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Old 02-10-2013, 04:27 PM   #3736
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The GM
I'm a Cristiano detractor but even I don't have enough hate to deny how great this guy has been especially over the past 3-4 years. At his current rate he will go down as one of the top 5-10 best players to ever play football, like him or not. Put him in damn near any other generation and he would be the undisputed best player in the world. I feel dirty even defending this guy but you have to learn to appreciate what he and Messi are doing at the moment cause we probably will never see dominance like this ever again.
well we have Pele in the 60s, Beckenbauer and Cruyff in the 70s, Maradona in the 80s, you could argue that he could be the best in the early 90s but even then Romario, Maldini, Lothar, Van Basten, Baggio, Schmeichel, Hagi, Stoichkov... most talented in this era? possibly.. but surely not the UNDISPUTED best.... late 90s and early 00s he cant touch the Fenomeno and Zizu who had WC success too and better peaks ( zizu arguably, ronaldo definitely- possibly even better peak than messi ) ... then in the mid 00s we have Ronnie who also had a better peak than any of the Cristiano's ... Cristiano was arguably the best in 2007/8 but that was one of the weakest year in world's football
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Old 02-10-2013, 06:18 PM   #3737
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Zidane is so overrated.He never made anywhere near the same impact as Ronaldo has done for the clubs he has played for. And Ronaldo is an all-time great and will be among the 3 best players of all-time soon or when he retires.

And just hand the trophy to United by the way
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Old 02-10-2013, 06:35 PM   #3738
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

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Originally Posted by alenleomessi
well we have Pele in the 60s, Beckenbauer and Cruyff in the 70s, Maradona in the 80s, you could argue that he could be the best in the early 90s but even then Romario, Maldini, Lothar, Van Basten, Baggio, Schmeichel, Hagi, Stoichkov... most talented in this era? possibly.. but surely not the UNDISPUTED best.... late 90s and early 00s he cant touch the Fenomeno and Zizu who had WC success too and better peaks ( zizu arguably, ronaldo definitely- possibly even better peak than messi ) ... then in the mid 00s we have Ronnie who also had a better peak than any of the Cristiano's ... Cristiano was arguably the best in 2007/8 but that was one of the weakest year in world's football

What's your definition of peak play? I'd swear Cristiano is in his peak as we speak. And the mere fact that you'd say Ronnie had a better peak is flat out ignorance, take any of Ronnies seasons and it doesn't come close to CR's season last year (oh btw which is one of the 5ish greatest individual seasons ever.) You seem to be taking more team success into account over players 1v1. Team success is important but when evaluating players head to head the first thing you should look at how they stack up against each other individually as footballers then everything else should come after that.
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Old 02-10-2013, 11:27 PM   #3739
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The GM
I'm a Cristiano detractor but even I don't have enough hate to deny how great this guy has been especially over the past 3-4 years. At his current rate he will go down as one of the top 5-10 best players to ever play football, like him or not. Put him in damn near any other generation and he would be the undisputed best player in the world. I feel dirty even defending this guy but you have to learn to appreciate what he and Messi are doing at the moment cause we probably will never see dominance like this ever again.



I'm not saying this to hate on you and I acknowledge I'm really a hater of his game, but I'm telling you for absolute fact that all of this is 100% wrong.


If we were in a different era, there would be two people would argue his name in the company of Messi. There isn't any era where he'd be considered the best player. The era we're in now, with the Premier League dominating attention, media, English experts thinking they know anything about the sport, is killing it.

CRon has great touch, very two-footed, one of the best shooters on goal I've ever seen, strong and fast, a terrific athlete, physically a complete player (as in the tools), a great goal scorer and a hybrid striker/winger.


He's somewhat unique but everything about his is exaggerated. His last 3-4 years are not as impressive as either 06/07 or 07/08. The league is watered down, Messi is one of the 5 best players I've ever seen but his goal-scoring is exaggerated and context is necessary when evaluating on that basis. In CRon's case it has be to considered that true Madrid fans and fans of La Liga will tell you what I keep saying and that is that Alonso was their best player last year. But we'll look at his goal-scoring and just exaggerate about him.


In the near 20 years that I've been actively watching, going back and watching old tapes, watching old games, collecting old tapes/DVD's, watching online, on FIFA's website...forget it, I won't even say that. In the 20 years I've been watching, there are maybe 15 players who were better than any version of CRon. Some guys didn't quite put together the consistent years he has and that is understood (tho most did) but there are better players. And that's not including Maradona, who I didn't see much of live. This is not exaggerated. CRon never, at any point, had the impact that some of these guys have. He's absolutely not better than Kaka when Kaka was healthy and in his prime. He's absolutely not the best Portuguese player of the last 20 years. And it is a shame to see the way the game is evaluated this day. It's been a problem in basketball for a long time but I never thought it'd be such a problem in this sport. As someone who's played as much as I have, it's obnoxious. A list of the best players is the equivalent of highlight reels.

Last edited by Whoah10115 : 02-10-2013 at 11:29 PM.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:05 AM   #3740
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

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Originally Posted by Whoah10115
I'm not saying this to hate on you and I acknowledge I'm really a hater of his game, but I'm telling you for absolute fact that all of this is 100% wrong.


If we were in a different era, there would be two people would argue his name in the company of Messi. There isn't any era where he'd be considered the best player. The era we're in now, with the Premier League dominating attention, media, English experts thinking they know anything about the sport, is killing it.

CRon has great touch, very two-footed, one of the best shooters on goal I've ever seen, strong and fast, a terrific athlete, physically a complete player (as in the tools), a great goal scorer and a hybrid striker/winger.


He's somewhat unique but everything about his is exaggerated. His last 3-4 years are not as impressive as either 06/07 or 07/08. The league is watered down, Messi is one of the 5 best players I've ever seen but his goal-scoring is exaggerated and context is necessary when evaluating on that basis. In CRon's case it has be to considered that true Madrid fans and fans of La Liga will tell you what I keep saying and that is that Alonso was their best player last year. But we'll look at his goal-scoring and just exaggerate about him.


In the near 20 years that I've been actively watching, going back and watching old tapes, watching old games, collecting old tapes/DVD's, watching online, on FIFA's website...forget it, I won't even say that. In the 20 years I've been watching, there are maybe 15 players who were better than any version of CRon. Some guys didn't quite put together the consistent years he has and that is understood (tho most did) but there are better players. And that's not including Maradona, who I didn't see much of live. This is not exaggerated. CRon never, at any point, had the impact that some of these guys have. He's absolutely not better than Kaka when Kaka was healthy and in his prime. He's absolutely not the best Portuguese player of the last 20 years. And it is a shame to see the way the game is evaluated this day. It's been a problem in basketball for a long time but I never thought it'd be such a problem in this sport. As someone who's played as much as I have, it's obnoxious. A list of the best players is the equivalent of highlight reels.

I didn't know an opinion can be 100% wrong and a fact it's wrong at that, guess you learn something new every day. I personally take no stock in what EPL supports say cause I feel the EPL is the most overrated league and has been for years now. I like to watch games and evaluate teams and players, I haven't been watching for 20 years probably more like 10-12 but I feel confident enough to say there is no way in hell there are 15 better players then CR. The mere fact you said Kaka is better then CR is mind boggling, to me Kaka is one of the most overrated players in world football history & mentioning the two in the same sentence is disrespectful to CR.

I would love to see the list of players you have over CR, obviously it's based off opinion but I'd like to take a look anyway.

Last edited by The GM : 02-11-2013 at 12:39 AM.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:01 AM   #3741
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The GM
I didn't know an opinion can be 100% wrong and a fact it's wrong at that, guess you learn something new every day. I personally take no stock in what EPL supports say cause I feel the EPL is the most overrated league and has been for years now. I like to watch games and evaluate teams and players, I haven't been watching for 20 years probably more like 10-12 but I feel confident enough to say there is no way in hell there are 15 better players then CR. The mere fact you said Kaka is better then CR is mind boggling, to me Kaka is one of the most overrated players in world football history & mentioning the two in the same sentence is disrespectful to CR.

I would love to see the list of players you have over CR, obviously it's based off opinion but I'd like to take a look anyway.


Ronaldinho
Messi
Romario
Ronaldo
Zidane
Figo
Henry
Xavi
Totti
Baggio
Rivaldo (as much as I don't like him)
Kaka


I wanted to put Maldini, but I'll refrain from putting in anyone too controversial. That you say it's disrespectful to put Kaka in the same sentence as CR7 is disconcerting. I can respect one thinking CRon is better, I suppose, but to suggest it's anything like that...that's too much for me.


Again, to not get too controversial, I'll just add a bunch of guys who are in this discussion, in no order:

Maldini
Roberto Carlos
Bergkamp
Stoitchkov
Vieira
Cafu
Rui Costa
Batistuta
Shevchenko
Raul

And even then, I can name more that are in the conversation. Especially if we're talking absolute peak, but that's that.
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Old 02-11-2013, 05:48 AM   #3742
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whoah10115
Ronaldinho
Messi
Romario
Ronaldo
[B]Zidane
Figo
Henry
Xavi
Totti
Baggio
Rivaldo (as much as I don't like him)
Kaka


Ronaldo is better than all of them imo
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:12 AM   #3743
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Kaka the most overrated footballer ever. I love Totti and watching him play more then Ronaldo but Ronaldo is scoring 50 goals a season, he's scoring at a rate as high as anyone, at a Ruud Van Nistelrooy level but he's doing it from the wing and not as a poacher, creating many of his shots for himself and is strong at scoring with his head and shooting from either foot. He's a primadonna but you can't question his heart, he had to work hard to get his skills and you see him devastated and crying after losing big games, he cares alot more about the game then anyone gives him credit for and yes he's an all time great genius.

Last edited by Nick Young : 02-11-2013 at 06:16 AM.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:22 AM   #3744
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whoah10115
Ronaldinho
Messi
Romario
Ronaldo
Zidane
Figo
Henry
Xavi
Totti
Baggio
Rivaldo (as much as I don't like him)
Kaka


I wanted to put Maldini, but I'll refrain from putting in anyone too controversial. That you say it's disrespectful to put Kaka in the same sentence as CR7 is disconcerting. I can respect one thinking CRon is better, I suppose, but to suggest it's anything like that...that's too much for me.


Again, to not get too controversial, I'll just add a bunch of guys who are in this discussion, in no order:

Maldini
Roberto Carlos
Bergkamp
Stoitchkov
Vieira
Cafu
Rui Costa
Batistuta
Shevchenko
Raul

And even then, I can name more that are in the conversation. Especially if we're talking absolute peak, but that's that.
lol
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:35 AM   #3745
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Roberto Carlos and Rui Costa and Shevchenko=to Cr7 get the phuck out
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:09 AM   #3746
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Whoah is clearly trolling, I'm not even going to get into anything he posted other than this:

"In the near 20 years that I've been actively watching, going back and watching old tapes, watching old games, collecting old tapes/DVD's, watching online, on FIFA's website..."

Where is the 20x bigger version of this smileyface: ?

Because that is really the only appropriate response.
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:38 AM   #3747
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LJJ
Whoah is clearly trolling, I'm not even going to get into anything he posted other than this:

"In the near 20 years that I've been actively watching, going back and watching old tapes, watching old games, collecting old tapes/DVD's, watching online, on FIFA's website..."

Where is the 20x bigger version of this smileyface: ?

Because that is really the only appropriate response.

Man, this thread cracks me up. Anyway:
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Old 02-11-2013, 09:40 AM   #3748
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whoah10115
Ronaldinho
Messi
Romario
Ronaldo
Zidane
Figo
Henry
Xavi
Totti
Baggio
Rivaldo (as much as I don't like him)
Kaka


I wanted to put Maldini, but I'll refrain from putting in anyone too controversial. That you say it's disrespectful to put Kaka in the same sentence as CR7 is disconcerting. I can respect one thinking CRon is better, I suppose, but to suggest it's anything like that...that's too much for me.


Again, to not get too controversial, I'll just add a bunch of guys who are in this discussion, in no order:

Maldini
Roberto Carlos
Bergkamp
Stoitchkov
Vieira
Cafu
Rui Costa
Batistuta
Shevchenko
Raul

And even then, I can name more that are in the conversation. Especially if we're talking absolute peak, but that's that.
Funny guy
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:17 AM   #3749
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

I thought we were talking about careers? Since when is greatness based on peak play?

If we are talking about peak play and overall talent then CRonaldo is a top 10 player of all time... So is Eric Cantona. The two brazilians R could possibly be tied for 1st.
Iniesta and Zidane probably wouldnt even be top 20. But thats not it. YOu cant rank players like this. You have to look at all of the things.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:26 AM   #3750
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Default Re: 2012-2013 English Premier League Thread (La Liga, Serie A, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by alenleomessi
I thought we were talking about careers? Since when is greatness based on peak play?

If we are talking about peak play and overall talent then CRonaldo is a top 10 player of all time... So is Eric Cantona. The two brazilians R could possibly be tied for 1st.
Iniesta and Zidane probably wouldnt even be top 20. But thats not it. YOu cant rank players like this. You have to look at all of the things.
gtfo retard
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