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Old 06-25-2006, 08:44 PM   #16
lakerfreak
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Originally Posted by millencolin735
I tried no to say anything but the more and more I read your post the more I feel as though you werent watching too many Laker games this season. Now it's kinda hard to type emotion and I just want you to know off the bat that I'm not trying to piss anyone off or stir up a stupid argument I just wanna strongly disagree with your POV's.

First off I dont think there is a chance in hell we get Big Ben cause I dont think he's leaving D-town, and even if he does we can't afford him. Secondly after the all-star break Lamar was a monster and probably the biggest reason we made the playoffs from that point on. Third before Mihm got injured he was having hands down his best season ever in large part to the fact that he was staying outta foul trouble.

I say the Lakers keep this team together cause we could only get better at this point, and just draft either a point or good athletic perimeter defender, and maybe sign a shooter or shotblocker.


I didnt say we were getting Ben. Second of all I watched the 41 home games and some broadcasted road games.

All what we talk about here please dont forget is JUST SPECULATION.

These are Ideas of what could be. I never had any hopes of getting ben.

I was just responding to people who keep suggesting to put Kwame at the Powerforward position, Who I may recall from WATCHING THE GAMES, was not doing well in the PF position and did well over the last 20 games replacing an injured Chris Mihm....Yeah Chris Mihm, you may not remember him because he was injured and i SAW IT happening.

But then again who knows, you probably didn't watch any games

I also want you to know that I believe we should keep this team together and draft a pg also unless of course there is a trade where we get extreme value in return.
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Old 06-26-2006, 07:18 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
I didnt say we were getting Ben. Second of all I watched the 41 home games and some broadcasted road games.

All what we talk about here please dont forget is JUST SPECULATION.

These are Ideas of what could be. I never had any hopes of getting ben.

I was just responding to people who keep suggesting to put Kwame at the Powerforward position, Who I may recall from WATCHING THE GAMES, was not doing well in the PF position and did well over the last 20 games replacing an injured Chris Mihm....Yeah Chris Mihm, you may not remember him because he was injured and i SAW IT happening.

But then again who knows, you probably didn't watch any games

I also want you to know that I believe we should keep this team together and draft a pg also unless of course there is a trade where we get extreme value in return.

Ok understood on the whole speculation deal, but it's kinda senseless to speculate over something that has absolutely no chance of happening. Also I watched all Lakers home games and atleast listened to the road games on radio when working, so yes I did atleast listen to just about every game, and from that I was able to realize that Kwame playing pf wasnt the reason he was struggling his lack of confidence and felling that he needed to do to much was the reason for his struggles.

I also have no idea whatsoever on what you were trying say on that whole sentence you spent talking about Mihm, of course I know he was injured, but you would know that if you read my post clearly I said Mihm was having a career year before he got injured. That was probably the biggest reason for me posting, was to point out the fact that Mihm wasnt in foul trouble anywhere near the extent he was in the previous season which allowed him to do what he does so well throughout a 30+ minute span as opposed to a 20 minute span.
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Old 06-26-2006, 08:20 PM   #18
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ODOM has played with the ball in his hands his whole life, IMO he can't adjust to playing with out the ball on offense. He needs to go to a team (without Kobe) that allows he to play his good, the Triangle and Odom don't mix. However, Jackson likes Odom and it seems as if he is not going anywhere.
The Lakers are trying to move Bynum and Mihm. I think Kwame and Lamar should be the ones to go, and Cupcake could make it happen by calling Paxson and Harris and getting Duhon, Mo Williams and Magliore.
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Old 06-26-2006, 11:20 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by BeckDiggLer
ODOM has played with the ball in his hands his whole life, IMO he can't adjust to playing with out the ball on offense. He needs to go to a team (without Kobe) that allows he to play his good, the Triangle and Odom don't mix. However, Jackson likes Odom and it seems as if he is not going anywhere.
The Lakers are trying to move Bynum and Mihm. I think Kwame and Lamar should be the ones to go, and Cupcake could make it happen by calling Paxson and Harris and getting Duhon, Mo Williams and Magliore.

Dude, your comments just dont make sense. You act like Odom has not performed?? The guy is almost a 20/10 player!! Thats rare in the league and it just tells you he is a complimentary player as part of a team. You fail to recognize that the Lakers are NOT deep, and that is their problem. Odom is a significant contributor to the team and should not be parted with. We need to ADD to the collective, not take away from it.

-Mike in SoCal
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Old 06-27-2006, 01:15 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by millencolin735
Ok understood on the whole speculation deal, but it's kinda senseless to speculate over something that has absolutely no chance of happening. Also I watched all Lakers home games and atleast listened to the road games on radio when working, so yes I did atleast listen to just about every game, and from that I was able to realize that Kwame playing pf wasnt the reason he was struggling his lack of confidence and felling that he needed to do to much was the reason for his struggles.

I also have no idea whatsoever on what you were trying say on that whole sentence you spent talking about Mihm, of course I know he was injured, but you would know that if you read my post clearly I said Mihm was having a career year before he got injured. That was probably the biggest reason for me posting, was to point out the fact that Mihm wasnt in foul trouble anywhere near the extent he was in the previous season which allowed him to do what he does so well throughout a 30+ minute span as opposed to a 20 minute span.


Well that whole sentence i said about mihm was just to make it clear that I do watch the games.
I just hate that Im a big fan and someone says i dont watch games or w/e.

But i didn't mean to argue about it man
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Old 06-27-2006, 01:36 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Well that whole sentence i said about mihm was just to make it clear that I do watch the games.
I just hate that Im a big fan and someone says i dont watch games or w/e.

But i didn't mean to argue about it man

Thats what this board is all about to argue and discuss dude, it's no biggy to me as long as you dont get in to childish name calling. I was just saying it felt like you werent watching many games from this season is cause alot of the stuff you were commenting about wouldve been relevent in the 04-05 season cause thats when they had all those problems like Mihms foul trouble, I mean Mihm was probably.....actually he was our 3rd most important player up to his injury due to his contribution and lack of foul trouble. Thats why I dont think we should look into moving him or anyother Laker, cause I feel they are a deadly shooter and starting pointguard away from contending. Although I do think (if he comes back) that Smush will be alot better then he was last season cause I doubt he went into this past season expecting to be a starter for an entire season on a playoff team, so he'll be better prepaired to play his role this upcomimg season.

edit: Oh and I wasnt trying to question youre lover for our Lakers, us true fans are a dying breed since everyone is jumping on the Clippers bandwagon, hell I've probably been cheering for the Clippers longer then all the supposed die hard Clipper fans I was cheering for them in the Mo Taylor, Rodney Rogers, and Derek Anderson days.

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Old 06-27-2006, 01:41 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by millencolin735
Thats what this board is all about to argue and discuss dude, it's no biggy to me as long as you dont get in to childish name calling. I was just saying it felt like you werent watching many games from this season is cause alot of the stuff you were commenting about wouldve been relevent in the 04-05 season cause thats when they had all those problems like Mihms foul trouble, I mean Mihm was probably.....actually he was our 3rd most important player up to his injury due to his contribution and lack of foul trouble. Thats why I dont think we should look into moving him or anyother Laker, cause I feel they are a deadly shooter and starting pointguard away from contending. Although I do think (if he comes back) that Smush will be alot better then he was last season cause I doubt he went into this past season expecting to be a starter for an entire season on a playoff team, so he'll be better prepaired to play his role this upcomimg season.

Chris was a big part, and still is too. I would rather keep him because I'm afraid That Kwame might go back to being Kwame. You can look at it that way, or you can look at it that Bynum will be great and we will have a logjam at the center position. I want all three centers but it might not be likely. and they they look like they arent trading Kwame anytime soon.

Its either Chris or Andrew that leaves.

Also from time to time we have seen that Chris and Kwame don't play well together.

So it might be that one HAS to go.
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Old 06-27-2006, 01:55 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Chris was a big part, and still is too. I would rather keep him because I'm afraid That Kwame might go back to being Kwame. You can look at it that way, or you can look at it that Bynum will be great and we will have a logjam at the center position. I want all three centers but it might not be likely. and they they look like they arent trading Kwame anytime soon.

Its either Chris or Andrew that leaves.

Also from time to time we have seen that Chris and Kwame don't play well together.

So it might be that one HAS to go.

Well I think Chris is in the last year or two in his deal, and I doubt that Bynum becomes the contributor that we hope he'll in that time and personally I would rather have a logjam at center(especially at center) than nothing at all. I mean it's not like having too many good centers or powerfowards is a bad thing.
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Old 06-27-2006, 05:59 AM   #24
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Why do people act like Odom is a 20 ppg scorer? He isn't. He's a 15 ppg scorer.
He's an inconsistant scorer. Just a decent defender.
The only thing he does really well is rebounding. He's a good passer but not a really good triangle initiator, like Tex said, he's an instinctive player.

Odom is overrated and has a huge contract. Getting rid of him would be the right move.

Besides, he clearly isn't a good fit...just admit it guys.

However, what I hate the most about him is his inconsistancy.

Garbage. Trade him.
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Old 06-27-2006, 12:16 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
Dude, your comments just dont make sense. You act like Odom has not performed?? The guy is almost a 20/10 player!! Thats rare in the league and it just tells you he is a complimentary player as part of a team. You fail to recognize that the Lakers are NOT deep, and that is their problem. Odom is a significant contributor to the team and should not be parted with. We need to ADD to the collective, not take away from it.

-Mike in SoCal

No, Odom is a 15 and 8 guy that does not know how to play without the ball.
You have to build the team around your star player, big names don't win games. Iverson's best years were when he played with Lynch, Snow, Hill and Ratliff. None of those guys are All-Star players yet they fit in well with the Star. The Lakers need to find guys that fit the triangle. Look at the old Bulls rosters and you will see names like Kukoc, Armstrong, Kerr, Paxson, Hodges, Tucker, LaRue, Buechler... why do you think the Bulls keep signing these type players to play in the triangle? They help create good spacing. The Bulls also signed a lot of hustle guys like Mark Randall, Darrell Walker, Bobby Hansen, Levingston and Rodman to get the loose ball, rebound, defend and fire up the crowd. Brown and Odom are not those type of players. I'm making the point that if something worked for 9 titles why change the formular. Look at the Lakers roster from 2000-2002 and you will see the simularities to the Bulls of the 90's. Starting with the signing of Payton and Malone, Cupcake has made error after error. He does not understand what type of players play well in this system. That may not make sense to you because you don't understand why teams win, you have to have good team guys from man 3 to 9. Kwame is not a good team guy and Odom is not the best no.2 man for the triangle. Those guys main job is to make space for Kobe to operate, teams can predict what Odom will do, therefore he does not make life easier for Bryant. The Lakers of 2000-2002 had guys that created space for the key guys Horry, Fisher, Rice, Shaw, Richmond.... Those are the kind of guys that the Lakers need now. West understood that Cupcake does not.
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Old 06-27-2006, 12:39 PM   #26
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If the right deal comes along, I would trade Odom. The Warriors trade rumor interested me. I believe Odom will have a really good year next year. 17 to 18 ppg, 8 to 9 rbg, 6 apg type of a year.

Regarding Chris Mihm, he is not in the longterm plans for the Lakers and he is in the final year of his contract. He is a valuable trade asset and we should get someone in return for him instead of letting him become a free agent and losing him for nothing.
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Old 06-27-2006, 12:44 PM   #27
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One last thing, the triangle is all about good spacing and having players that can set up the defender when they make their cuts thur the lane. You need 2 smart star players and shooters that can spread the floor (ever notice Jordan almost never got trapped) that is because he was smart, did not force things, he played with great shooters and defenders were too spread out. Since the triangle requires the players to be spread out you also need hustle guys that can out hustle the other guys to the ball. It's all about effort. Odom and Brown are not that type of guy. Brown just has zero effort, he is not the right guy for this team. Odom does not get good low post position, because he does not work hard to get it. He likes to get the ball at the top of the key and drive left (everybody knows this). In the triange, one guy has to post up, two cut thur the lane and two spot up. If Odom sucks as a post player, does not read defenders or adjust his angles when making his cuts or shoot well from 3 why the f..ck do you guys think he fits in. WTF have you dudes been watching for the last 7 years. You don't understand the offense yet? Dude does not Fit, he is not a post up guy, a hustle player a shooter or a stopper. Odom is a guy that gets the ball at the top of the key and goes left. I'm Out
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Old 06-27-2006, 07:25 PM   #28
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It's just smething he's going to have to practice but In reality you don't wanna lose a 6'10" PF/SF that can dribble, drive, and spot up and once he gets more comfortable with the system he will be such a threat.

In the Playoffs he did superb against a very athletic Shawn Marion on both ends of the floor and he hustled after lose balls. When it counted, he showed heart which was a problem early on.

I think he should stay and next year he can be an 18/10/5 guy
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Old 06-28-2006, 12:30 AM   #29
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It's just smething he's going to have to practice but In reality you don't wanna lose a 6'10" PF/SF that can dribble, drive, and spot up and once he gets more comfortable with the system he will be such a threat.

In the Playoffs he did superb against a very athletic Shawn Marion on both ends of the floor and he hustled after lose balls. When it counted, he showed heart which was a problem early on.

I think he should stay and next year he can be an 18/10/5 guy

I could not agree more with this statement. Yes, there is room for improvement, but even if he is a 15/10 guy, those are incredible numbers and it just means he is a complimentary player. I think he can succeed in the triangle as he showed great improvment after the all star break. He also has a good work ethic and hustles as noted above.

Remember, fixing the problem is ADDING quality and depth, not taking away. Odom does fit... they just need more as a team. I only trade him if its part of a package for KG or someone of that caliber!

-Mike in SoCal
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Old 06-28-2006, 05:27 AM   #30
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think about this:

If we keep signing new free agents and making all these trades...how long will it take for us to win more?

Then phil would have to keep starting from square one to teach the triangle all over again.

Keeping our guys is more Ideal unless they suck.

But just Imagine if Guys Like Turiaf get more time....will we need to get another PF?

what if Sasha turns into a 12 ppg and 5 apg guy...should we sign another pg to start?

thats the beauty of having such a young team...we can develop them more and keep them for a cheaper price.
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