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Old 01-19-2012, 11:08 PM   #76
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
Allow me to play devil's advocate here. I think it's fairly kneejerk and ridiculous to use words like scrub and trash in assessing Amare. Is he having a terrible year? Yes. Let's just call a spade a spade though. It's just that...a bad year. I don't think it's grounds to negate his entire All Star career. I mean with all of our problems, he did single handedly make us relevant. I think he at least deserves that much respect. Not saying he's out of the dog house, but to say he's without talent is absurd.
No, CLUTCH is right. He's scum. He should commit seppuku at center court.
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Old 01-20-2012, 08:42 AM   #77
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Amar'e has always been what he is. A superstar, but not an elite superstar.
He surely can't win a ring as "the man".
I am saying it now but I thought it last year as well, when he was the leader of the Knicks.
He can be a leader, but not the leader of a contender.
Because he doesn't play D, and because while he's a beast offensively he can't create his own shot like other legit superstars.

I am sure many of us are overreacting now because of his poor performance (due to both the lack of a PG and the presence of Tyson in the paint)... but c'mon he's certainly not trash.
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Old 01-20-2012, 09:12 AM   #78
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Crazy part about this is, some people are downplaying the importance of a PG when it comes to Amare, and when they explain themselves, they prove my point. People say "he's good but he can't create his own shot". Well guess what... most PF can't. Most quality PF have a go to move but few can create off the dribble. That's what he's been trying to do and that's where he's getting into trouble. No PF or C that's not being double teamed, should have almost 3 TO a game. That's indicative of poor PG play, poor coaching and Amare not getting to the spots on the floor where he's most effective.

I think if we are firm in having him as part of core going forward, we should bring in Pat Ewing as an assistant or maybe even head coach. Dwight was less coordinated offensively than Amare was coming out of HS. I saw Dwight play in HS. While Dwight isn't dominant offensively, I don't think people give Pat enough credit for his improvement.
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Old 01-20-2012, 09:16 AM   #79
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
Crazy part about this is, some people are downplaying the importance of a PG when it comes to Amare, and when they explain themselves, they prove my point. People say "he's good but he can't create his own shot". Well guess what... most PF can't. Most quality PF have a go to move but few can create off the dribble. That's what he's been trying to do and that's where he's getting into trouble. No PF or C that's not being double teamed, should have almost 3 TO a game. That's indicative of poor PG play, poor coaching and Amare not getting to the spots on the floor where he's most effective.

I think if we are firm in having him as part of core going forward, we should bring in Pat Ewing as an assistant or maybe even head coach. Dwight was less coordinated offensively than Amare was coming out of HS. I saw Dwight play in HS. While Dwight isn't dominant offensively, I don't think people give Pat enough credit for his improvement.

True, and in fact most PFs aren't leaders of a contender.
The only exception being Dirk.
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Old 01-20-2012, 09:37 AM   #80
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

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Originally Posted by Scoooter
Of course he has. Last year. With the Knicks. We all saw it.


.500 was an improvement over the year before. And there's more to leadership than just the record. He was the first major free agent to sign that summer. He really embraced the city, put the team on his back, and brought he franchise back to relevancy. He absolutely demonstrated the ability to lead.


It's a team sport. Amar'e being better playing with competent teammates isn't a knock on him. That's how things are supposed to be. Melo's an iso player who gets his own numbers at the expense of team ball. He's been that way his whole career. He's not going to win a championship doing it.

So Amare is a great leader because his team was at .500 but Melo is a poor leader because his team was over .500 but not able to reach the Finals.

Also Amare turned a 29-53 team to a 42-40 team.
Melo turned a 17-65 team to a 43-39 team as a ROOKIE.

Do you even see what you're writing ?

Last edited by Clutch : 01-20-2012 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 01-20-2012, 11:09 AM   #81
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasi
Amar'e has always been what he is. A superstar, but not an elite superstar.
He surely can't win a ring as "the man".
I am saying it now but I thought it last year as well, when he was the leader of the Knicks.
He can be a leader, but not the leader of a contender.
Because he doesn't play D, and because while he's a beast offensively he can't create his own shot like other legit superstars.

I am sure many of us are overreacting now because of his poor performance (due to both the lack of a PG and the presence of Tyson in the paint)... but c'mon he's certainly not trash.
if he can't win a ring as the best player on a team, he's no superstar. he has always all-star level in my mind prior to this season, albeit an overrated one. you can't be just a finisher in this league and be poor in every other aspect of basketball (passing, rebounding, defense, etc).

as far as this season goes, every player goes through slumps. it's what you can do besides scoring that will prove your worth.
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Old 01-20-2012, 11:13 AM   #82
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

There is a kid in Portland thats leading that team for the past 2 years from the PF position.
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Old 01-20-2012, 11:17 AM   #83
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

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Originally Posted by Rameek
There is a kid in Portland thats leading that team for the past 2 years from the PF position.


And since when are they contenders?
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Old 01-20-2012, 12:04 PM   #84
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rameek
There is a kid in Portland thats leading that team for the past 2 years from the PF position.
Statistically he isn't, except points and minutes played.
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Old 01-20-2012, 12:04 PM   #85
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

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Originally Posted by Jasi
And since when are they contenders?
Well they have been decimated by injuries but they have been in the playoffs the past 5 years in a stacked west.

Last edited by knickscity : 01-20-2012 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 01-20-2012, 12:15 PM   #86
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

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Originally Posted by Rameek
Well they have been decimated by injuries but they have been in the playoffs the past 5 years in a stacked west.
No, they haven't.
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Old 01-20-2012, 01:19 PM   #87
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

All this PG talk just happens because of how Nash completely masked how crappy D'Antoni really is. Let's just say that i saw yesterday Eddy Curry, i'll repeat, Eddy Curry, set 3 screens in just one Miami offensive possession. That's the amount that all the Knicks team do in one full game. And from that 3 screens only 1 was close to the 3 point line, where all Knicks screens happen.

Yes i'm exaggerating... but not that much.
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Old 01-20-2012, 01:31 PM   #88
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue&Orange
All this PG talk just happens because of how Nash completely masked how crappy D'Antoni really is. Let's just say that i saw yesterday Eddy Curry, i'll repeat, Eddy Curry, set 3 screens in just one Miami offensive possession. That's the amount that all the Knicks team do in one full game. And from that 3 screens only 1 was close to the 3 point line, where all Knicks screens happen.

Yes i'm exaggerating... but not that much.
The Knicks are a severe work in progress.

OT: Curry was moving on the screen he set near the three point line, but I do think he will be a useful piece for them in Miami.

He has all the SUPPORT in the world down there.
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Old 01-20-2012, 02:44 PM   #89
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

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Originally Posted by knickscity
The Knicks are a severe work in progress.

"Oooooooohhhh So nooooooooowwww you getting scared"-Ice Cube in Friday

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Old 01-20-2012, 02:57 PM   #90
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Default Re: Evaluating the Knicks

Quote:
Originally Posted by franchize
"Oooooooohhhh So nooooooooowwww you getting scared"-Ice Cube in Friday

There's a difference between what I said, and "lost cause".

I'm giving it a chance to improve, but I'm not blaming the bench for why the starters are not playing to their potential.
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