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Old 08-07-2012, 04:17 AM   #31
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by Dictator
This is completely true, I read it in an artbook
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Old 08-07-2012, 04:35 AM   #32
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by JaggerCommaMick
I'm curious to know, mates, how you suppose Kobe is top-10 all time and Carmelo is not even top-10 active.

Frequently I hear the term 'best pure scorer' applied to each, and in fact they are often compared to each other proper.

But what tickles me is the assumption that Bean is so much better, rather than simply fortunate to play for the best organization in the whole of the world!

They are both about the same as pull-up shooters (which is their relative strength) and the same as spot-up shooters (which is not). Both are skilled in the post. Neither is known to be a distributor or play-maker. They are both quite honestly the same defensively (Bean being the most overrated defender of his generation, strictly from the undeserved bum-kissing he gets from the fans and media. The bloke bloody well said he doesn't even take charges, some 'will to win' that implies, yeah?) Both players make fans go many times each year. Both have demanded trades from their teams.

Anyway, mates, could Carmelo Anthony not win titles with prime Shaq? Tell me if you think so. Tell me if you think Anthony could not have won titles playing with Ariza/Artest, Odom, Bynum, Gasol who were all in their primes/motivated. Carmelo and Kobe do the exact same things, chaps. The exact same things.

How is Kobe an all-time great talent/player and Carmelo not close to him? They're the same guy, mates.

How are they different besides merely the success they've been a part of as a result of circumstantial differences (the teams they play for)?

Dude, Kobe is not top 10 of all time.
Neither is Carmelo.
They both like to chuck. But Melo is better at converting the shots.
Kobe is lucky he plays for a franchise that is heavily supported by the commish.
Melo never had the luxury of playing with solid big men (no Amare is not on Shaq's or Gasol's level).
Melo is >>>> Kobe all time.
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Old 08-07-2012, 05:51 AM   #33
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by StateOfMind12
Kobe is one of the best and most well-rounded players in NBA history whereas Carmelo is not and never was.

I don't know why Kobe's all-around game gets so underrated. Kobe's only weakness is shot-selection whereas I can list plenty of weaknesses for Melo that go beyond shot-selection.

I'd say this is close enough to the truth to agree with. Though Kobe is and has always been massively overrated defensively. It's not necessarily a weakness, but it's not close to being a strength kobe fan boys think it is. He can have all those all defensive selections, but he's not even a top 10 defensive guard all time.
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Old 08-07-2012, 06:00 AM   #34
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by Smoke117
I'd say this is close enough to the truth to agree with. Though Kobe is and has always been massively overrated defensively. It's not necessarily a weakness, but it's not close to being a strength kobe fan boys think it is. He can have all those all defensive selections, but he's not even a top 10 defensive guard all time.


Who votes for defensive team.
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Old 08-07-2012, 06:05 AM   #35
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by StateOfMind12
Are you talking about Kobe now or what Kobe was during his prime? Cause if you are talking about Kobe in his prime like I am, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Kobe in his prime averaged about 5-6 apg, and he could have averaged even more if he was more of a pass-first player. Kobe has always been about as skilled of a passer as Lebron was. The difference between the two was that Lebron was more willing of a passer.

So you cherry pick two series that conclude he wasn't a good defender? Are you even sure he was guarding either player? Kobe always guards Rondo and I haven't watched the 2004 Finals since the 2004 Finals so I don't remember if he was guarding Prince or Hamilton. Kobe has always been a great defender especially in the Shaq days. Years after though, Kobe showed that he still has great ability defensively but he just wasn't as consistent defensively. He was pretty consistent defensively in '06 and '08 from what I could recall and was alright in '09 as well.

Inefficient offensively? No, he is not inefficient at all especially if you look at his TS% which has always been in the 55-57% range which is very good. His FG% isn't really inefficient either, it is actually among the leauge average. It looks inefficient compared to Lebron and Jordan but it technically isn't inefficient.

So-so rebounder? No, Kobe has always been a great and capable rebounder. He always ups his rebounds in elimination games as well and I believe he averaged about 8 rpg in the '03 season when Shaq was out for those games.

Averaging about 6-7 rpg for a 6'6-6'7 SG is pretty good too.

wow. I have to say, i had to keep looking back at the username to see if this was you. i thought you were one of those complete kobe haters on here who refused to acknowledge anything positive about his game. yet, u proved me wrong and was actually fair and not bias in your response. to you i guess.
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Old 08-07-2012, 08:29 AM   #36
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Melo is taller
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Old 08-07-2012, 08:37 AM   #37
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Old 08-07-2012, 08:37 AM   #38
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaggerCommaMick
I'm curious to know, mates, how you suppose Kobe is top-10 all time and Carmelo is not even top-10 active.

Frequently I hear the term 'best pure scorer' applied to each, and in fact they are often compared to each other proper.

But what tickles me is the assumption that Bean is so much better, rather than simply fortunate to play for the best organization in the whole of the world!

They are both about the same as pull-up shooters (which is their relative strength) and the same as spot-up shooters (which is not). Both are skilled in the post. Neither is known to be a distributor or play-maker. They are both quite honestly the same defensively (Bean being the most overrated defender of his generation, strictly from the undeserved bum-kissing he gets from the fans and media. The bloke bloody well said he doesn't even take charges, some 'will to win' that implies, yeah?) Both players make fans go many times each year. Both have demanded trades from their teams.

Anyway, mates, could Carmelo Anthony not win titles with prime Shaq? Tell me if you think so. Tell me if you think Anthony could not have won titles playing with Ariza/Artest, Odom, Bynum, Gasol who were all in their primes/motivated. Carmelo and Kobe do the exact same things, chaps. The exact same things.

How is Kobe an all-time great talent/player and Carmelo not close to him? They're the same guy, mates.

How are they different besides merely the success they've been a part of as a result of circumstantial differences (the teams they play for)?

First off, I don't think Kobe is a top 10 talent. I think he is a great talent that's been on great teams and that's what's carried him to the top 10 (and you could say the same thing about a couple other guys on that list too, some of which couldn't play defense to save their life).

Having said that, Kobe plays better defense and has another gear that I've yet to see Melo shift into. He takes the game more seriously, and he demands more from his teammates and presents a better culture for winning.

Anyway, yes I do think Melo would cruise to rings w/ Prime Shaq (the same way any borderline superstar would have). Do I think he would have had the grit to win 2 more with Pau? Probably not.

Last edited by comerb : 08-07-2012 at 08:42 AM.
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Old 08-07-2012, 10:39 AM   #39
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

too many sock puppets these days. Everyone of OP's posts were about sh*tting on Kobe. Obvious agenda thread.
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Old 08-07-2012, 10:46 AM   #40
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

kobe's better but he couldnt do it on his own like some of you suggest, he also needed help getting his 5 rings but he has a killer extinct which he had since his early days that few players have today, which lebron discovered this year.

melo shows on and off killer extinct but is never consistent with it. hopefully this year is the year for melo to rise, get out of his baby shoes and step up.
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Old 08-07-2012, 10:57 AM   #41
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoke117
I'd say this is close enough to the truth to agree with. Though Kobe is and has always been massively overrated defensively. It's not necessarily a weakness, but it's not close to being a strength kobe fan boys think it is. He can have all those all defensive selections, but he's not even a top 10 defensive guard all time.

Kobe's best defensive years were during the 2000-02 3peat. At that time he was a bonfide first team all-defensive player, but in recent years he's been getting by on reputation. He's still capable of great defense, but he does it in spurts or when he's extra motivated( matched up against another elite perimeter player). Over the course of 82 games, he's certainly not a first team all-defense guard but in fairness, the guys who are better than him are really specialists and don't have to balance their energy on both ends of the court.
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Old 08-07-2012, 11:03 AM   #42
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Comparing Melo to Kobe?
Good one, obvious agenda.

Enough of the mick jagger shit its lame as fu*k also.
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Old 08-07-2012, 11:03 AM   #43
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluechox2
kobe's better but he couldnt do it on his own like some of you suggest, he also needed help getting his 5 rings but he has a killer extinct which he had since his early days that few players have today, which lebron discovered this year.

melo shows on and off killer extinct but is never consistent with it. hopefully this year is the year for melo to rise, get out of his baby shoes and step up.

Pretty sure NO ONE could do it on his own, so that statement's overly redundant.
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Old 08-07-2012, 11:10 AM   #44
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

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Originally Posted by Rooster
Who votes for defensive team.

I don't know if these young kids ever watched the 3 peat runs, but he was literally the best perimeter defender in the game during those years.Better defender than anyone I see in the league at the moment to be honest.
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Old 08-07-2012, 11:13 AM   #45
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Default Re: Mates, how do you suppose Kobe and Carmelo differ as talents?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JaggerCommaMick
Kobe is one of the most well rounded players, mate? Aside from scoring (where Carmelo is equally well rounded) how do you believe Kobe is so well rounded?

He's not a good distributor (constantly turns the ball over when he tries to go into pass mode)
He's not a good defender (eaten alive by Pierce, oh and Rip Hamilton dropped 21.4 per game on him in the finals for the Pistons, leading them in scoring. Also refuses to take charges, takes many plays off).
Inefficient offensively (He shoots less, team wins more - some might call that better off without him)
So-so Rebounder (For a bloody 6'6 guard he's certainly nothin special)


So what does he really do that Carmelo don't do, mate? Besides play for the best organization in sports who consistently accumulate the most overall team talent?

Based on the above, you started watching basketball in 2012.
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