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Old 06-28-2013, 03:40 PM   #4141
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by qrich
No, the media made the case racial when they implied Zimmerman was a full white male with photo shopped images, along with editing the 911 tape, and making it seem like he hunted down a black person for no apparent season and some people decided to keep running with that.

And you are contributing to America being a racist country with some of this bullshit you are spewing. Grow out of it. You don't see me talking shit about Turkey or backing up anything that is anti-Turkish/going against everything pro-Turkish do you? When this was more recent and much more severe.
I can't gauge or tell you what to value and what not to value. I definitely can't judge if MY struggle or the struggle of my people were greater or lesser than yours. Idk how YOU do that.

This case is close to me because I have cousins that look like Trayvon and a young son who is growing up in racist America. Mind you, racism is intitutionalized...me being racist isn't going to stop anyone from getting a job, and education, or a loan. Me being racist isn't going to create a slave like prison industry. me being racist isn't going to change the fact that many of my peoples got harder sentences for crack than whites did for the same amount of cocaine.

I love everyone but I'm not going to pull punches for you guys...if you can't see where I'm coming from I do not apologize.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:41 PM   #4142
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

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Originally Posted by Go Getter
My thing is that he points to Trayvon being violent, Trayvon doing this and that when trayvon's mistake could have been handled. He could have gotten therapy and matured and grown into a man.

I don't want to live in a world where punks with guns that can't fight guys 50 pounds lighter than them decide to shoot because they don't have the balls to take an L.

Yes he could have. Or he could have avoided it and ended up being the next John Allen Muhammad.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:41 PM   #4143
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
Zimmerman took 1 1/2 years of instruction at Kokopelli's gym in Orlando, a gym that boasts being 'the most complete fight training in the world'. Plus he took several citizen police academy classes, so he knew a thing or two about ground fighting/defense.
There was a question earlier in this thread about how long he was trained. Where did you find that info?
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:42 PM   #4144
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real JW
"Taking an L" in this case could have been brain damage, coma or death. It's not about balls. It's not a boxing match.
Could have but he isn't. That's what happens when you approach ppl at night with a gun.

It was a fight...smh....it had everything to do with balls.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:43 PM   #4145
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
Really? You don't see what's wrong with that? A kid walking home from the store. A grown man stalking him saying things like 'these assholes always get away', jumping out his car to chase after him while saying 'f**** expletives'? That's his depraved mind state right there. He, FALSELY, concluded that Trayvon Martin was a criminal there to commit a criminal act and then took it upon himself to chase him down and try to detain him. It shows anger, frustration, animosity.
Its not depraved for Peja Notwitzki.


Quote:
According to Zim all Trayvon was doing was walking in the rain, he wasn't trying to break into any houses, he wasn't damaging any property... yet Zim concluded he was an 'asshole' who was 'going to get away' and a 'f*** ****' that he jumped out of his car to chase after and detain.

That's completely and utterly irrational.



Quote:
According to Zim, the only reason he jumped out of his car a second after saying 'oh shit, he's running!' was to get an address... really

And murder is most definitely a violation of the law.



Quote:
A neighbor came out and asked him if he wanted him to call 911, George said no 'I need you to help me restrain [Trayvon]'.

So he knew he had shot the kid by that point but instead of letting someone call an ambulance for him, he wanted the guy to help him do what he had originally set out to do- restrain Trayvon Martin.

These were his words.
Yeah, a small statement, but a definite look at his carelessness for human life. He knew he shot him in the heart. If things happen in the heat of the moment you just admit it, say it got out of hand and you have remorse. This guy seemingly never had it.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:46 PM   #4146
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by FillJackson
There was a question earlier in this thread about how long he was trained. Where did you find that info?

Prosecutor mentioned it in opening statements. I also remember reading somewhere before that it was 21 months that he trained there.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:47 PM   #4147
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Getter
I can't gauge or tell you what to value and what not to value. I definitely can't judge if MY struggle or the struggle of my people were greater or lesser than yours. Idk how YOU do that.

This case is close to me because I have cousins that look like Trayvon and a young son who is growing up in racist America. Mind you, racism is intitutionalized...me being racist isn't going to stop anyone from getting a job, and education, or a loan. Me being racist isn't going to create a slave like prison industry. me being racist isn't going to change the fact that many of my peoples got harder sentences for crack than whites did for the same amount of cocaine.

I love everyone but I'm not going to pull punches for you guys...if you can't see where I'm coming from I do not apologize.

I'm not judging anything. I'm simply stating that one was more recent and 75% of the population was lost along with a vast majority of land. But that is entirely a different topic.

And no, this case was made racist by the media. To have the mindset you have is not going to do anything but continue on the racism which may exist. Just like I realized, me having hatred towards the people of Turkey, unless they give me a reason to or flat out deny history, is not going to contribute towards progress but continue on the hate between the two nations that need to find a middle ground.

Edit: I'm sticking to this topic now, not going to go off topic anymore.

Last edited by qrich : 06-28-2013 at 03:51 PM.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:51 PM   #4148
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by dude77
zim was a good guy .. I don't see him initiating a physical fight with tm

The ATF, his ex fiance, Daniel Osmun, Tim Hudik, the cousin he molested, and a few party goers where he bounced would vehemently disagree with your assessment.
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:52 PM   #4149
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
The ATF, his ex fiance, Daniel Osmun, Tim Hudik, the cousin he molested, and a few party goers where he bounced would vehemently disagree with your assessment.

lmao point noted
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Old 06-28-2013, 03:53 PM   #4150
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by qrich
I'm not judging anything. I'm simply stating that one was more recent and 75% of the population was lost along with a vast majority of land. But that is entirely a different topic.

And no, this case was made racist by the media. To have the mindset you have is not going to do anything but continue on the racism which may exist. Just like I realized, me having hatred towards the people of Turkey, unless they give me a reason to or flat out deny history, is not going to contribute towards progress but continue on the hate between the two nations that need to find a middle ground.


You are judging. I could go into this back and forth but it is useless. You cannot feel my struggle and i can't feel yours which is why i will say I am sorry for your loss/hardship man.

What mindset do I have? First off man don't assume you know me. How many kids have you gotten into college? how many kids have you tutored and mentored? How many soccer/sports camps have you run? How many PCs have you given to needy kids?

I have done ALL of those things for kids that happen to be mostly white. I can compartmentalize my issues with race and still love individuals. I spend a goodly amount of time promoting peace.

I will not deny that I have an emotional stake in this issue, but even still, I have never asked for GZs blood, I have never said I KNOW he should be charged for murder and get the death penalty...I have said from my gut that I think he deserves jail time. If you ask me I tyhink he liked to target young brown kids. Does that mean his life should be over? Idk either...I don't like making those calls and I do not envy those that have that task.

But one thing I want to leave you with is that you haven't been in my shoes. As an AF veteran that risked his ass for this country i still get followed by cops and pulled over for nothing. Shit, my little brother was killed by a cop and I still stick up for THE GOOD COPS.

I'm a lot more layered than you ugive me credit for.
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:02 PM   #4151
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
Very simply actually. A whole lot easier than being able to unholster, fully extend your arms, fire a shot that goes straight to back with no angularity, leave no gsr or blood on the front of your clothing... with someone hovering right over you.


again....no blood spaltter means little...especially considering where the bullet entered/clothing

angularity is still up for grabs.....as the DT will bring their own Forensics expert saying the bullet travelled consistent with being fired from bottom



Zimmerman took 1 1/2 years of instruction at Kokopelli's gym in Orlando, a gym that boasts being 'the most complete fight training in the world'. Plus he took several citizen police academy classes, so he knew a thing or two about ground fighting/defense. In fact, he had an interesting exchange with Detective Serino when the question of how he was able to fire came up:
Serino: Compact? And you were able to overpower him as far as holding his wrist, you gained wrist…we call it wrist control…you gained wrist control on him basically, and you were able to basically liberate both hands…

Zimmerman: Yes, sir.

https://www.txantimedia.com/?p=1025
Now most people would respond by saying 'wrist control, dafuq is that? ' but good ole Zimmy knew exactly what Det. Serino was talking about when he said 'we call it wrist control'.

And since MMA is the term du jour...

MMA made easy: Wrist Control Assisting in Transitions

Having a 50 lb weight and probable strength advantage, as well as 1 1/2 MMA and police tactic training really paid off for Zim.

Wrist control doesn't mean transitioning from bottom to top position.....wrist control simply means grabbing the wrist...and most techniques use a 2 on 1 wrist control ( 2 hands grabbing 1 wrist) so you can control the wrist ( but also leaves one arm open).....grabbing 1 on 1 wrist control isn't as effective....

still does not mean he escaped from the bottom



also 1 and half years at a gym?.....ok.....so now he can fight?

- .....most times it's 2 - 3 times a week for 90 minutes.....could GZ learn some good technique?....yes.....will it work when someone is on top of him punching him in the face?......

- You could take some random joe from the street and train him for 3 years...doesn't mean he would win a fight vs anyone......especially if he's not used to really getting hit in the face.......many times people get hit in the face and shutdown mentally
.






So the person on top at that moment, Zim was in a lower position. Mystery solved.

or he was on the bottom getting hit...just as the witness said

He said several times he didn't see or hear a single punch be thrown and even conceded that it was possible that the person on top was just trying to hold down the other. Didn't see or hear any head bashing on concrete either for the record.

he said downward "arm movements".....with TM on top.....he also said he believed GZ was screaming for help...but wasn't 100% sure

look at GZ injurys......busted nose and busted head.....much more evidence shows that GZ is the correct...as with the witness




See the above


40lbs advantage....means little with someone punching you in the face....and looking at both men....it certainly wasn't effective weight
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:08 PM   #4152
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
Very simply actually. A whole lot easier than being able to unholster, fully extend your arms, fire a shot that goes straight to back with no angularity, leave no gsr or blood on the front of your clothing... with someone hovering right over you.

Zimmerman took 1 1/2 years of instruction at Kokopelli's gym in Orlando, a gym that boasts being 'the most complete fight training in the world'. Plus he took several citizen police academy classes, so he knew a thing or two about ground fighting/defense. In fact, he had an interesting exchange with Detective Serino when the question of how he was able to fire came up:
Serino: Compact? And you were able to overpower him as far as holding his wrist, you gained wrist…we call it wrist control…you gained wrist control on him basically, and you were able to basically liberate both hands…

Zimmerman: Yes, sir.

https://www.txantimedia.com/?p=1025
Now most people would respond by saying 'wrist control, dafuq is that? ' but good ole Zimmy knew exactly what Det. Serino was talking about when he said 'we call it wrist control'.

And since MMA is the term du jour...

MMA made easy: Wrist Control Assisting in Transitions

Having a 50 lb weight and probable strength advantage, as well as 1 1/2 MMA and police tactic training really paid off for Zim.

So the person on top at that moment, Zim was in a lower position. Mystery solved.

He said several times he didn't see or hear a single punch be thrown and even conceded that it was possible that the person on top was just trying to hold down the other. Didn't see or hear any head bashing on concrete either for the record.

See the above

Thanks DonDadda, I had guessed a couple of the scenario's but you got it down for me. When Zim is telling the story you can tell he has had training as he has proper balance and does things with correct form. He talks of remounting a dead person and inverting both wrist (in classic Akido style), as if the limbs aren't the first to go limp, and then getting up to tell the guy help me apprehend this corpse and make sure it doesn't get away. No remorse, is usually a sign of intent... thought out intent.
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:10 PM   #4153
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWolf24
40lbs advantage....means little with someone punching you in the face....and looking at both men....it certainly wasn't effective weight

Zimmerman- 204 lbs
Trayvon- 158 lbs

That's 46 lbs difference. That's like saying a UFC heavyweight and lightweight are going to engage in an MMA match, mostly on the ground. Regardless of skill level, who would you put money on to win? Then take skill level into account- we know now that despite the defense trying to paint the skinny 17 year old as an MMA expert, it was in fact George Zimmerman who trained at the self-proclaimed 'most complete fight gym in the World' for 1 1/2 years.

I'm out for now
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:16 PM   #4154
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaWolf24
40lbs advantage....means little with someone punching you in the face....and looking at both men....it certainly wasn't effective weight
Training and 40 lbs of man weight is a crazy advantage on a recently turned 17 year old in a wrestling situation. If someone is punching you in the face I would think harder to get his weight off of you to get the gun than anything else.
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Old 06-28-2013, 04:29 PM   #4155
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Default Re: Trayvon Martin Case

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonDadda59
Regardless of skill level, who would you put money on to win?

The 5'11 football player, personally. Not the short, fat insurance underwriter.

The one who had a history of fighting at school and who did this with his bare hands:

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