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Old 05-03-2012, 02:23 PM   #31
lakerfreak
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
90% of the criticism of Kobe is irrational, 10% is completely accurate.
At this point Kobe is not going to change, it'd be idiotic to trade the best closer in the game......so flawed as he is, it's pointless to jabber on about him when there are much bigger problems with guys not pulling their weight.

Pau? The jury is still out on him, sorry.
Last years pathetic performance from Pau he averaged 13.1 ppg........guess what he's averaging through 2 games this playoffs.......13.0 ppg.
Pau does seem more emotionally invested in the team at the moment and his 6.5 assists per game is beautiful.
For the season the most glaring things have been his lowest shooting percentage since the 03-04 season, his lowest PPG of his career and by far his lowest free throw attempts in his career. His shooting % on non layups/dunks is by far the lowest of his career as well. Offensive rebounds....yes another career low this year.
I won't even go into the defensive issues.
Pau is currently in line to remain in the top 6-10 highest paid players in the NBA for next season, his ability to avoid being traded is riding on this years playoffs.

Unfortunately for Pau, he has a coach who has no clue of how to run an offense which will consistently allow the bigs to play off each other.....in the hands of a good coach Pau would be deadly playing alongside Bynum and Kobe. Pau should be cutting to the hole for easy passes from Bynum as he's being doubled and then crossing to the side for a mid range jumper if it's not there....with Kobe or Barnes as the 2nd cutter after Pau clears. There is no way this could be stopped.......but Mike Brown All the tools at his disposal....but none of the brains required to use them. Maybe he should look at film of how Webber and Vlade played together....or..........??? & ???

So is it irrational to criticize Kobe for his shot selection, which can be terrible a lot of the time? My issue is not only selection, but his volume shooting. He doesn't stop and he can single handedly ruin team chemistry when his shots aren't falling. Now when he's on, he's on, but its unrealistic to expect him to be on, especially at this stage in his career. Remember game 7 vs Boston 2 seasons ago? Nearly cost the team another championship. That right there should be criticized.

Pau Gasol's 13 PPG last season was different than this season. Bynum last season wasn't scoring like he is this time around. As a result, Pau can be the third option and get away with it, so long as he is still involved offensively (6.5 assists a game). Lastly, I think whether it is the nuggets or the spurs, its completely unfair to criticize the coach's offense when guys like Pau Gasol are averaging 6.5 assists a game. This offense has all of these players moving the ball, which results in a lot of those Bynum Alley Oops. Those plays aren't by accident. The players are having more understanding of their roles, and since they're now used to their roles, Kobe is shooting better, Bynum is very involved, and Pau is doing a great job blending in.

As a matter of fact, Phil's triangle didn't even involve Bynum as much as Brown's system does. Bynum is getting so many shot attempts, and all of those shot attempts are great ones, and this is WITH triple teams on Bynum. He's taking advantage of what this offense gives him.

If the offense is stagnant at times, which also happened with the triangle, then we have some hustle guys like Jordan Hill giving such a great boost with his second and third opportunities. The offense isn't flashy, but it works, it puts up points on the board, and more importantly, it gave the lakers the third seed, with a 2-0 lead in the playoffs.
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Old 05-04-2012, 12:22 AM   #32
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

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Originally Posted by lakerfreak
So is it irrational to criticize Kobe for his shot selection, which can be terrible a lot of the time? My issue is not only selection, but his volume shooting. He doesn't stop and he can single handedly ruin team chemistry when his shots aren't falling. Now when he's on, he's on, but its unrealistic to expect him to be on, especially at this stage in his career. Remember game 7 vs Boston 2 seasons ago? Nearly cost the team another championship. That right there should be criticized.

Pau Gasol's 13 PPG last season was different than this season. Bynum last season wasn't scoring like he is this time around. As a result, Pau can be the third option and get away with it, so long as he is still involved offensively (6.5 assists a game). Lastly, I think whether it is the nuggets or the spurs, its completely unfair to criticize the coach's offense when guys like Pau Gasol are averaging 6.5 assists a game. This offense has all of these players moving the ball, which results in a lot of those Bynum Alley Oops. Those plays aren't by accident. The players are having more understanding of their roles, and since they're now used to their roles, Kobe is shooting better, Bynum is very involved, and Pau is doing a great job blending in.

As a matter of fact, Phil's triangle didn't even involve Bynum as much as Brown's system does. Bynum is getting so many shot attempts, and all of those shot attempts are great ones, and this is WITH triple teams on Bynum. He's taking advantage of what this offense gives him.

If the offense is stagnant at times, which also happened with the triangle, then we have some hustle guys like Jordan Hill giving such a great boost with his second and third opportunities. The offense isn't flashy, but it works, it puts up points on the board, and more importantly, it gave the lakers the third seed, with a 2-0 lead in the playoffs.
Very valid points Freak esp about Kobe, Pau and Bynum....
Heck, all of the above.
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Old 05-04-2012, 01:10 AM   #33
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

I know it's only been like 4 games guys, but giving away the 1st rounder in the Derek Fisher trade is looking pretty good right now.
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Old 05-04-2012, 02:19 AM   #34
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
So is it irrational to criticize Kobe for his shot selection, which can be terrible a lot of the time? My issue is not only selection, but his volume shooting. He doesn't stop and he can single handedly ruin team chemistry when his shots aren't falling. Now when he's on, he's on, but its unrealistic to expect him to be on, especially at this stage in his career. Remember game 7 vs Boston 2 seasons ago? Nearly cost the team another championship. That right there should be criticized.

Pau Gasol's 13 PPG last season was different than this season. Bynum last season wasn't scoring like he is this time around. As a result, Pau can be the third option and get away with it, so long as he is still involved offensively (6.5 assists a game). Lastly, I think whether it is the nuggets or the spurs, its completely unfair to criticize the coach's offense when guys like Pau Gasol are averaging 6.5 assists a game. This offense has all of these players moving the ball, which results in a lot of those Bynum Alley Oops. Those plays aren't by accident. The players are having more understanding of their roles, and since they're now used to their roles, Kobe is shooting better, Bynum is very involved, and Pau is doing a great job blending in.

As a matter of fact, Phil's triangle didn't even involve Bynum as much as Brown's system does. Bynum is getting so many shot attempts, and all of those shot attempts are great ones, and this is WITH triple teams on Bynum. He's taking advantage of what this offense gives him.

If the offense is stagnant at times, which also happened with the triangle, then we have some hustle guys like Jordan Hill giving such a great boost with his second and third opportunities. The offense isn't flashy, but it works, it puts up points on the board, and more importantly, it gave the lakers the third seed, with a 2-0 lead in the playoffs.

No, I also question Kobe's shot selection.....but he makes shots that don't make any sense too. Has Kobe single handedly lost games for us.....absolutely. We have a bunch of docile players who can't create their own shot and don't shoot 3's at a good %......so Kobe's volume should be high.....he....and I don't trust the rest of the guys to really attack and go all out to win, thankfully Bynum is getting there. I would absolutely love for Pau to be more aggressive going toward the basket and taking more shots, but without falling away, he is severely lacking as a 7 footer when it comes to drawing fouls.....way too passive.

Again, you don't understand the difference between coaching a fluid offense and stats, no need to even discuss the issue.

Being impressed by beating Denver is like thinking you belong in the NBA because you hit shots by yourself in your driveway
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Old 05-08-2012, 10:10 PM   #35
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Another double double by Hill, this one on the road in limited minutes. Very impressive

To think if the Lakers had pullen the trigger on Beasley and given up that 1st rounder, they'd never be able to pry Hill from Houston, not saying one player is better than another, but Hill just fits in really well with this team.

And to think, at the beginning of the season, Troy Murphy was brought in for this very reason Ship his ass out!

The Laker's only issue now is bench scoring production.
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Old 05-10-2012, 11:52 AM   #36
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker
No, I also question Kobe's shot selection.....but he makes shots that don't make any sense too. Has Kobe single handedly lost games for us.....absolutely. We have a bunch of docile players who can't create their own shot and don't shoot 3's at a good %......so Kobe's volume should be high.....he....and I don't trust the rest of the guys to really attack and go all out to win, thankfully Bynum is getting there. I would absolutely love for Pau to be more aggressive going toward the basket and taking more shots, but without falling away, he is severely lacking as a 7 footer when it comes to drawing fouls.....way too passive.

Again, you don't understand the difference between coaching a fluid offense and stats, no need to even discuss the issue.

Being impressed by beating Denver is like thinking you belong in the NBA because you hit shots by yourself in your driveway

Sorry it took a while to respond. I started a full time job.

As for statistics, yes they aren't everything, but you're dismissing every single statistic. Stats come from somewhere. They let us understand how things will play out. If a center like Bynum gets many shot attempts, and is shooting at 60%, it likely means he will keep getting those same shot attempts at a similar success rate.
You yourself keep grading the offense by the fact that "the lakers had their lowest point average per game for a while". But wait, I thought stats are different from a fluid offense?
Points come from the speed of the game. Lakers are a half court team, and they play slow, full time. They get very few fast break opportunities. Does that mean their offense is doomed to be terrible? No. It just means they need to keep playing together until it clicks.
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:13 PM   #37
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Sorry it took a while to respond. I started a full time job.

As for statistics, yes they aren't everything, but you're dismissing every single statistic. Stats come from somewhere. They let us understand how things will play out. If a center like Bynum gets many shot attempts, and is shooting at 60%, it likely means he will keep getting those same shot attempts at a similar success rate.
You yourself keep grading the offense by the fact that "the lakers had their lowest point average per game for a while". But wait, I thought stats are different from a fluid offense?
Points come from the speed of the game. Lakers are a half court team, and they play slow, full time. They get very few fast break opportunities. Does that mean their offense is doomed to be terrible? No. It just means they need to keep playing together until it clicks.



Why do you constantly speak of things you do not remotely understand????
If you really want to understand these things you need to either listen and understand to those who know.....or learn for yourself by coaching for an extended time.

There are a ton of ways you can score a high amount of points, it doesn't matter the pace of your style of play. What matters most is making the most of every possession, every time down the floor. If your goal is to take one shot and run away while the ball is in the air then you better shoot a very high %. If you always put 2 guys rebounding your misses you will score more points with 2nd chance opportunities. I could go through a million scenarios and the related situations but it would take way too long.
As for our offense....lmao, if players ran a crappy offense for 10 years and knew it well, it wouldn't be successful.....it would still be crap.

Brown has no clue as to how to run an offense and no clue as to how to mesh the styles and abilities of our players together.
Seriously, any coach who is so stupid that he cannot see how we can destroy any team in the NBA by running pick and rolls shouldn't be coaching in the NBA, he should go back to being a video editor/stats guy.....Metta had this right. Kobe needs to at least help the nitwit out by making a defensive adjustment to stop Andre Miller.
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:40 PM   #38
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker


Why do you constantly speak of things you do not remotely understand????
If you really want to understand these things you need to either listen and understand to those who know.....or learn for yourself by coaching for an extended time.

There are a ton of ways you can score a high amount of points, it doesn't matter the pace of your style of play. What matters most is making the most of every possession, every time down the floor. If your goal is to take one shot and run away while the ball is in the air then you better shoot a very high %. If you always put 2 guys rebounding your misses you will score more points with 2nd chance opportunities. I could go through a million scenarios and the related situations but it would take way too long.
As for our offense....lmao, if players ran a crappy offense for 10 years and knew it well, it wouldn't be successful.....it would still be crap.

Brown has no clue as to how to run an offense and no clue as to how to mesh the styles and abilities of our players together.
Seriously, any coach who is so stupid that he cannot see how we can destroy any team in the NBA by running pick and rolls shouldn't be coaching in the NBA, he should go back to being a video editor/stats guy.....Metta had this right. Kobe needs to at least help the nitwit out by making a defensive adjustment to stop Andre Miller.

For whatever reason, you just don't like Mike Brown. It works out perfectly for you so that you can blame Mike Brown if the Lakers get knocked out of the playoffs like they did last year when Phil Jackson was the coach. Do you think Phil Jackson is a "nitwit" too? Just sayin' is all...
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Old 05-10-2012, 04:12 PM   #39
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

[quote=mr sax]For whatever reason, you just don't like Mike Brown. [quote]

It's not just whatever reason. He's given a million of them and they are legit. It's funny to me that there's people that are so tolerant of a coach doing a mediocre job. This is the Lakers. Don't just settle for mediocrity. This team should be able to contend. You really can't compare this year to last year. There was way more drama going on last year (and Fish was still the PG....).
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:03 PM   #40
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr sax
For whatever reason, you just don't like Mike Brown. It works out perfectly for you so that you can blame Mike Brown if the Lakers get knocked out of the playoffs like they did last year when Phil Jackson was the coach. Do you think Phil Jackson is a "nitwit" too? Just sayin' is all...

The bigger disappointment with more than half of this forum was that Mike Brown was hated on right after he was hired. he hadn't been given a fair shot, and just because in the very beginning when there was chemistry problems, people never factored in the lockout, or the players being out of shape, or the timeline for training camp.

This whole season was expected to be the way it happened. So far there were no surprises to me, other than the blossoming of Bynum, which was a good surprise.

Kobe himself said at the end of the regular season that his relationship with Mike Brown was better than ever. But hey, if its never in the best interest of the person debating, nobody acknowledges it.
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:07 PM   #41
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by DKLaker


Why do you constantly speak of things you do not remotely understand????
If you really want to understand these things you need to either listen and understand to those who know.....or learn for yourself by coaching for an extended time.

There are a ton of ways you can score a high amount of points, it doesn't matter the pace of your style of play. What matters most is making the most of every possession, every time down the floor. If your goal is to take one shot and run away while the ball is in the air then you better shoot a very high %. If you always put 2 guys rebounding your misses you will score more points with 2nd chance opportunities. I could go through a million scenarios and the related situations but it would take way too long.
As for our offense....lmao, if players ran a crappy offense for 10 years and knew it well, it wouldn't be successful.....it would still be crap.

Brown has no clue as to how to run an offense and no clue as to how to mesh the styles and abilities of our players together.
Seriously, any coach who is so stupid that he cannot see how we can destroy any team in the NBA by running pick and rolls shouldn't be coaching in the NBA, he should go back to being a video editor/stats guy.....Metta had this right. Kobe needs to at least help the nitwit out by making a defensive adjustment to stop Andre Miller.

Oh yes because Kobe, Bynum, and Pau all couldn't play together this season

You act like Andre Miller is so guardable. Instead of questioning Brown, why don't you question Ramon Session's weak frame, that can't seem to rotate well defensively on the right guys?

And I got some time, why don't you go through the millions of scenarios? I have yet to hear just one from you.
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:09 PM   #42
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

[quote=dd24][quote=mr sax]For whatever reason, you just don't like Mike Brown.
Quote:

It's not just whatever reason. He's given a million of them and they are legit. It's funny to me that there's people that are so tolerant of a coach doing a mediocre job. This is the Lakers. Don't just settle for mediocrity. This team should be able to contend. You really can't compare this year to last year. There was way more drama going on last year (and Fish was still the PG....).

I think you can compare last season to this. Why not? How was this a mediocre season? How is a top seed in the west mediocre? Why don't you point out the legit reasons so we can examine your claim that this would have been, in fact, a mediocre season?
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Old 05-10-2012, 09:25 PM   #43
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

[quote=lakerfreak][quote=dd24]
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr sax
For whatever reason, you just don't like Mike Brown.

I think you can compare last season to this. Why not? How was this a mediocre season? How is a top seed in the west mediocre? Why don't you point out the legit reasons so we can examine your claim that this would have been, in fact, a mediocre season?

I didn't say the season was mediocre. The coach is mediocre. He hasn't changed a thing from his Cleveland days. He sucked then and he sucks now. Of course I'm not going to give him a fair chance from the start. Why in the world would I????? It wasn't like he ever proved himself to make good decisions in his previous job. It was a terrible hiring. The Lakers could win the title this year and I would still say that it's a terrible hiring. Mike Brown should be an assistant in this league.
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Old 05-10-2012, 11:59 PM   #44
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

[quote=dd24][quote=lakerfreak]
Quote:
Originally Posted by dd24

I didn't say the season was mediocre. The coach is mediocre. He hasn't changed a thing from his Cleveland days. He sucked then and he sucks now. Of course I'm not going to give him a fair chance from the start. Why in the world would I????? It wasn't like he ever proved himself to make good decisions in his previous job. It was a terrible hiring. The Lakers could win the title this year and I would still say that it's a terrible hiring. Mike Brown should be an assistant in this league.

He doesn't understand this at all, we might as well be speaking in a language he never heard of. Everyone who really knows basketball knows he's a crap coach.
He has no business coaching an NBA team.
I am happy there are guys like you who understand
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Old 05-11-2012, 12:01 AM   #45
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Default Re: Jordan Hill

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Oh yes because Kobe, Bynum, and Pau all couldn't play together this season

You act like Andre Miller is so guardable. Instead of questioning Brown, why don't you question Ramon Session's weak frame, that can't seem to rotate well defensively on the right guys?

And I got some time, why don't you go through the millions of scenarios? I have yet to hear just one from you.

I already said what I would do to stop Miller......but any communication with you on this stuff is a waste of my time, you don't get it.
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