41
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
it means what you knew it meant...and no offense was intended

Browns franchise hasn't had any success of any sort in a long long time...I mean fck it, might as well take risks on players with ridiculous upside like Griffen.


I agree that Colt hasn't been given a fair shot and almost any QB would fail in his situation...similar to Bradford this year

I just don't have faith in Colt as an NFL QB...yet

Which is exactly why they shouldn't draft RGIII and instead draft o-lineman and a WR to give him Colt a fair chance.
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Old 01-09-2012, 11:19 AM   #42
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by irondarts
Which is exactly why they shouldn't draft RGIII and instead draft o-lineman and a WR to give him Colt a fair chance.
because they don't have faith in him yet either?

they should have faith RIGHT NOW
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Old 01-09-2012, 03:26 PM   #43
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

RBA, what would you prefer?
Richardson/Floyd or Blackmon/Miller
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Old 01-09-2012, 04:46 PM   #44
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack
I want nothing to do with RG3. I'm so completely against taking him that a part of me hopes he stays in school, just to completely rule out the possibility.

It isn't that I feel that Colt McCoy is absolutely our QB of the future, but for me, RGIII is a tremendous risk. He is undersized and he is coming from a Baylor offense that is so gimmicky that it is hard to judge whether or not he can run a pro-style offense.

It isn't that I feel that RGIII will be an absolute bust, either. But, he is a risk and our franchise is in no position to take that kind of risk that high in a draft that we need to produce gamebreakers.

Our two biggest needs are getting playmaking WRs and the right side of the line. So, I want us to use our two first round picks on those two areas.

Justin Blackmon and the best available OLineman at 22 is my dream scenario. If Blackmon is not there, then maybe take the best available O-lineman at 4 (Martin?) and then either Jeffrey or Michael Floyd with our next pick.

Whatever we do, RGIII should not be part of the discussion, imo. Too risky... Way too risky.


Ugh, RG3 has the best gamebreaker skillset probably of anybody in the draft.
RG3 is more intelligent than anybody on your roster that matters and more dynamic too.

I feel you're wrong but I hope Cleveland is thinking like you because I want him in burgundy and gold. You were wrong about another Baylor product too that went to Cleveland- Mr. Phil Taylor. You're wrong here as well but wish you were the GM for the Browns this April
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Old 01-09-2012, 04:48 PM   #45
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Default Re: Cleveland Browns Draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBeasley08
RBA, what would you prefer?
Richardson/Floyd or Blackmon/Miller
If the choice is between those two combinations? I go Blackmon/Miller. I'm almost as avidly against taking Richardson at No. 4 as I am taking RG3 with the pick. It would take a really incredible, unique RB for me to consider taking one that high. Like, an Adrian Peterson type of sure-thing superstar.

Richardson isn't that. I do think he will be a good pro, but finding RBs is relatively easy in the NFL. It is probably the easiest position to fill and the most likely position to find a diamond in the rough if you have a good offensive line.

When our line was healthy last season, Hillis -- who was a relative no-name -- made his way onto the Madden cover.

There are so many talented runners that there literally aren't enough NFL teams to contain them all. If you have a good offensive line, which we will after we address one spot and get Steinbach back next year, you can find a RB to produce behind it.

In fact, I don't really like the idea of taking Miller with our second first rounder for those same reasons. The earliest I would take a RB is late second round.

If we got Blackmon with our pick at No. 4, I'd like to see one of the following with the 22nd pick...

Zach Brown (OLB)
Cordy Glenn (G)
Michael Floyd (WR) -yep... I would take two WRs if he was still available
Courtney Upshaw (OLB)
Alshon Jeffery (WR)
Zebrie Sanders (OT)

The guy I would REALLY want if we got Blackmon at 4 would be Jonathan Martin or Riley Reiff, the two best OTs on the board after Kalil. But, it is safe to assume that they will both be gone before the 22nd pick. There seems to be a bit of a drop in talent at that position after those three are off the board.

Really, while I'd love to get Blackmon with that first pick, we might be better off if Kalil somehow fell to us at 4. Then, we could take whoever drops to us at 22 between Jeffery and Floyd.

With the second round pick, I like the idea of grabbing Chase Minnifield (CB). He is a very good prospect and it would be awesome to see one of the original dawgs' sons on the field for the Browns.
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