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Old 10-06-2012, 02:16 AM   #1
fpliii
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Default Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

So I've been thinking recently about the best way to describe the non-quantifiable parts of a players game, and was just playing around in R (statistical software suite) with decision trees working with some categorical stats. I got the idea after playing around with some libraries that we could attempt to classify players by certain 'skills' they possess. Now this might not sound like anything purposeful or exciting, but hear me out.

If you want to completely describe a player's game, which skills would you have to mention? With enough collaboration, if we reach a consensus list, we could deduce a minimal skill profile (which I've dubbed as a player's 'MinSkE' in the title). For example, say three people discuss Kobe, and have the following lists:

A: clutch shooting, durability, ball handling, volume scoring
B: volume scoring, leadership, durability
C: leadership, clutch shooting, volume scoring, shut down perimeter man defender, durability

in this case, Kobe's MinSkE would be: volume scoring, durability since all three appear on each list (note: this isn't my belief, these are just examples). Now in general the skills won't appear on every list, since there will be a much larger sample of contributors than three guys. Note that they also don't have to be positive, there can be flaws as well...remember, the objective is to completely describe a player's game using as few skills/flaws as possible.

This might be a useful way to describe the non-quantifiable aspects of a guy's game, so in order to store the data, I'm going to create a spreadsheet after we have some input. Feel free to start with any players you want.
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:27 AM   #2
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpliii
So I've been thinking recently about the best way to describe the non-quantifiable parts of a players game, and was just playing around in R (statistical software suite) with decision trees working with some categorical stats. I got the idea after playing around with some libraries that we could attempt to classify players by certain 'skills' they possess. Now this might not sound like anything purposeful or exciting, but hear me out.

If you want to completely describe a player's game, which skills would you have to mention? With enough collaboration, if we reach a consensus list, we could deduce a minimal skill profile (which I've dubbed as a player's 'MinSkE' in the title). For example, say three people discuss Kobe, and have the following lists:

A: clutch shooting, durability, ball handling, volume scoring
B: volume scoring, leadership, durability
C: leadership, clutch shooting, volume scoring, shut down perimeter man defender, durability

in this case, Kobe's MinSkE would be: volume scoring, durability since all three appear on each list (note: this isn't my belief, these are just examples). Now in general the skills won't appear on every list, since there will be a much larger sample of contributors than three guys. Note that they also don't have to be positive, there can be flaws as well...remember, the objective is to completely describe a player's game using as few skills/flaws as possible.

This might be a useful way to describe the non-quantifiable aspects of a guy's game, so in order to store the data, I'm going to create a spreadsheet after we have some input. Feel free to start with any players you want.


With all the agendas running rampant on this site I would imagine that the MinSkE for the more polarizing players will wind up uncharacteristically small or even empty.

Is the ultimate goal to simply assign players a list of non-quantifiable abilities, or to actually go about trying to measure those abilities in a quantifiable manner?
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:34 AM   #3
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DatAsh
With all the agendas running rampant on this site I would imagine that the MinSkE for the more polarizing players will wind up uncharacteristically small or even empty.

Is the ultimate goal to simply assign players a list of non-quantifiable abilities, or to actually go about trying to measure those abilities in a quantifiable manner?

The former...I have no interest in comparing players against one another, just in describing players themselves as well as possible. Once we have enough data (if this gets off the ground) it would be interesting to look at individuals with similar MinSkEs and think about whether they actually played similarly (but this would be down the line a bit).

EDIT: Agendas could be an issue, but I think we'll be able to parse out the gold from rubbish since the lists should be well-organized.
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Old 10-06-2012, 04:04 AM   #4
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Sounds good.

You may want to have a preliminary brainstorming session to generate a tangible list of "intangibles" that we could then choose from - and still add to if need be - so as to avoid duplicates, or have some process for combining and or removing similar abilities or meaningless abilities .

EDIT: I guess meaningless abilities would tend to get weeded out by the method you're using to get the MinSkE

Last edited by DatAsh : 10-06-2012 at 04:15 AM.
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Old 10-06-2012, 04:13 AM   #5
fpliii
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DatAsh
Sounds good.

You may want to have a preliminary brainstorming session to generate a tangible list of "intangibles" that we could then choose from - and still add to if need be - so as to avoid duplicates, or have some process for combining and or removing similar abilities or meaningless abilities .

I concur. It's actually quite late here though, so I'll have to leave this until tomorrow. Hopefully a couple of other people are interested so we can get the ball rolling.
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Old 10-06-2012, 04:50 AM   #6
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Right, so can you do this on the following players? :


Kevin Martin
Zach Randolph
Dwyane Wade
Kevin Garnett
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:16 PM   #7
fpliii
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Default Re: Minimum Skill Enumeration ('MinSkE')?

Well, I don't want to throw my bias in here, so here are what might be typical lists for the guys you mentioned (some things more so popular perception than based on reality):

Quote:
Originally Posted by kNIOKAS
Right, so can you do this on the following players? :


Kevin Martin - efficient scorer, subpar defender, good quickness, off ball prowess
Zach Randolph - low post scorer, exceptional strength, boxing out, soft touch, plays bigger than his size, rises for the playoffs
Dwyane Wade - reckless abandon, efficient scorer, defensive gambler, pump faker, slasher, great first step, ball handler, great athleticism, injury prone, great shot blocker
Kevin Garnett - defensive anchor, big man passer, screen setter, defensive versatility, mid range shooter, man post defender, high IQ

some people are going to have shorter lists for some guys, others might have longer lists for the same players. Some people might add qualifiers (i.e. subpar, great, etc.) while others might avoid those descriptors. A given trait doesn't have to appear on ALL posters' lists, just frequently enough as dictated by the number of posts in which he appears (as the sample size goes up, the required percentage goes down) to be part of his MinSkE profile.
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