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Old 03-16-2012, 12:42 PM   #16
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crown&Coke
at first glance, the deal seemed like a pure salary dump. As Fish got a 3.4 mil player option that he said he would pick up the second the ink was layed on his contract.

Jordan Hill is expiring this year. (and me thinks he won't get any time either, unless something drastic happens, Houston was looking for a 5 man while they had this guy on their team, that should tell you all you need to know)

But there could have been some other internal stuff due to how crazy this season has been;

-Maybe Mike Brown wanted him gone after he got his pick and roll pg, and was growing tired of the "lets play the triangle again"
-Maybe the front office wanted to get rid of one of the leaders who was pretty much trying to get the coaching staff to "fix" the offense
-maybe they didn't want to keep him as the starter while still having 2 capable pg's on the team
-maybe there's some CBA backlash
-maybe they want to get rid of everyone who supported Phil Jackson and BShaw
-maybe Stern wanted Fish to be the star in Houston

whatev, was a sad day for me, Fish is my fav player, not only due to his play but his character. can't teach clutch.. and can't teach heart.. and can't teach character..

best of luck to my dude, will always be a Laker, will always be a champion

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Old 03-16-2012, 01:08 PM   #17
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

I don't think there is a conspiracy come on. It's simple....Fish was a triangle offense Phil Jackson pg. Phil is gone along with the offense and Fisher was slow and not our best option in Browns system. It sucks we will all miss Fish but that's it. Times have change and we got a pick n roll young pg who will help our team.
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Old 03-16-2012, 02:22 PM   #18
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crown&Coke
at first glance, the deal seemed like a pure salary dump. As Fish got a 3.4 mil player option that he said he would pick up the second the ink was layed on his contract.

Jordan Hill is expiring this year. (and me thinks he won't get any time either, unless something drastic happens, Houston was looking for a 5 man while they had this guy on their team, that should tell you all you need to know)

But there could have been some other internal stuff due to how crazy this season has been;

-Maybe Mike Brown wanted him gone after he got his pick and roll pg, and was growing tired of the "lets play the triangle again"
-Maybe the front office wanted to get rid of one of the leaders who was pretty much trying to get the coaching staff to "fix" the offense
-maybe they didn't want to keep him as the starter while still having 2 capable pg's on the team
-maybe there's some CBA backlash
-maybe they want to get rid of everyone who supported Phil Jackson and BShaw
-maybe Stern wanted Fish to be the star in Houston

whatev, was a sad day for me, Fish is my fav player, not only due to his play but his character. can't teach clutch.. and can't teach heart.. and can't teach character..

best of luck to my dude, will always be a Laker, will always be a champion

That was good post, pal. Agreed 100%

Never going to forget Mr Derek Fisher, one of the classiest players in the nba. One moment I will always remember is the 0.4 second shot against the Spurs.. This man could ball! Came into league same season as Kobe and did much for this organization.

He will always be a Laker in my book. Always. Thank-you Derek Fisher. You are the man.
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Old 03-16-2012, 04:55 PM   #19
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

I've already read a ton of articles confirming what Lakerfreak said.
It's very clear they were afraid of Fish's leadership and were afraid to have him here unhappy on the bench.......gotta run....no time to post it but read the LA Times. Bill Plaschke for one.
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Old 03-16-2012, 09:46 PM   #20
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Yeah, come to think of it, that article that DKLaker posted about utilizing the triangle again, could be part of the reason. Fisher was probably behind that. After all the changes since Jim Buss took over, this place just isn't the same anymore. By getting rid of everyone close to Kobe, they can eventually cut ties....

Or maybe they did it in spite of Kobe ripping management.
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Old 03-16-2012, 11:42 PM   #21
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
I've already read a ton of articles confirming what Lakerfreak said.
It's very clear they were afraid of Fish's leadership and were afraid to have him here unhappy on the bench.......gotta run....no time to post it but read the LA Times. Bill Plaschke for one.

Here is the Bill Plaschke article I mentioned, in it he refers to the "Quiet Chaos"
the Lakers were afraid of Fish causing. A very good read.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basket...4601319.column


Lakerfreak my friend, I'm glad I finally opened your eyes......lol.

Last edited by DKLaker : 03-16-2012 at 11:52 PM.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:38 AM   #22
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

I was actually talking about this same thing with a friend today. I don't think it's a conspiracy theory at all. I believe it's a part of the reason why he was traded. I don't think it was the only reason or the main reason though. It's about 50/50 this and his contract. The Lakers really didn't want to pay him. This much is obvious. The trades they made were to save money. They didn't get Beasley largely because they weren't willing to take on the money. They wanted to move another bad contract (like Fish) and the T-Wolves weren't having that. The Lakers did clear up a ton of cap space. It doesn't mean they're huge players in the FA market because they still have a high payroll, but it does show there's probably more moves to be made this offseason.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:22 PM   #23
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
Here is the Bill Plaschke article I mentioned, in it he refers to the "Quiet Chaos"
the Lakers were afraid of Fish causing. A very good read.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basket...4601319.column


Lakerfreak my friend, I'm glad I finally opened your eyes......lol.

lol Oh please I have 20/20 vision.....with my glasses on anyways :p loool

I will be honest however that I could not deny the fact that the problems happened because of our point guard's play.

Why else would they have player only meetings to bring the triangle back? It was probably Derek Fisher's way of saying "We need the triangle, because I suck in a traditional offense".

Now that we got Ramon Sessions, look for execution to be much better. The triangle will be long forgotten. Plus we got Sessions to prove himself into becoming a laker legend one day. He has the tools, now he needs the passion, and the intensity, and the consistency.
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Old 03-17-2012, 04:49 PM   #24
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
lol Oh please I have 20/20 vision.....with my glasses on anyways :p loool

I will be honest however that I could not deny the fact that the problems happened because of our point guard's play.

Why else would they have player only meetings to bring the triangle back? It was probably Derek Fisher's way of saying "We need the triangle, because I suck in a traditional offense".

Now that we got Ramon Sessions, look for execution to be much better. The triangle will be long forgotten. Plus we got Sessions to prove himself into becoming a laker legend one day. He has the tools, now he needs the passion, and the intensity, and the consistency.

Did Fisher suck....yes.....no doubt about it......but to claim that it was all him or that the entire team wasn't upset with Brown is extremely naive......most if not all of the team voiced their displeasure with the way Brown does things.
Brown was afraid of Fish because he is an organizer and leader.....he wanted Fish to be the "Company Guy" and pretend that all is great......but Fish wouldn't kiss @ss like that......and he brought out those meetings largely at the request of the other players. Obviously they were worried that he would lead a revolt to remove Brown if he didn't get his playing time.....so he was moved.......it really had more to do with that than the money savings.
This is coming out more and more in interviews, chatter and articles.
Even with Sessions we could struggle because Brown does not know how to run or design plays or run an offense in any way....and he's not going to suddenly learn.

Again.....the meetings were not to bring the triangle back.....they were more to address players who didn't like Brown's methods or substitutions. The triangle issue was because Brown has no offense.....so the players wanted to run an offense....ANY offense......it didn't have to be the triangle......do you understand?

Last edited by DKLaker : 03-17-2012 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 03-17-2012, 06:40 PM   #25
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

1. I will never ever forget those great clutch shots in San Antonio, Orlando and Boston. OMG, i just realized all those shots were made on the road, infront of a hostile crowd.
And Im not just referring to that last second shot vs the Spurs but game 2 in 2001 with the Lakers upsetting the heavily favored Spurs in game 1, then followed it up with another victory with Fish' baseline jumper.
There was also another big game 1 in Sacramento where he shot great as they took home court advantage.
2.Having said that, I was steaming made when I watched a HOuston game where he got torched by Aaron Brooks. Not only did he fail to defend but he also shot like 2 of 15 that game.
3. Lastly, I was relieved to know that they kept Steve Blake. While everyone focussed on athletism, ability to penetrate, being emotional, Steve has quietely been fairly effective with his role. There was a string of games where he averaged 5 assists/game in limited minutes. BTW, his career 3pt% ave is 40%. That I think could really help the Lakers cause in the playoffs.
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Old 03-17-2012, 06:47 PM   #26
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
Did Fisher suck....yes.....no doubt about it......but to claim that it was all him or that the entire team wasn't upset with Brown is extremely naive......most if not all of the team voiced their displeasure with the way Brown does things.
Brown was afraid of Fish because he is an organizer and leader.....he wanted Fish to be the "Company Guy" and pretend that all is great......but Fish wouldn't kiss @ss like that......and he brought out those meetings largely at the request of the other players. Obviously they were worried that he would lead a revolt to remove Brown if he didn't get his playing time.....so he was moved.......it really had more to do with that than the money savings.
This is coming out more and more in interviews, chatter and articles.
Even with Sessions we could struggle because Brown does not know how to run or design plays or run an offense in any way....and he's not going to suddenly learn.

Again.....the meetings were not to bring the triangle back.....they were more to address players who didn't like Brown's methods or substitutions. The triangle issue was because Brown has no offense.....so the players wanted to run an offense....ANY offense......it didn't have to be the triangle......do you understand?
OMG

How on earth is it possible that a team can win 19 of 21 home games with NO offense.
A team with a VERY LIMITED Fisher,
As you claimed, Pau as soft as a puppy crap.
A struggling Ron Artest etc etc etc.
ohhh I forgot it's all bec of Kobe's immaculate shooting of 43%FG and 29% from the 3pt line and his 4 turnover/game.
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Old 03-17-2012, 10:56 PM   #27
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamaraw08
OMG

How on earth is it possible that a team can win 19 of 21 home games with NO offense.
A team with a VERY LIMITED Fisher,
As you claimed, Pau as soft as a puppy crap.
A struggling Ron Artest etc etc etc.
ohhh I forgot it's all bec of Kobe's immaculate shooting of 43%FG and 29% from the 3pt line and his 4 turnover/game.

In case you are completely unaware.....and you do seem to be, this is the worst offensive team in Lakers History since the invention of the shot clock in 1955......that's right 1955, if you want to argue that we have a problem with offense then you don't understand the game.
The players themselves complained about the offense so much that they wanted to throw it out and go back to the triangle......it's clueless of you to even begin to argue what I am saying because these are known facts.
Kobe even refused to run a play that Brown drew up at the end of a game......he knew it wouldn't work and that going into Bynum was a better option. It's ridiculous to even argue this.....Kobe said it himself.
You seem oblivious to factual arguments.....just because you win games....barely, doesn't mean you have a good offense.....and we certainly don't. James Worthy has been bashing Brown's lack of a coherent offensive plan as well......but YOU actually want to argue
If you want to argue....make sure it's something debatable....in this case you have no idea what you are talking about.....END.

It's very childish to bring up every argument ever made in every thread....why not simply argue the issue being discussed in the thread in which you are posting in......not your constant bringing up things as far back as 4 years........this is why we have separate threads for different topics......if you don't follow this it becomes a big mess to read through.

Please stick to the topic you read in this thread.

LMAO, you cannot help but put your anti Kobe crap in 90% of your posts.

I only mention Kobe in probably 10% of my posts......probably much less.
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Old 03-19-2012, 06:10 PM   #28
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
In case you are completely unaware.....and you do seem to be, this is the worst offensive team in Lakers History since the invention of the shot clock in 1955......that's right 1955, if you want to argue that we have a problem with offense then you don't understand the game.
The players themselves complained about the offense so much that they wanted to throw it out and go back to the triangle......it's clueless of you to even begin to argue what I am saying because these are known facts.
Kobe even refused to run a play that Brown drew up at the end of a game......he knew it wouldn't work and that going into Bynum was a better option. It's ridiculous to even argue this.....Kobe said it himself.
You seem oblivious to factual arguments.....just because you win games....barely, doesn't mean you have a good offense.....and we certainly don't. James Worthy has been bashing Brown's lack of a coherent offensive plan as well......but YOU actually want to argue
If you want to argue....make sure it's something debatable....in this case you have no idea what you are talking about.....END.

It's very childish to bring up every argument ever made in every thread....why not simply argue the issue being discussed in the thread in which you are posting in......not your constant bringing up things as far back as 4 years........this is why we have separate threads for different topics......if you don't follow this it becomes a big mess to read through.

Please stick to the topic you read in this thread.

LMAO, you cannot help but put your anti Kobe crap in 90% of your posts.

I only mention Kobe in probably 10% of my posts......probably much less.
Whoa, Dude, Im not saying that Mike Brown is a great offensive coach, Im reacting to your statement that he has NO OFFENSE!!!
YOu didn't respond to that question. HOw on earth are they scoring then?
A ton of put backs? 80% of it is players freelancing?
I think most fans agree Fisher is very limited, Don't you agree?
How about Metta, you don't think he is really struggling?
Didn't you say a million times over that Pau is very soft? So how are they scoring?
Again, Im not saying they have a great offensive system but to say that Brown is clueless, "no offense" is wrong IMO. If he is then what about the teams that are scoring less and assisting less and turning it over more?
This year,
Lakers is 11th best in FG%, 19 other teams are shooting worse!
Lakers have the 10th best in the league in assists, higher than 20 other teams inspite of the very limited Fisher on the team.
Yes, Lakers are not great in taking care of the ball but Portland who is 10th best just have ONE turnover less per game than the Lakers.
James Big Game Worthy? The guy was a phenomenal player but that are LEGIT REASONS why teams chose not to hire him as coach.
As for players revolting? I disagree, Yes, players would complain, no system is perfect. It was reported last yearthat Heat players didn't like their coach's set patterns either. Bulls' had a severe scoring drought in the last playoffs vs Miami, etc etc etc.
Ok maybe Im clueless, just like you implied. That is why posters here don't respect me unlike you and your numerous green dots under your avatar
You work with players and assistant coaches, you are the basketball god.
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:05 PM   #29
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Default Re: Conspiracy theory about Fisher leaving...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tamaraw08
Whoa, Dude, Im not saying that Mike Brown is a great offensive coach, Im reacting to your statement that he has NO OFFENSE!!!
YOu didn't respond to that question. HOw on earth are they scoring then?
A ton of put backs? 80% of it is players freelancing?
I think most fans agree Fisher is very limited, Don't you agree?
How about Metta, you don't think he is really struggling?
Didn't you say a million times over that Pau is very soft? So how are they scoring?
Again, Im not saying they have a great offensive system but to say that Brown is clueless, "no offense" is wrong IMO. If he is then what about the teams that are scoring less and assisting less and turning it over more?
This year,
Lakers is 11th best in FG%, 19 other teams are shooting worse!
Lakers have the 10th best in the league in assists, higher than 20 other teams inspite of the very limited Fisher on the team.
Yes, Lakers are not great in taking care of the ball but Portland who is 10th best just have ONE turnover less per game than the Lakers.
James Big Game Worthy? The guy was a phenomenal player but that are LEGIT REASONS why teams chose not to hire him as coach.
As for players revolting? I disagree, Yes, players would complain, no system is perfect. It was reported last yearthat Heat players didn't like their coach's set patterns either. Bulls' had a severe scoring drought in the last playoffs vs Miami, etc etc etc.
Ok maybe Im clueless, just like you implied. That is why posters here don't respect me unlike you and your numerous green dots under your avatar
You work with players and assistant coaches, you are the basketball god.

First let me apologize for the "Clueless" comment, I meant clueless about the situation being debated, not about you yourself. If that came off the wrong way then I am sorry.

I can say that there are some things you really don't understand about the game and at times yes, I get impatient with your comments.......I mean, FG% is not an indication of scoring, for you to say it is shows a deficiency of understanding. I have had poor shooting teams that went undefeated because of our rebounding.....our FG% was truly laughable but we would fight for the ball on every possession at both ends of the court so it really didn't matter.....we would eventually get the ball in the hole. You seem to think that a team with the higher shooting % wins every game
There are times a team comes down court, takes 1 shot and misses, the other team comes down court, misses but get the board.....takes 4 tips to get it in......stats say 1 for 5 shooting 20%....if both teams make their next shot, the losing team is at 50% while the winning team is at 33%.
FG% also is effected by the type of shots you are taking.....a team hits 4 of 6 shots for 8 points but is losing to a team hitting 3 of 6 shots for 9 points all 3 pointers......that blows out the shooting percentage for the win right there in simplistic form. I've been coaching a VERY long time so yes, there is pretty much nothing I haven't seen.
Player revolt is well documented this season....probably 20 articles...didn't you READ any of them?

The rest of your comments are How old are you???
Really....how old are you? I thought you were late 20's, now I'm starting to think you are an 18 year old kid or close to it....not to offend you it's that certain ages make certain comments or have certain views.
How is Pau scoring if he is soft Really? Is that a real question?
I would love to see a reporter ask a NBA player who has said Pau is soft that question There are tough players in the NBA, Soft players, Clutch players, Chokers, guys who step up under pressure and guys who run from pressure.....you don't seem to grasp that concept.
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