Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > NBA Team Forums > Utah Jazz Forum

Utah Jazz Forum Utah Jazz forum - Utah Jazz message board

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-26-2006, 01:36 PM   #91
adamcz
Bucks fan
 
adamcz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: MA
Posts: 3,727
adamcz is considered somewhat cooladamcz is considered somewhat cooladamcz is considered somewhat cool
Default

Religions have long been at odds with the pursuit of equal rights, and it seems they always will be. Mormons in particular have discriminated against women and minorities, and continue to do so with gays. On one hand the religion is just a joke of Joe Smith's that has gone too far, but on the other hand the discrimination that they practice has very real effects on the people in America. It would be silly to place the lion's share of the blame on such a small religion, and I certainly don't - I'm just sticking to the topic at hand.

Mormon: Acting on your homosexual feelings is a sin that will be punished, according to the prophets. Thus we will not let them marry.
Normal person: The same prophets that believe planet Kolob is an actual physical planet where Gods live, and can be located on star maps?
Mormon: The same.
Normal person: The same prophets who believe that Elephants lived in America before Columbus in spite of empirical evidence stating otherwise?
Mormon: Right.
Normal person: Since the prophets are obviously just for-profit scam artists who trick people out of 10% of their wealth with secret handshakes and seer stones, how can their "prophecies" be worthy cause for discrimination?

If religions didn't hold the power to change laws, limiting the freedom of other people, they wouldn't be on my radar at all. In fact, if the polygamy-loving Mormons hadn't been chased to Utah to impose their conservative values on the state, NBA free agents wouldn't have a problem with living there, and this thread wouldn't exist.
adamcz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2006, 02:34 PM   #92
Rab
Jared Dudley's #1 Fan
 
Rab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Purple Palace
Posts: 2,870
Rab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this board
Default

The fundamental beliefs of most religions are ancient, and are based on what the prophets of old were told by God through revelation, which is where the root of most of Mormon's beliefs stem from. Just because we live in a world where everything has to be "PC" isn't going to hinder those beliefs one way or the other.

Quote:
Mormons in particular have discriminated against women and minorities, and continue to do so with gays

Women? How so? Because they don't hold the priesthood? If that's your point, you're off base. The place of the woman in the Mormon church is sacred. They are honored, and beloved, and are put on a pedastool above men in most cases. Minorites? Again, are you just soley focusing on the black issue again? Blacks were never discriminated against. They have always been allowed to join and participate in the church. What other minorites have been persecuted?

Quote:
on one hand the religion is just a joke of Joe Smith's that has gone too far, but on the other hand the discrimination that they practice has very real effects on the people in America.

How so? If it's such a small religion as you stated, how does it impact such a large portion of a population. Again, I don't see where you're coming from with the discriminatory arguement.

Joseph Smith believed he saw God the Father, and Jesus Christ. He was persecuted for this his entire life. If you are a believer of religion, why should this type of event be any different than the experiences of Moses? I don't see how it couldn't be possible. The man was beaten, tarred and feathered, and eventually killed for this belief. I would say his beliefs were far from a joke.


Quote:
Mormon: Acting on your homosexual feelings is a sin that will be punished, according to the prophets. Thus we will not let them marry.
Normal person: The same prophets that believe planet Kolob is an actual physical planet where Gods live, and can be located on star maps?
Mormon: The same.
Normal person: The same prophets who believe that Elephants lived in America before Columbus in spite of empirical evidence stating otherwise?
Mormon: Right.
Normal person: Since the prophets are obviously just for-profit scam artists who trick people out of 10% of their wealth with secret handshakes and seer stones, how can their "prophecies" be worthy cause for discrimination?

Okay, basically what this boils down to is that, again, churches beliefs in many things stem from ancient Bible teachings. Do I feel like getting into a lot of this, not really, but I will touch on a couple things. As far as the gay marriage thing goes. It is taught in the Bible that marriage between man and woman is sacred in the eyes of God. Why would a church that believes that marriage is a sacred institution between a man and woman suddenly support marriage between 2 members of the same sex? That would be hypocrisy, and then you would have a vaild point.

As far as the 10% of your earnings is scam thing....go read Malachi in the Bible. Heck, go read all of the Bible. You will see that the law of the tithe is nothing new. It is their way of giving something back to God for all that he has provided. It's an ancient concept. Animal sacrafices were made to God in those days, until Christ's death.

None of the churches leaders are paid. The money that is donated to the church goes to building new church buildings and temples, helping the poor and needy, and an education fund that helps less fortunate people from some third world countries go to college. That sounds like a big scam to me. :rollingeyes:

Quote:
If religions didn't hold the power to change laws, limiting the freedom of other people, they wouldn't be on my radar at all. In fact, if the polygamy-loving Mormons hadn't been chased to Utah to impose their conservative values on the state, NBA free agents wouldn't have a problem with living there, and this thread wouldn't exist.

Wow, you just sound bitter here. When the land was settled back in the 1800's, of course the state laws were going to follow those of their beliefs. No one else was living there. In today's world, those laws are still conservative laws yes, but it's not because the church has an overwhelming influence on capital hill. Seeing as how 50% of the population is Mormon, the political leaders that are elected are most likely going to be conservative. I don't really see where they limit anyone's freedom. You can find the exact same things in the state of Utah, as you can find anywhere in the country.

And polygamy.....that hasn't been practiced in over 150 years. Get over it.
Rab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2006, 11:17 PM   #93
SomeBunghole
Banned
 
SomeBunghole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 746
SomeBunghole has an OK reputation so far
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rab
Wow, you just sound bitter here. When the land was settled back in the 1800's, of course the state laws were going to follow those of their beliefs. No one else was living there. In today's world, those laws are still conservative laws yes, but it's not because the church has an overwhelming influence on capital hill. Seeing as how 50% of the population is Mormon, the political leaders that are elected are most likely going to be conservative. I don't really see where they limit anyone's freedom. You can find the exact same things in the state of Utah, as you can find anywhere in the country.

You know, vast majority of people in say, France, are at least nominally Catholic, and you can still get an abortion, marry a dude, and do quite a few other things in that country that the Bible frowns upon. The Catholic church has very little political clout and virtually no effect on the public life. I can't say the same thing for the LDS Church and Utah.
SomeBunghole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2006, 11:45 PM   #94
Kobe#1fan
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 40
Kobe#1fan has no real reputation yet.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamRuled
If your going to talk about percentages and averages, then how about this:

In the year 2000, America was 75% white. When will the whole league stop being so racist and start drafting more in line with the national average?

Just a thought.

For the most part, what Utah has done has been fairly successful, so why knock it?

When is the last time they made the playoffs.
Kobe#1fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2006, 12:03 AM   #95
TheReturnofCed
The Real Ced
 
TheReturnofCed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Cedville
Posts: 1,061
TheReturnofCed is starting to rub some people the wrong wayTheReturnofCed is starting to rub some people the wrong way
Default

I'd like Adam Morrison in Utah.
TheReturnofCed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2006, 03:15 PM   #96
AndyDufrain
Can barely lace up my sneakers
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The pacific coast of Mexico.
Posts: 15
AndyDufrain has an OK reputation so far
Default right

Thats why they'll trade for szerbiak and scalabrine and draft reddick.
AndyDufrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2006, 03:42 PM   #97
Rab
Jared Dudley's #1 Fan
 
Rab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: The Purple Palace
Posts: 2,870
Rab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this boardRab is popular on this board
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by adamcz
In spite of all other GM's saying that Reddick is a lock to slip out of the lottery?

From CakeorDeath:

Quote:
Yes. Utah has had 36 draft picks since 1988, and 23 of them were black. 12 were white (of which 5 were European and 1, Pavel Podkolzine, never played for the team) and Kris Humphries may be of mixed race.

Everytime a white player goes to Utah you are going to scream conspiracy, even though the Jazz don't have a tendancy to draft all white players. If the Jazz were so moral and image conscience, why would they take someone (a white guy nontheless) who was just arrested for a DUI?
Rab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2006, 01:52 AM   #98
lowblok
High School Varsity 6th Man
 
lowblok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Logan, 4114
Posts: 587
lowblok has an OK reputation so far
Default

Brewer, Brown and Millsap. Hmmm, Utah sure is racist!
lowblok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2006, 02:53 AM   #99
Unregistered
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Haha, you guys see Brewer's reaction at hearing his name called?

He was like damnit god, didn't u hear my prayers?

Anyway, huge Utah fan here... Basketball players don't like it cuz Salt Lake City is just about the boring-est city out there for a young worldly male. The weather there's nothing to brag about, and the only attraction is skiing, which most black people don't care too much for. Thus, lotsa people (both white and black, but especially blacks) don't want to go to utah. The management's accepted it... it's not being rascist... the people wholeheartly support the team to the point of rediculousness (i mean, they traded for Ostertag BACK), regardless of black or white.

I don't like Brewer's selection. Utah needed a shooter, and Brewer's just about the opposite. And if he doesn't get over the fact that he'll be in Utah for at least 3 years, Sloan'll pick up on the attitude and he'll be benched and go the way of Snyder. Not the best way to start your career. Dee Brown's already a fan favorite in Utah due to his connections with Deron Williams, and frankly I'm hopeful that he'll win that backup spot (starter will most likely be Giricek in the beginning) over Brewer. Don't know much about the LSU PF, but heard he hustles, which is good. Sloan always likes big men who hustle (i'm thinking of a young Miki Moore, but haven't seen him play yet).
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2006, 12:39 PM   #100
Unregistered
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dearest Adam, what do you have against Utah and Mormons? You seem like such a cool cat and all....


<img src="http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/2019/bkg36zn.jpg" />
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2006, 12:45 PM   #101
Unregistered
 
Posts: n/a
Default

  Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2006, 01:10 PM   #102
adamcz
Bucks fan
 
adamcz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: MA
Posts: 3,727
adamcz is considered somewhat cooladamcz is considered somewhat cooladamcz is considered somewhat cool
Default

What kind of ***** logs out so that they can post pictures of me anonymously?
adamcz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2006, 01:36 PM   #103
Pre777
I airball my layups
 
Pre777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 59
Pre777 has an OK reputation so far
Default

a religion that has historically believed that black people did not choose sides between Jesus and Satan in the beginning of time (in 1978, the Mormon church decided to allow blacks to join, but they have never officially rescinded the claim that they are cursed).


This is a bunch of crap. Why would you think the mormons believe that stuff? Where did you get this?
Pre777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2006, 03:36 AM   #104
tnelson1
Can barely lace up my sneakers
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2
tnelson1 has an OK reputation so far
Default They draft players that fit their system not by race.

It just so happens that their two best players are white.
I don't think there is a team in the league that wouldn't like Kirilenko.
tnelson1 is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:42 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy