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Old 09-05-2012, 01:51 AM   #46
BlackVVaves
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pauk
I feel its between these guys here...


................D-ROB......DIRK......ISIAH....GARNETT....
MVP..............1............1............0...... .......1..........
FMVP............0............1............1....... .......0.........
CHAMP..........2............1............2........ ......1........
ROTY...........Yes.........No..........No......... ...No........
DPOY............1............0............0....... .......1........
1st All-NBA....4............4............3..............4. ........
1st All-Def.....4............0............0..............9 .........
All-Star........10..........11...........12........... .14.........


Isiah & Dirk had by far the better championship runs as D-Rob & Garnett were really not the best players in those championship teams nor were they that productive-dominant as Isiah & Dirk were in those championship playoff runs....

Meanwhile D-Rob & Garnett in their primes were probably better overall individual talents, especially defensively, the defensive accolades speak for themselves....

Close, but I am leaning towards Isiah & Dirk... if it has to be one of them then i say Dirk Nowitzki, he has 1 MVP compared to Isiah and i feel Dirk had a better playoff championship run especially with the competition he was facing...

I vote DIRK NOWITZKI...

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Old 09-05-2012, 01:54 AM   #47
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by Colbertnation64
Just for reference

Rebounds and the all-star game didn't start until the 1951 season.

No MVPs, no final MVPs. No defensive teams, no defensive player of the year award, only 1 all nba team. It makes his resume look much more bare than it would have been otherwise. Realistically you're looking at 3-4 MVPs, 4-5 Finals MVPs, a Rookie of the Year, 3 more all star games, some all defensive teams and possibly a DPOY to throw on top of that.

So something conservative like this(he could've had more MVPs but this is the bottom end of an estimate)

5 Championships
5 Finals MVPs
3 MVPs
6 All NBA Teams
6 All Defensive Team
1 Rookie of the year
6 All Stars
1 Defensive player of the year.



All while helping modernize the NBA, that's not top 20? Not to mention that's in 7 seasons...

Thats exactly what i mean, that is hypothetical........ with those accomplishments he would be #3 or something of all time in my list.... kindof like when talking about Bill Russell and how many FMVP/DPOYs he would have if those accomplishments did exist at that time, in which if he would have he would be the undisputed GOAT by far (considering he was the best player in his team and often the best defensive player in the NBA)....

Last edited by pauk : 09-05-2012 at 01:58 AM.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:54 AM   #48
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Why is Pauk naming Garnett? He's already been voted in.
Anyways, I vote for Mikan again.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:55 AM   #49
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by BlackVVaves

There was no undisputed best player, leader, mvp, alpha or whatever you want to call it in that team... or was it?
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:56 AM   #50
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by Deuce Bigalow
Allstar teams were not selected until 1951
MVP awards were not awarded until 1956
Finals MVPs were not awarded until 1969

Mikan would have more Allstar selections, at least multiple MVPs, and 5 Finals MVPs.

With a resume like that, who cares about longevity.
Pretty much exactly what I'm saying. He domination of the NBA(respective of era) is right at the top.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:56 AM   #51
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by rhythmic †hesis
Why is Pauk naming Garnett? He's already been voted in.
Anyways, I vote for Mikan again.

Just for the comparasants sake.

Last edited by pauk : 09-05-2012 at 01:59 AM.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:58 AM   #52
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pauk
Just for the comparasants sake, my top 25 looks different.

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Old 09-05-2012, 02:00 AM   #53
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

George Mikan
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:01 AM   #54
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

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Originally Posted by pauk
Thats exactly what i mean, that is hypothetical........ with those accomplishments he would be #3 or something of all time in my list.... kindof like when talking about Bill Russell and how many FMVP/DPOYs he would have if those accomplishments did exist at that time, in which if he would have he would be the undisputed GOAT by far (considering he was the best player in his team and often the best defensive player in the NBA)....

And the only reason Mikan doesn't have those awards is because they didn't exist. How hard is that to understand? Why should he be penalized for a "bare" resume due to a bunch of the things that bolster other resumes not existing during his career?

God, did you not learn anything from that LeBron/West/Oscar debate about POTM, All-Defense Teams, and DPOY?
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:01 AM   #55
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Isiah Thomas winning not 1, but 2 rings during the Magic/Bird/Jordan era is way more valuable than any of the awards Robinson and Dirk have. On top of that he had 4 consecutive 20/10 seasons as a point guard. Magic Johnson only had 3 in his whole career. The only other point guard to do that was Oscar Robertson.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:05 AM   #56
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colbertnation64
Pretty much exactly what I'm saying. He domination of the NBA(respective of era) is right at the top.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KG215
And the only reason Mikan doesn't have those awards is because they didn't exist. How hard is that to understand? Why should he be penalized for a "bare" resume due to a bunch of the things that bolster other resumes not existing during his career?

God, did you not learn anything from that LeBron/West/Oscar debate about POTM, All-Defense Teams, and DPOY?


Do we rank them by hypothetics, myths and legends or the actual awards they actualy yield... that is the million dollar question....

If your answer is hypothetics, then Bill Russell is the undisputed GOAT and George Mikan is probably top 5 of all time.

If your answer is no, then Bill Russell is still in the top 10 but George Mikan is faaaaar away from top 5...

How do you plead?

Last edited by pauk : 09-05-2012 at 02:08 AM.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:05 AM   #57
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pauk
There was no undisputed best player, leader, mvp or whatever you want to call it in that team... or was it?

Garnett was the best player, most valuable individual, and undisputed leader of the Celtics until the latter part of the 2010-2011 season.

On that 2008 championship team? Garnett was the guy.

Pierce was awarded the FMVP, but that team, as blasphemous as it may have seemed to Boston fans at that time (considering Pierce's long and brittle tenure with the Celtics organization) was more impacted by Garnett's post-peak prowess than anyone else.

Did you not watch the NBA back then? Serious question, requesting an honest answer.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:08 AM   #58
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by KG215
And the only reason Mikan doesn't have those awards is because they didn't exist. How hard is that to understand? Why should he be penalized for a "bare" resume due to a bunch of the things that bolster other resumes not existing during his career?

God, did you not learn anything from that LeBron/West/Oscar debate about POTM, All-Defense Teams, and DPOY?

Apparently not.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:08 AM   #59
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

it was close between dirk, d-rob and zeke. but ill go with dirk.
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:08 AM   #60
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Default Re: #22 NBA Player Of All-Time According to InsideHoops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pauk
Do we rank them by hypothetics, myths and legends or the actual awards they actualy yield... that is the million dollar question....

If your answer hypothetics, then Bill Russell is the undisputed GOAT and George Mikan is probably top 5 of all time.

If your answer is no, then Bill Russell is still in the top 10 but George Mikan is faaaaar away...

That's the problem with using awards as your basis to form your opinions. Almost all these awards were not always available to every player.


It's like saying Cy Young was not a good pitcher because he never won a Cy Young award.
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