To the people who think Bird was a better passer than Lebron....

[pauk]

...i am gona end those thoughts right now if you dont mind....

Before i start keep in mind that Larry Bird is one of my top 3 favorite players of all time. The only agenda here is nothing but the truth based on only factual exhibits and for the reason of simply respect for the damn game & its players...

Alright... first of all...

Lebron was the first 6'8"+ drafted "PG/SG" since Magic Johnson: http://www.thedraftreview.com/index....sk=view&id=662

For a big reason as all scouting reports said even before he joined the NBA:

"Shows unbelievable ability when it comes to passing the ball. Simply has that uncanny court vision and knack for seeing plays develop before they occur."

"Has unbeliavable ballhandling for his size."

"His vision and passing skills are what sets him apart. A player with his combination of size, and point guard skills is very rare. The only player to have this in the past was Magic Johnson. There are no more than 5 players in the NBA that have the vision and passing skills of LeBron (2003)"

"NBA Comparasion: Magic Johnson"

Lebron has played/started Point-Guard in the NBA alot of times and will still do it when asked from the coach. When he plays the Point-Guard position, he not only plays it because he can, but he can do it actually better than any Point-Guard in the NBA in actually any facit of the game... as evident of his productions & wins during anytime he started Point-Guard... as a Point-Guard his assists blow up to amazing & consistent heights, while still maintaining his all-round play & productions.... One example is in his Cavs season 2010 (where he averaged 8.6 APG), during the time Mo Williams was injured Lebron started the PG position 13 games in a row and produced like this:



That is:
31.7 PPG
7.3 RPG
11.6 APG
12 wins, 1 loss

Larry Bird averaged 6.3 APG for his career
Lebron James averages 6.9 APG for his career

Larry Birds highest average was 7.6 APG
Lebron James highest average was 8.6 APG (which is the highest assist average in NBA history by a SF and a non-PG)

Lebron James is also on a pace to become the first Non-PG to be on the Top 10 All-Time assist leaders list.... this is a 100% guarantee he will, unless someone shoots him.

What you see upstairs is something Larry Bird wasnt able to do as a passer due to the lack of overall pointguard skills... and as you can see Lebron was a more productive passer than Larry Bird was, he had greater ballhandling ability/pointguard skills aswell which overall allowed him to even further exploit that passing ability & court vision, which resulted in finding more passing angles where he could dish out even more as he could move with the ball wherever to whatever spot better....... which resulted in him actually being only the 2nd 6'8"+ guy allowed with trust to start the PG position in the NBA ever (2nd ofcourse to only Magic and Magic was by far the bets passer ever, its not a coincidence)....


PASSING SKILLS HIGHLIGHTS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Scb53J8dkIE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCx8a...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx5lT...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooEELfpn2C8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPr3NNGL_fg

and alot more....

If you have seen enough games of Lebron what you will realize is that besides the fact of him doing a better job than Bird of dishing the ball is that he also moves the ball better to so many key spots on the floor with such precision and impeccable timing throughout the course of the games. When you take into consideration the situation in which his assists are delivered, the timing, how accurate it is, how quickly it flies and how intelligent it was... you will then realize how special it is, he will in some cases deliver the ball before even his teammate knew he was open.

Larry Bird could also do this but to a somewhat lesser assembly and mostly from stationary situations, he simply was a pure scoring SF that was unselfish and loved to make the flashy pass... he possessed amazing passing & vision...

My point is, Lebron & Larry were the two best non-PG passers in NBA history..... but if you want to call somebody better in that department then the answer is more safer by saying Lebron James rather than Larry Bird due to the verifiable evidence....

Even if you refuse to recognize this right now due to whatever agenda, you will recognize this when Lebrons career is over.... Until then, sit back and enjoy seeing Lebron dishing much more of some of the best passes in NBA history and dishing himself ALL assist records as a Non-PG...... which probably no Non-PG will ever be able to touch after he retires....


Over and out...

[stallionaire]

No shit. Anyone who thinks Bird was a better passer is an absolute retard.

[tmacattack33]

I can't say I've watched many Bird games...and i probably havent watched any of his regular games...only the classics that they show on ESPN Classic and NBA TV.

So I can't say. And even if I did watch him play, it'd still probably be hard to say who was better with it. I mean, we would be trying to differentiate between the player in the 99.8th percentile and the player in the 99.7th percentile or whatever.

But yeah, Lebron's a ridiculously good passer. I was especially impressed with how he proved to be our best facilitator on team USA over Chris Paul and Deron Williams.

[ChuckOakley]

Not sure what a 13 game sample of LBJ playing PG has to do with who the better passer is.
LBJ is a better PG because of his ball handling, speed, muscle, athleticism, and the fact he has specifically played full time point guard. Bird was arguably the better/more creative passer.

[Money 23]

Bird was just as good. And did it without having to dribble as much. His touch passes were a thing of abosulte beauty. Not to say LeBron sucks, but Bird is right there with him.

[CavaliersFTW]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o66NdFDHEQ


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/thread

[Whoah10115]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o66NdFDHEQ


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/thread

Is correct.



Larry Bird is the better passer and it's pretty obvious. People is dumb.

[NumberSix]

LeBron passes a good ball.

[DatAsh]

I don't think people are neccesarily saying that Larry would make a better point guard when they refer to him as the better passer. They're referring to the actual act of passing the ball in and of itself, and Larry definately has an argument for being better in that department. Lebron would make a better pg than Larry because of his superior ball-handling and penetration skills, but when it comes to actually passing the basketball, the two are very close, and I don't think you can definitively say that Lebron is better. When push comes to shove, Larry is probably a top five passer ever.

[Whoah10115]

I don't think people are neccesarily saying that Larry would make a better point guard when they refer to him as the better passer. There referring to the actual act of passing the ball in and of itself, and Larry definately has an argument for being better in that department. Lebron would make a better pg than Larry because of his superior ball-handling and penetration skills, but when it comes to actually passing the basketball, the two are very close, and I don't think you can definitively say that Lebron is better. When push comes to shove, Larry is probably a top five passer ever.

Bird is definitively better.

[RaininTwos]

I honestly don't know. Passing is one those skills that really cannot be compared that well when it's this close. I don't understand why people pretend there is such a huge gap between them though, it's clear Lebron is a great passer.

[pauk]

I don't think people are neccesarily saying that Larry would make a better point guard when they refer to him as the better passer. There referring to the actual act of passing the ball in and of itself, and Larry definately has an argument for being better in that department. Lebron would make a better pg than Larry because of his superior ball-handling and penetration skills, but when it comes to actually passing the basketball, the two are very close, and I don't think you can definitively say that Lebron is better. When push comes to shove, Larry is probably a top five passer ever.

Not sure what a 13 game sample of LBJ playing PG has to do with who the better passer is.
LBJ is a better PG because of his ball handling, speed, muscle, athleticism, and the fact he has specifically played full time point guard. Bird was arguably the better/more creative passer.

I have over 100 games with Larry Bird on vhs/dvd/xvid/mpeg/divx and what not and seen maybe more, but i have seen just as many and probably more of Lebron games, i can tell you right now personally two things which is absolutely 100% sure in my mind...

1. Lebron & Larry were the best passing non-PGs i ever seen, not even close.

2. In terms of passing creativity alone its very close, but to say Bird was better at that is wrong, especially when considering Lebron was able to factually do more of that due to what his overall pointguard skills allowed him to, it allowed/allows Lebron to utilize his passing ability to a bigger extent as Larry Bird didnt have those pointguard skills, it presented even more unique passing angles and creative passes. Now you maybe understand what it has to do with who the better passer is... With my own eyes, I have seen a couple of passes Bird couldnt make which Lebron could (i can show you if you wish) and i have seen none of Birds which Lebron couldnt duplicate.

..and oh, Larry Bird is definitely on my top 5/top10 in terms of passing creativity alone, but guess what, so is Lebron.

[Money 23]

I honestly don't know. Passing is one those skills that really cannot be compared that well when it's this close. I don't understand why people pretend there is such a huge gap between them though, it's clear Lebron is a great passer.

The only one insinuating there is a gap is the thread creator.

No one is saing LeBron ISN'T a great passer. Why aren't you critiquing pauk?

And why do you stay hating past generation of players you unfortunately didn't get to watch in context?

[DatAsh]

Bird is definitively better.

I'm inclined to agree, but I was trying to stay objective and somewhat reasonable.

[Freedom Kid7]

Pauk, don't use stats to use your point. That's not fair or logical. LeBron's numbers will decrease once his peak ends, and with the way he's played throughout the playoffs and the year I don't know if his passing skills will be utilized like they were in Cleveland.

Also, if you do want to go off numbers, Peak Bird had a better AST/TO ratio in his peak than Peak LeBron did (I'm counting both '09 and '12), and had a better AST/TO for all his playoff games than LeBron did.

I'm not gonna discredit LeBron though. He is a good passer for a guy like him, but Bird was a better passer overall.