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Old 09-07-2012, 10:45 AM   #286
Godzuki
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

Quote:
Originally Posted by brantonli
you Americans are all so spoilt on gas complaining about $5 gas, check this out:

http://www.bloomberg.com/slideshow/2...ry.html#slide5

Norway: $10.12
Turkey: $9.41
Israel: $9.38

and just in case you are interested, here's Bloomberg's blurb on USA's petrol prices:
http://www.bloomberg.com/slideshow/2...y.html#slide51



(for some reason they show the price of premium gasoline, not sure why). I wish I had whatever price you guys are complaining about lol.

EDIT: I'm confused....so gas = oil/petrol? I don't live in the states so I guess I got thrown by the terminology. Pat chewing, I didn't get why you put up that graph because you were arguing about $4 gas and hten I saw a graph on oil at $100, so I thought there was no relevance between them. My mistake!

jesus how do people even drive unless they're rich with those gas prices?

thats absurd.
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Old 09-07-2012, 10:51 AM   #287
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

bil clinton was pimping out there
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Old 09-07-2012, 11:02 AM   #288
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Barack Obama is deeply overexposed and often boring. He never seems to be saying what he's thinking. His speech Thursday was weirdly anticlimactic. There's too much buildup, the crowd was tired, it all felt flat. He was somber, and his message was essentially banal: We've done better than you think. Who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?

There were many straw men. There were phrases like "the shadow of a shuttered steel mill," which he considers writerly. But they sound empty and practiced now, like something you've heard in a commercial or an advertising campaign.

It was stale and empty. He's out of juice.

His daughters have grown beautiful.

As for Joe Biden, I love him and will hear nothing against him. He's like Democrats the way they used to be, and by that I do not mean idiotic, I mean normal—manipulative only to a normal degree, roughly aware of the facts of normal life, alert to and even respecting of such normal things as religious faith. I wish he did not insist on referring to his wife as "Dr. Jill Biden." I'm sure she has many doctorates, but so do half the unemployed in Manhattan.

John Kerry was on fire. It was the best speech of his career. He drew blood on foreign policy: "Talk about being before it before you were against it!" Obama will take that message, on Afghanistan, into debate.
***

Was it a good convention?

Beneath the funny hats, the sweet-faced delegates, the handsome speakers and the babies waving flags there was something disquieting. All three days were marked by a kind of soft, distracted extremism. It was unshowy and unobnoxious but also unsettling.

There was the relentless emphasis on Government as Community, as the thing that gives us spirit and makes us whole. But government isn't what you love if you're American, America is what you love. Government is what you have, need and hire. Its most essential duties—especially when it is bankrupt—involve defending rights and safety, not imposing views and values. We already have values. Democrats and Republicans don't see all this the same way, and that's fine—that's what national politics is, the working out of this dispute in one direction or another every few years. But the Democrats convened in Charlotte seemed more extreme on the point, more accepting of the idea of government as the center of national life, than ever, at least to me.

The fight over including a single mention of God in the platform—that was extreme. The original removal of the single mention by the platform committee—extreme. The huge "No!" vote on restoring the mention of God, and including the administration's own stand on Jerusalem—that wasn't liberal, it was extreme. Comparing the Republicans to Nazis—extreme. The almost complete absence of a call to help education by facing down the powers that throw our least defended children under the school bus—this was extreme, not mainstream.

The sheer strangeness of all the talk about abortion, abortion, contraception, contraception. I am old enough to know a wedge issue when I see one, but I've never seen a great party build its entire public persona around one. Big speeches from the heads of Planned Parenthood and NARAL, HHS Secretary and abortion enthusiast Kathleen Sebelius and, of course, Sandra Fluke.

"Republicans shut me out of a hearing on contraception," Ms. Fluke said. But why would anyone have included a Georgetown law student who never worked her way onto the national stage until she was plucked, by the left, as a personable victim?

What a fabulously confident and ingenuous-seeming political narcissist Ms. Fluke is. She really does think—and her party apparently thinks—that in a spending crisis with trillions in debt and many in need, in a nation in existential doubt as to its standing and purpose, in a time when parents struggle to buy the good sneakers for the kids so they're not embarrassed at school . . . that in that nation the great issue of the day, and the appropriate focus of our concern, is making other people pay for her birth-control pills. That's not a stand, it's a non sequitur. She is not, as Rush Limbaugh oafishly, bullyingly said, a slut. She is a ninny, a narcissist and a fool.

And she was one of the great faces of the party in Charlotte. That is extreme. Childish, too.

Something else, and it had to do with tone. I remember the Republicans in Tampa bashing the president, hard, but not the entire Democratic Party. In Charlotte they bashed Mitt Romney, but they bashed the Republican Party harder. If this doesn't strike you as somewhat unsettling, then you must want another four years of all war all the time between the parties. I don't think the American people want that. Because, actually, they're not extreme.
***

Bill Clinton is The Master. That is stipulated. Almost everyone in the media was over the moon about his speech. It was a shrewd and superb moment of political generosity, his hauling into town to make the case, but it was a hack speech. It was the speech of a highly gifted apparatchik. All great partisan speeches include some hard and uncomfortable truths, but Mr. Clinton offered none. He knows better than so much of what he said. In real life he makes insightful statements on the debt, the deficit and the real threat they pose. He knows more about the need for and impediments to public-school reform than half the reformers do. He knows exactly why both parties can't reach agreement in Washington, and what each has done wrong along the way. But Wednesday night he stuck to fluid fictions and clever cases. It was smaller than Bill Clinton is.

Still, he gave the president one great political gift: He put Medicaid on the table. He put it right there next to the pepper shaker and said Look at that! People talk Medicare and Social Security, but, as Mr. Clinton noted, more than half of Medicaid is spent on nursing-home care for seniors and on those with disabilities such as Down syndrome and autism. Will it be cut?

Here's what I'm seeing the past 10 years. The baby boomers have been supporting their grown children and their aged parents. They are stressed, stretched and largely uncomplaining, because they know that as boomers—shallow, selfish—they're the only generation not allowed to complain. And just as well, as complaints are the only area of national life where we have a surplus. But they are spiritually and financially holding the country together, and they're coming to terms with the fact that it's going to be that way for a good long time. They're going to take a keen interest in where Medicaid goes.

Romney-Ryan take note: this will arrive as an issue.
***

So: was it a good convention? We'll know by the polls, by the famous bounce, or lack of it. A guess? Dead-cat bounce. Just like the Republicans got.

Maybe Mr. Clinton made a bigger, more broadly positive impression than I suspect; maybe a sense the Democrats were extreme will take hold. People left both conventions talking about only one thing: the debates. They know they didn't move the needle in Tampa and Charlotte. The people in charge of politics aren't so good at politics anymore.

http://online.wsj.com/article/declarations.html
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Old 09-07-2012, 11:04 AM   #289
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER: I was stunned. This is a man who gave one of the great speeches of our time in 2004, and he gave one of the emptiest speeches I have ever heard on a national stage. Yes, it had cadence, and yes, there were deceptions in it, but that is not what is so striking about it. There was nothing in it. This is a man who believes that government can and should do a lot. There is nothing in here that tells us how he's going to go from today to tomorrow. For any of the so called goals and what government is going to do, what is he going to enact?

At least Romney had a five point plan. What we heard from Obama was a vision. And he pulls numbers out of a hat. 100,000 new math and science teachers. 600,000 more people working in natural gas. Two million more trainees, and he doesn't say how we get from A to B. It's a vision. I have a vision of an America where there is no disease and everybody has a private airplane, but unless I tell you how we get there, I’ve said nothing. And what is so surprising, is that - all he had left - he can't speak about his record on the economy, and it's not a good one. As we heard, he didn't speak about achievements, the one that's liberals like, ObamaCare, stimulus and etc… they're unpopular.

So, at least he would talk about the future, what he's going to to. There was nothing there. I’m amazed that he was -- it was like this is a guy who is the A student in the class turning in a paper clearly a C, and the teacher says, “How could you do this? Why did you mail it in?” I felt the Biden speech was infinitely better, because it was empathic and carried a message, but the Obama speech, I thought was flat and had no content in it. Otherwise, I loved it, really…

KRAUTHAMMER: Well, it is the heart of the debate with Republicans and Romney. The heart of the debate between left and right, since the French Revolution. The individual or community, and he stands for the community, which he translates as government. So with that abstract, a cleverly sealed argument.

But, that is not what you're talking about in an acceptance speech, when you've been in power for four years. People expect you to say I’m going to do X, Y, and Z, and we didn't hear any of that. So, as a philosophical issue, yes, but without any of that meat on the bone, I think it rings quite hollow.

KRAUTHAMMER: I think it does [affect Independents] and I think it's a negative. If you're an independent and aren't a committed person on the left or right. And you were sort of a pragmatist, and you’re listening and the President offers you numbers out of a hat, he wants a lot of this and that. He’s mentioning again and again with wind and solar and algae, but he didn't use a word, he used biofuel. And you say, I’ve heard this, this is nothing new. This, is what he tried, he talked about. Where is the meat to make me think that I should have hope and faith? That we will achieve anything? That is what I think he's lacking. I think for independents, it will send him somewhat backwards.


http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid...ver_heard.html
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Old 09-07-2012, 12:25 PM   #290
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

Only 96,000 jobs added this month, lower than expected. Unemployment drops to 8.1% only because people more Americans are leaving the labor force. Bad news for Obama.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...ate-falls.html
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Old 09-07-2012, 12:28 PM   #291
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by DirtySanchez
I do not think this election will be close at this point I think Obama wins by a landslide.
In your dreams He is tied in Florida and Ohio with Romney. This will be a very close election.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:23 PM   #292
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by General
In your dreams He is tied in Florida and Ohio with Romney. This will be a very close election.
Check the electoral map, Romney has a much harder path to 270 than Obama, if Romney doesn't win Michigan (Romney was born there but he opposed the auto bail out and it leaning Obama right now) and Ohio, it's almost impossible to win the presidency.

Forget national poll numbers, it's all about who's leading in the battleground states. Florida just got tougher for the GOP because the Dems will scare old folks into thinking Ryan wants to take MediCare away from them. If the GOP can't win FL, landslide for Obama.

The GOP is doing so poorly with women, minorities and young people that they need to win huge with white working men. Clinton is going to attract enough of them in the battleground states that Obama will win comfortably. Clinton is the Dems biggest weapon, Romney doesn't have anyone of that stature campaigning for him and he really isn't a charismatic enough candidate to overcome Obama/Clinton.
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Old 09-07-2012, 04:58 PM   #293
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by KevinNYC
The reasons for Gas Prices going up in the US is unfortunately long term. The market for oil is global. With economies like China and India rising so fast so quickly in the last few years, they are buying more oil. China and India have more than 1/3 of total population of the Earth. The economics of oil are such that even though we need oil from other countries, we export 1 million barrels of crude oil a year. (I'm guessing this is Alaskan oil to Canada because it would be too expensive to ship otherwise.)

Canada is our #1 exporter followed by Mexico. Just fyi. It's not Saudi Arabia like most people think.
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Old 09-07-2012, 05:07 PM   #294
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by General
So we suddenly stop talking about gas prices after I provide stats that shows we have been paying the highest annual gas prices in American history under Obama, those are the numbers that matter, not the weekly peaks.

I don't even think Obama even cares about the gas prices, he probably looks at it as a way to get more people into hybrids

Dude, the president can't do much about gas prices. Obama doesn't run refineries. He doesn't send hurricanes into the gulf. He doesn't control the price of ethanol (increase in ethanol=increase in gas prices since gas has to be 10% ethanol. You CAN blame the government for that one.)

Also, there is a transition period that refineries go through to switch fuel grades. So of course, they run less efficient during this transition.

Obama shutting down the gulf due to the BP explosion was stupid though.
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Old 09-07-2012, 05:07 PM   #295
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by Jailblazers7
Its embarrassing that the gas price is discussed during presidential elections.

This.
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Old 09-07-2012, 06:57 PM   #296
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by Balla_Status
Canada is our #1 exporter followed by Mexico. Just fyi. It's not Saudi Arabia like most people think.

Just to be clear, I was selling we sell 1 million barrels to Canada. And as you point out, we IMPORT heavily from Mexico and Canada.
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:03 PM   #297
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

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Originally Posted by KevinNYC
Just to be clear, I was selling we sell 1 million barrels to Canada. And as you point out, we IMPORT heavily from Mexico and Canada.

Yeah, I understood that. Those were just general facts I thought most people should know. Doesn't really make sense though...I don't know too much about the downstream part of the industry. Seems like we're importing less and less oil though.
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Old 09-08-2012, 06:05 AM   #298
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Default Re: Bigass Poltical thread Part V: The Democratic Convention

Gawd, these politicians lie so damn much. These last 4 years have been crap. Stop robbing the treasury and truly care about the country. These professional liars don't give a sh## about you. Giving you stuff is not caring about you. It's just making you dependent. Slaves in other words. Nothing is free.
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