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Old 06-29-2012, 03:54 PM   #16
bokes15
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Said DeRozan has gained some weight since the end of the season looking tighter in shirts
Did he really say this? Like I give a f*ck what he looks like in shirts. I hope looking tighter in shirts boosts his confidence so that he can start making some shots for the ladies. And with that new found swag, also develop some legit off the dribble moves and passing ability.
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Old 06-29-2012, 03:58 PM   #17
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by bokes15
Did he really say this? Like I give a f*ck what he looks like in shirts. I hope looking tighter in shirts boosts his confidence so that he can start making some shots for the ladies. And with that new found swag, also develop some legit off the dribble moves and passing ability.

lmao for real
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:23 PM   #18
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by clipse
Dude, I'm not a "low grade fan", and I'm all for Nash. Get a winning culture and attract talent. Develop the young potential with a vet (nobody better than a former MVP who knows how to lead a team). Once Nash retires, the young guys will know how to be professionals in this league, and winning changes everything. Demeanor, environment and the roster will improve. The east is volatile, and if the plan comes together as I think BC has planned, we'd be fighting for tops in the Atlantic.
At 38 and with back problems, Nash is not an upgrade over Calderon in any area. Jose makes limited players look better (like Amir in pick and rolls). And he has won more titles than Nash in his career. Not disrespect to Nash, what he has done in his career and what he represents to Canadian fans. But if BC signs Nash, it is the same BC who try every season to get fans to the arena with whatever reason (hyped young players, overpayed FAs, the Canadian hero...) even if the team is deemed to failure.
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Old 06-29-2012, 04:35 PM   #19
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by FCardelle
At 38 and with back problems, Nash is not an upgrade over Calderon in any area. Jose makes limited players look better (like Amir in pick and rolls). And he has won more titles than Nash in his career. Not disrespect to Nash, what he has done in his career and what he represents to Canadian fans. But if BC signs Nash, it is the same BC who try every season to get fans to the arena with whatever reason (hyped young players, overpayed FAs, the Canadian hero...) even if the team is deemed to failure.

If you put Jose on last years suns, I doubt they even compete for a playoff spot.
Jose plays on the better side of caution, Nash pushes the ball up the floor trying to get easy buckets. Nash will be much better than Jose in p&r situations, and most importantly, brings intangibles such as leadership. And I'm sure other players will be more willing to consider the raps if Nash is on the roster.

The guidance Nash will provide is the key though.
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Old 06-29-2012, 05:29 PM   #20
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

Nash's great leadership will only help if we have good talent, which we do not. A few seasons of the 8th seed, first round exit is what we'll get. On top of it, we'll probably get BC adding some vets for the 'final push'. So when Nash retires in like TWO years, we're probably worse off big picture.
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Old 06-29-2012, 06:19 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by RapsFan
Nash's great leadership will only help if we have good talent, which we do not. A few seasons of the 8th seed, first round exit is what we'll get. On top of it, we'll probably get BC adding some vets for the 'final push'. So when Nash retires in like TWO years, we're probably worse off big picture.

How do you propose we turn the franchise around? Through the draft like okc? There's another team that tried doing that a couple years back around the same time... The blazers. Guys, building through the draft is at best an educated guess. Okc reached for Westbrook and with hindsight, the blazers would have taken durant, leaving okc with Oden. The draft depends on so much luck, and timing. BC is taking more control of the situation.

Who knows what Drummond will be in a few years, or rivers. And we got screwed on a coinflip with GS. Here's the thing, nobody knows at this point how Barnes will turn out. If someone drafted rondo in the top 3 of his class, people would crucify the pick. Let's see how this plays out.
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Old 06-29-2012, 06:25 PM   #22
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

To me, Nash at 38 is STILL better than Calderon at 31. There's a reason why BC is willing to amnesty him now, he finally analyzed the situation and realized that contract was a mistake. The guy is the highest paid player on our roster because BC was hype about the Euro-raptors and got off on his A/TO ratio. Don't get me wrong, Calderon is a good, solid, point guard but as has been said before he's not a risk taker like a Nash, Rondo, D-Will, Chris Paul, etc... He, like Bargnani, cashed in at the right time with the right guy pulling the strings and calling the shots upstairs but even at the time (at his best) he's a point guard who will fit in and do all the right things rather than a pg who will be a game changer like Steve Nash. Literally the only reason I wouldn't want him on our team at the current moment is his advanced age and the fact that he'd be with us for a year or two max, Olajuwan style. But then on the other hand i'd secretly be happy to see him in a Raptors jersey, even though i'd know that logically it's not the right move.
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Old 06-29-2012, 07:35 PM   #23
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
I agree. I just don't like it.

I fully expected this offseason to be based around getting players that can contribute right away and make a push for the playoffs. I alluded to this in the "Ed Davis will be traded" thread I made a while ago. I expect BC to throw a ton of money at Nash and him to sign with Toronto. I expect the Raptors to be a 6-8 seed next year and exit quietly in the 1st round unless Valanciunas turns into a star.

I am just completely against abandoning rebuilding at this stage and trying to build a winner with the current base of young talent. The only piece I feel comfortable in building a long-term winner with is Valanciunas. Derozan has been a big disappointment so far, Bargnani is what he is (no improvement left there) and I personally think Ross is a low-ceiling pick.

I understand that being patient and building a great team is not the goal in Toronto. I honestly think that the Bobcats will be in a better position than the Raptors in 3-4 years if their ownership sticks to what they said. Rich Cho told them that this team will be bad for a while before they can be good again and he needed time to build up the core.

Exactly. What they should be doing is acquiring first round picks (stockpiling).

Look at the trailblazers. They grabbed two solid pieces this year. Look at houston. Not just this year, but they grabbed a couple 1st rounders last year, and a quality 2nd rounder.

You don't have to come in last place, all you have to do is make a total youth commitment. Focus on guys that are on rookie contracts and trade your marginal talent for 1st rounders. (though bargs may be the only guy that can get you one at this point, then again houston got one for chase budinger).

Spend 3 years drafting excessively and developing the talent. Casey is actually the perfect coach for the job. We just need to replace BC with someone who will be slow and patient. Someone like AA.
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Old 06-29-2012, 07:39 PM   #24
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by bokes15
Did he really say this? Like I give a f*ck what he looks like in shirts. I hope looking tighter in shirts boosts his confidence so that he can start making some shots for the ladies. And with that new found swag, also develop some legit off the dribble moves and passing ability.

Yeah he said that and he was really excited about it too.
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Old 06-29-2012, 07:42 PM   #25
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by clipse
How do you propose we turn the franchise around? Through the draft like okc? There's another team that tried doing that a couple years back around the same time... The blazers. Guys, building through the draft is at best an educated guess. Okc reached for Westbrook and with hindsight, the blazers would have taken durant, leaving okc with Oden. The draft depends on so much luck, and timing. BC is taking more control of the situation.

Who knows what Drummond will be in a few years, or rivers. And we got screwed on a coinflip with GS. Here's the thing, nobody knows at this point how Barnes will turn out. If someone drafted rondo in the top 3 of his class, people would crucify the pick. Let's see how this plays out.

That's why you increase your odds by trading for multiple picks.
Boston built through the draft too. They acquired a lot of pieces and then traded them for 2 superstars. There are more ways than one to build through the draft.

You can also acquire young players via trade to "accelerate the process".

The fact is if you want to develop talent you have to give it minutes.
Even Solomon Alabi should have gotten more minutes than Gray and Maglore combined.

Last edited by bluerap : 06-29-2012 at 07:45 PM.
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Old 06-29-2012, 08:02 PM   #26
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by bluerap
That's why you increase your odds by trading for multiple picks.
Boston built through the draft too. They acquired a lot of pieces and then traded them for 2 superstars. There are more ways than one to build through the draft.

You can also acquire young players via trade to "accelerate the process".

The fact is if you want to develop talent you have to give it minutes.
Even Solomon Alabi should have gotten more minutes than Gray and Maglore combined.

Boston is also a historic franchise that can lure free agents. TOR is not a popular destination other than as the visiting team.

I agree with Alabi, and even regretted trading hibbert the year he went 17. Draft class has plenty to do with the need for picks too. We got the 1st in the weakest class in history. It's absolutely hilarious how much misfortune went to this team. GS winning the flip and getting Barnes. Talk about a swift kick in the nuts.
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Old 06-30-2012, 01:10 AM   #27
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

For myself, Nash specifically is a no-go... mainly because of his age. Steve Nash 5 years ago sure. But in general I agree with Molson said and i've been preaching this to a deaf ears on this forum for years now. You can't build a winner without winning players who bring a winning culture to the team. You put a bunch of guys who have had little to no success on an NBA level they aren't magically gonna become a contender. We are in the worst possible type of situation right now. One in which we aren't bad enough to get a high (top 3-5) draft pick and we aren't good enough to make the playoffs. And even if we did it would be due to the bottom half of the east being weak and we'd be a quick out by the 1 seed. So to me, we're at the point where we should be VERY open to trading any and all of our assets including but not limited to, Bargs, Derozan, Ed Davis, Amir , James Johnson, etc...

Last edited by bokes15 : 06-30-2012 at 01:12 AM.
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Old 06-30-2012, 01:21 AM   #28
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by bluerap
That's why you increase your odds by trading for multiple picks.
Boston built through the draft too. They acquired a lot of pieces and then traded them for 2 superstars. There are more ways than one to build through the draft.

You can also acquire young players via trade to "accelerate the process".

The fact is if you want to develop talent you have to give it minutes.
Even Solomon Alabi should have gotten more minutes than Gray and Maglore combined.
The difference is that Boston's picks were valuable. Al Jefferson by himself could bring in more than a package with Derozan, Ed Davis, Amir Jonshon and James Josnson combined.
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Old 06-30-2012, 02:50 AM   #29
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by bokes15
For myself, Nash specifically is a no-go... mainly because of his age. Steve Nash 5 years ago sure. But in general I agree with Molson said and i've been preaching this to a deaf ears on this forum for years now. You can't build a winner without winning players who bring a winning culture to the team. You put a bunch of guys who have had little to no success on an NBA level they aren't magically gonna become a contender. We are in the worst possible type of situation right now. One in which we aren't bad enough to get a high (top 3-5) draft pick and we aren't good enough to make the playoffs. And even if we did it would be due to the bottom half of the east being weak and we'd be a quick out by the 1 seed. So to me, we're at the point where we should be VERY open to trading any and all of our assets including but not limited to, Bargs, Derozan, Ed Davis, Amir , James Johnson, etc...

I'm sorry but I thought you were talking about assets.
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Old 06-30-2012, 09:29 AM   #30
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Default Re: BC on the fan this AM

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Originally Posted by clipse
Boston is also a historic franchise that can lure free agents. TOR is not a popular destination other than as the visiting team.

I agree with Alabi, and even regretted trading hibbert the year he went 17. Draft class has plenty to do with the need for picks too. We got the 1st in the weakest class in history. It's absolutely hilarious how much misfortune went to this team. GS winning the flip and getting Barnes. Talk about a swift kick in the nuts.


pierce was drafted, garnett and allen were trades. had nothing to do with fa.
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