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Old 12-06-2012, 08:49 PM   #16
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:50 PM   #17
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Does anyone know the reason behind sitting Wade/James to start the 2nd?
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:57 PM   #18
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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isn't the ballon d'or sorta bullshit, much like the nba mvp? it's voted on by journalists, and only europeans were eligible until the 90s, so maradona and pele could never win. and championships are just as important in basketball as mvp awards, probably more important, so ballon d'or/mvp comparison don't really tell you anything

It is awarded based on votes by coaches and captains of international teams, as well as journalists
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:59 PM   #19
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by Hoiids
Messi is more to soccer than Kobe is to basketball.
Kobe only has 1 MVP, while Messi is about to get his 4th Ballon d'Or, which will be most of any one all time, and is only 25.

Yeah because winning the Ballon d'Or is really indicative of a player's worth. Look back at 2010 and tell me Messi deserved the award over Wesley Sneijder.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:01 PM   #20
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by kurt_rambis
isn't the ballon d'or sorta bullshit, much like the nba mvp? it's voted on by journalists, and only europeans were eligible until the 90s, so maradona and pele could never win. and championships are just as important in basketball as mvp awards, probably more important, so ballon d'or/mvp comparison don't really tell you anything

Christiano Ronaldo will win Ballon d'Or this year. Book it. He deserves it, too, considering Messi didn't show up in the 3 most important games of the entire last season - No goals vs Chelsea, Real Madrid and then Chelsea again, back to back to back. That killed his chances for me. Messi may well be the greatest footballer in history, but Ronaldo is awfully close. We are lucky to be watching them compete against one another multiple times a season.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:04 PM   #21
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by c3z4r
Yeah because winning the Ballon d'Or is really indicative of a player's worth. Look back at 2010 and tell me Messi deserved the award over Wesley Sneijder.


I can see a strong case for Sneidjer leading to the finals of the world cup and being MOTM for pretty much every game, but individually, Messi was still more talented overall. In my opinion at least.
Voters aren't always right, but I tend to agree with them most of the time
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:05 PM   #22
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by c3z4r
Yeah because winning the Ballon d'Or is really indicative of a player's worth. Look back at 2010 and tell me Messi deserved the award over Wesley Sneijder.

Messi was the best player in the world in 2010 (Which is what the Ballon d'Or is supposed to reward, not who the best player on the best team is), and it wasn't remotely close. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a muppet.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:07 PM   #23
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by oolalaa
Christiano Ronaldo will win Ballon d'Or this year. Book it. He deserves it, too, considering Messi didn't show up in the 3 most important games of the entire last season - No goals vs Chelsea, Real Madrid and then Chelsea again, back to back to back. That killed his chances for me. Messi may well be the greatest footballer in history, but Ronaldo is awfully close. We are lucky to be watching them compete against one another multiple times a season.


Who is this Christiano Ronaldo you speak of?

And he, Cristiano Ronaldo missed a PK in the Euroleage semi's against spain if I remember correctly
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:08 PM   #24
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by Hoiids
Who is this Christiano Ronaldo you speak of?

*Cristiano.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:12 PM   #25
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by Hoiids
I can see a strong case for Sneidjer leading to the finals of the world cup and being MOTM for pretty much every game, but individually, Messi was still more talented overall. In my opinion at least.
Voters aren't always right, but I tend to agree with them most of the time

No one is disputing who is more talented, I mean if that was the case, then Ronaldo should have won every year for how insanely talented he was back in the day. The Ballon d'Or should reward the most accomplished player in a season, which is exactly what Sneijder did leading Inter to UCL cup and Holland to WC final. No one is disputing the fact that Messi is a notch above Sneijder in talent, but having him win the award in 2010 was absolutely shameful.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:14 PM   #26
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by oolalaa
Messi was the best player in the world in 2010 (Which is what the Ballon d'Or is supposed to reward, not who the best player on the best team is), and it wasn't remotely close. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a muppet.

How do you determine who the best player was if that player is unable to win any major trophies except domestic cups. Inter won UCL and Holland reached WC final and guess what, both these teams had one common factor : Wesley Sneijder.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:15 PM   #27
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by Hoiids
Who is this Christiano Ronaldo you speak of?

And he, Cristiano Ronaldo missed a PK in the Euroleage semi's against spain if I remember correctly

In a penalty shootout, in an international tournament (Pales in comparison to the CL). Messi's PK miss against Chelsea in the 2nd leg of the the champions league semi was FAAAAAR worse. They only needed to win 1-0. He choked.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:35 PM   #28
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

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Originally Posted by c3z4r
No one is disputing who is more talented, I mean if that was the case, then Ronaldo should have won every year for how insanely talented he was back in the day.

What are you talking about?? Ronaldo's breakout season was 06/07. Unfortunately, Kaka was even better than Ronaldo that year. He completely shredded my beloved Man U in the 1st leg of the CL semi final. Terrifying to watch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6X98F60zXc). He undoubetdly deserved ballon do'r.

07/08 Ronaldo was the best player in the world by miles. You remember his FK against Portsmouth that left David James rooted to the floor with a "WTF just happened?" look on his face? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WmpgeY7tow) I was behind the goal in old trafford. Best FK I've ever seen in person, and I've seen a lot.

08/09 was a down year. he had ankle surgery in the offseason, missed the first 2 months. Was also pining for a move to Madrid and ended up sulking a little throughout. Still, he produced 2 unbelivable goals - 1. Porto from about 40 yards out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWnGmBJV4xA) and 2. A FK that might have been even better than the one vs Portsmouth against arsenal in the CL semis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuHmNNTI118). Messi's breakout year. Thoroughly deserved it.

09/10 Struggled with niggling injuries. Messi is reaching godlike status. Sneijder is merely a great playmaker who just about everyone on the planet considered worse than xavi.

10/11 Certainly has a case, but Messi scored the big goals in the big games against madrid (And others).

Quote:
The Ballon d'Or should reward the most accomplished player in a season

WRONG.

Quote:
which is exactly what Sneijder did leading Inter to UCL cup and Holland to WC final. No one is disputing the fact that Messi is a notch above Sneijder in talent, but having him win the award in 2010 was absolutely shameful.

Individual players in football have a far smaller impact than NBA players on the results of games. Barca were a little disjointed all season thanks to the ibra signing - he really didnt fit in. Inter were the better team. Much better defensively and they had a genius of a coach. And the same could be said of Argentina/Holland in the world cup. Holland were much stronger/cohesive/better coached.

Last edited by oolalaa : 12-06-2012 at 09:45 PM.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:12 PM   #29
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Default Re: Kobe and Messi Turkish Airlines commercial

Quote:
Originally Posted by oolalaa
What are you talking about?? Ronaldo's breakout season was 06/07. Unfortunately, Kaka was even better than Ronaldo that year. He completely shredded my beloved Man U in the 1st leg of the CL semi final. Terrifying to watch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6X98F60zXc). He undoubetdly deserved ballon do'r.

07/08 Ronaldo was the best player in the world by miles. You remember his FK against Portsmouth that left David James rooted to the floor with a "WTF just happened?" look on his face? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WmpgeY7tow) I was behind the goal in old trafford. Best FK I've ever seen in person, and I've seen a lot.

08/09 was a down year. he had ankle surgery in the offseason, missed the first 2 months. Was also pining for a move to Madrid and ended up sulking a little throughout. Still, he produced 2 unbelivable goals - 1. Porto from about 40 yards out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWnGmBJV4xA) and 2. A FK that might have been even better than the one vs Portsmouth against arsenal in the CL semis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuHmNNTI118). Messi's breakout year. Thoroughly deserved it.

09/10 Struggled with niggling injuries. Messi is reaching godlike status. Sneijder is merely a great playmaker who just about everyone on the planet considered worse than xavi.

10/11 Certainly has a case, but Messi scored the big goals in the big games against madrid (And others).



WRONG.



Individual players in football have a far smaller impact than NBA players on the results of games. Barca were a little disjointed all season thanks to the ibra signing - he really didnt fit in. Inter were the better team. Much better defensively and they had a genius of a coach. And the same could be said of Argentina/Holland in the world cup. Holland were much stronger/cohesive/better coached.

Was talking about Ronaldo Luís Nazário de Lima, you know the original Ronaldo and pretty much the one identified as Ronaldo and not as C.Ronaldo.The Ronaldo that was destroying professional European teams at age 18 and selected to the Brazil national team at age 17.The one that was supposed to go down as the greatest player ever; the youngest Ballon d'Or winner when the award was still considered legit. Anyways, I think you get the idea.

What made messi better than wesley sneijder in 2009-2010 on an individual level then? Statistics show that they were at best equal with the clear advantage going to Sneijder.

Let's compare them, shall we?

In UCL: Messi had 8 goals, 1 assist....Sneijder 6 assists and 3 goals. Both contributed equally to their team's success, although i would consider Sneijder to have more duties and be more important to that Inter squad, but maybe that's just me.

In WC tournament: Sneijder was named Man of the Match for 4 of Netherlands' 7 games. Messi was only once named Man of the Match in Argentina's 5 games. Sneijder scored 5 goals(tied for most in the tournament) and 1 assist, while Messi had 1 assist and 0 goals.

I mean the only competition where Messi was clearly superior to Sneijder was in Spain's La Liga, where he scored 34 goals and 10 assists in 36 matches, while Wesley in Seria A (a much defensive minded league with slower pace than La Liga) had 8 goals and 4 assist in 25 matches.

Now, if the Ballon d'Or was awarded for the best player in his domestic league, then I guess Messi totally deserves it then.

Last edited by c3z4r : 12-06-2012 at 10:15 PM.
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