Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > Off the Court Lounge

Off the Court Lounge Basketball fans talk about everything EXCEPT basketball here

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-03-2012, 11:27 PM   #1
Anti Hero
Be your own hero
 
Anti Hero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 7,889
Anti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableAnti Hero is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default No More Homework!

French President Proposes Banning Homework



Quote:
Talk about courting the youth vote. French President François Hollande has proposed banning homework as part of a series of policies designed to reform the French educational system.
“Education is priority,” Hollande said in a speech at Paris’s Sorbonne University. “An education program is, by definition, a societal program. Work should be done at school, rather than at home.”
The justification for this proposed ban? Inequality. According to a statement from an official at the French Embassy, “When it comes to homework, the President said it should be done during school hours rather than at home, in order to establish equal opportunities.” Homework favors the wealthy, Hollande argues, because they are more likely to have a good working environment at home, including parents with the time and energy to help them with their work.
Hollande’s education proposal is not limited to a homework ban. According to the embassy, Hollande has also pledged to add 60,000 teaching jobs in the next five years. He has also expressed support for extending the school week by establishing a model in which children would attend school for nine half days a week. Schools would be able to decide if this is spread over four, five or even six days, in consultation with local authorities and parents.
French children typically go to school for 36 weeks out of the year. The school day is roughly as long as an American workday, lasting from 8:00 to 4:00 or later. However, in most schools the week is only four days, with Wednesdays off in addition to Saturday and Sunday.
Hollande’s proposals are not official yet; they’re part of an ongoing national debate about reforming the education system, which is, according to the 2009 Program for International Student Assessment, ranked 21st in reading, 22nd in math and 27th in science among countries in the OECD (Organisation for Economic Development and Co-operation). The United States ranks 17th, 31st, and 23rd in those respective categories.

France
Anti Hero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2012, 11:49 PM   #2
flipogb
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,997
flipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

wish I was a 2yr old living in France right now
flipogb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 12:20 AM   #3
Rake2204
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,095
Rake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: No More Homework!

As a young teacher, I think it's a great idea. Well, let me take that back, I think there's merit to the idea of eliminating a very, very significant amount of the homework traditionally given to pre-college students. I think there's a time and place for doing work from home, I just don't think it should be anywhere close to being as often as it is now in the United States.

To me, it seems illogical to reduce elementary recess time, lengthen the school day so students begin their trek around 6:30 and likely don't arrive home until near 4pm, throw on additional homework that may often take an hour or more of time, then wonder why youngsters these days are so fat and depressed. I personally believe "preparing" students for the next level or their education (or future job) by merely giving them a lot of work to do at home, is vastly overrated and flawed. What I think will prepare people for doing work from home when they get a job? Doing work from home when they get a job.

One of the most refreshing things I've read thus far in this young week was a piece on the Finnish school system, which is apparently thriving. Again, to be clear, I don't necessarily think everything they do is perfect, but have a look for yourself to see how they differ from us (Americans):

Quote:
A new global league table, produced by the Economist Intelligence Unit for Pearson, has found Finland to be the best education system in the world.

The rankings combined international test results and data such as graduation rates between 2006 and 2010, the BBC reports.

For Finland, this is no fluke. Since it implemented huge education reforms 40 years ago, the country's school system has consistently come at the top for the international rankings for education systems.

But how do they do it?

It's simple — by going against the evaluation-driven, centralized model that much of the Western world uses.

Finnish children don't start school until they are 7.

They rarely take exams or do homework until they are well into their teens.
The children are not measured at all for the first six years of their education.
There is only one mandatory standardized test in Finland, taken when children are 16.
All children, clever or not, are taught in the same classrooms.
Finland spends around 30 percent less per student than the United States.
30 percent of children receive extra help during their first nine years of school.

66 percent of students go to college. - The highest rate in Europe.
The difference between weakest and strongest students is the smallest in the World.
Science classes are capped at 16 students so that they may perform practical experiments every class.
93 percent of Finns graduate from high school, 17.5 percent higher than the US.
43 percent of Finnish high-school students go to vocational schools.
Elementary school students get 75 minutes of recess a day in Finnish versus an average of 27 minutes in the US.

Teachers only spend 4 hours a day in the classroom, and take 2 hours a week for "professional development".

Finland has the same amount of teachers as New York City, but far fewer students. 600,000 students compared to 1.1 million in NYC.
The school system is 100% state funded.

All teachers in Finland must have a masters degree, which is fully subsidized.

The national curriculum is only broad guidelines.
Teachers are selected from the top 10% of graduates while In the US and other nations a teacher can become someone who barely passed their subjects.
In 2010, 6,600 applicants vied for 660 primary school training slots
The average starting salary for a Finnish teacher was $29,000 in 2008 Compared with $36,000 in the United States.

However, high school teachers with 15 years of experience make 102 percent of what other college graduates make. In the US, this figure is 62%.

There is no merit pay for teachers.
Teachers are given the same status as doctors and lawyers and are highly paid and respected.

In an international standardized measurement in 2001, Finnish children came top or very close to the top for science, reading and mathematics. It's consistently come top or very near every time since.

And despite the differences between Finland and the US, it easily beats countries with a similar demographic.

Neighbor Norway, of a similar size and featuring a similar homogeneous culture, follows the same same strategies as the USA and achieves similar low rankings in international studies.
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/22311/53/
Rake2204 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 12:22 AM   #4
miller-time
NBA sixth man of the year
 
miller-time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 7,992
miller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by flipogb
wish I was a 2yr old living in France right now

i know. chicks dig that accent.
miller-time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:42 AM   #5
NotYetGreat
Great college starter
 
NotYetGreat's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,546
NotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputation
Default Re: No More Homework!

This has been done in one school here and the ones running it were awarded for the exemplary model they laid out. We discussed it in our Educational Tech. Class before and the class was split in half with regards to this. Personally, I think this is ingenious, although I do think there are times where homework is necessary. Still, more often than not it does tend to discourage self-learning rather than support it (as ironic as it sounds). Well, maybe not so much habits, but attitudes towards discovering things for one's self, and honestly I think these attitudes are the most important things we can impart as educators to these kids.

Last edited by NotYetGreat : 12-04-2012 at 02:44 AM.
NotYetGreat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:18 AM   #6
flipogb
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,997
flipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected posterflipogb is a pretty well-respected poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

The only homework I feel is good for kids are group projects, teaches them how to work with others and manage their time
flipogb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:26 AM   #7
Killbot
KillImpaleLiquefyLynch
 
Killbot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bombing Organisms Timelessly
Posts: 18,929
Killbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKillbot is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: No More Homework!

This could potentially help, since some students don't do homework at all and don't really learn anything.

Plus, students can get more sleep, which is essential to both a healthy lifestyle and a functional brain.
Students might also have quicker access to help by doing the work in school instead of being put off by the difficulty of the assignment at home.
Killbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:30 AM   #8
miller-time
NBA sixth man of the year
 
miller-time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 7,992
miller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postermiller-time is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by flipogb
The only homework I feel is good for kids are group projects, teaches them how to work with others and manage their time

agreed. it is also excellent for just making friends that you wouldn't normally associate with. hell i still make new friends at university when i do group projects lol.

i think homework or assignments is important later on however, otherwise the step up to doing assignments at uni would be massive. assignments do teach you things like time management and self discipline too.
miller-time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:34 AM   #9
shlver
코비=GOAT
 
shlver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,121
shlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

Good luck being in the habit of doing no homework in high school and hitting college with subjects like calc and orgo.
shlver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 04:18 AM   #10
NotYetGreat
Great college starter
 
NotYetGreat's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,546
NotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputationNotYetGreat has a terrific reputation
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by miller-time
agreed. it is also excellent for just making friends that you wouldn't normally associate with. hell i still make new friends at university when i do group projects lol.

i think homework or assignments is important later on however, otherwise the step up to doing assignments at uni would be massive. assignments do teach you things like time management and self discipline too
.

Like Jay-Z said in On To The Next One (don't stone me for liking that song) - "It's all about progression."

It's true, being used to having no workload outside of school is gonna be a pretty big hole to fill once you get to college/university, and while it may that big of a problem attitude-wise, getting used to all the tasks is gonna be a little bit of a bitch.

The things I see here though is that people are going with the extremely outdated "More is better" approach. When I'm finally in the classroom, sure if they need some extra work outside my class, alright (although I'd prefer it to be more of "consultation" style and not through a huge volume of homework), but the only thing I'd make sure my homework is "more" in is meaning.
NotYetGreat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 04:36 AM   #11
kNIOKAS
Medium Rare
 
kNIOKAS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,160
kNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekNIOKAS is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: No More Homework!

Me love France because they experiment shit on their own asses.
kNIOKAS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 10:18 AM   #12
ripthekik
GIVEN NOT EARNED
 
ripthekik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,360
ripthekik has an OK reputation so far
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shlver
Good luck being in the habit of doing no homework in high school and hitting college with subjects like calc and orgo.

this, end of discussion.
ripthekik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 10:39 AM   #13
Rake2204
7-time NBA All-Star
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 12,095
Rake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableRake2204 is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shlver
Good luck being in the habit of doing no homework in high school and hitting college with subjects like calc and orgo.
As I alluded to earlier in this thread, I'm not entirely convinced every last bit of homework should be eliminated in the K-12 levels of work, but I think a very, very significant portion of it could be eliminated without negative repercussion.

I wonder what the true correlation between having homework since kindergarten (as is the case now) and its effectiveness in preparation for, as you say, college calc. and orgo. classes. Again, my feeling is the idea of "prepping for future homework by giving homework now" is a little off base. For instance, I think someone who excels in high school science classes that give no homework would be just as prepared (if not more so) for a college organic chemistry class than another student who didn't do quite as well but had homework in his high school science classes every night.

Spending extra time on something isn't exactly brain surgery. I really do not believe students need to prep for spending time on a class outside of class by practicing it for 10 to 12 years in advance.
Rake2204 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 12:03 PM   #14
Mr. I'm So Rad
So What If It Is
 
Mr. I'm So Rad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Edge of Despair
Posts: 11,789
Mr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableMr. I'm So Rad is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: No More Homework!

One of the problems with the American education system is that kids are taught a lot of shit that will quite frankly have no relevance in their real world once they leave school. I think we should have more specialized and narrow teaching. The only things you should be required to learn thoroughly are Algebra and English (Grammar/Spelling/Vocabulary). Everything else should be elective. Like why should a kid who's a great artist have to learn about some planet light years away that may have water on it? Who gives a f*ck?

Also, school doesn't teach kids to be creative or how to apply the knowledge you gain. It just teaches them how to be a drone to go and work in someone's office or store.
Mr. I'm So Rad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:07 PM   #15
shlver
코비=GOAT
 
shlver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,121
shlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops postershlver is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: No More Homework!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rake2204
As I alluded to earlier in this thread, I'm not entirely convinced every last bit of homework should be eliminated in the K-12 levels of work, but I think a very, very significant portion of it could be eliminated without negative repercussion.
I don't think a "signficant portion" should be eliminated, but reformed so it isn't just busy work. Repetition even if tedious is important for learning.

Quote:
I wonder what the true correlation between having homework since kindergarten (as is the case now) and its effectiveness in preparation for, as you say, college calc. and orgo. classes. Again, my feeling is the idea of "prepping for future homework by giving homework now" is a little off base. For instance, I think someone who excels in high school science classes that give no homework would be just as prepared (if not more so) for a college organic chemistry class than another student who didn't do quite as well but had homework in his high school science classes every night.
That's just useless inference. Repetition of taught material is fundamental to learning and understanding.
Quote:
Spending extra time on something isn't exactly brain surgery. I really do not believe students need to prep for spending time on a class outside of class by practicing it for 10 to 12 years in advance.
Habits are hard to break(especially habits that last for a decade), and new habits are hard to produce. Elimination of homework is irresponsible. Looking at the exceptions of motivated students that may be able to produce good study habits to justify the elimination of a fundamental and elementary aspect of education is misguided.
shlver is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:48 PM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy