Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > Off the Court Lounge

Off the Court Lounge Basketball fans talk about everything EXCEPT basketball here

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 01-12-2013, 01:12 PM   #16
MMM
877-954-1893
 
MMM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 8,275
MMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

But I thought that you needed guns to keep you free from tyrannical governments......


I do find it interesting that America continues to lag behind in these ranking nowadays. Just the other day I was reading how the US is no longer considered the country with the greatest economic freedom as well. Class movement has become far more restricted in America over the last few decades.
MMM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 01:56 PM   #17
KevinNYC
Toronto Mayor Rob Ford
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,596
KevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brantonli
We basically run ourselves. Beijing does have a certain amount of influence in HK politics (the Chief Executive must be allowed by Beijing), but because politics tend to be fairly separate from the economics our economy is very free. Plus because we don't have universal suffrage, a lot of people's opinions are expressed in protests and town hall debates, which probably contributed to the freedom of expression bit of the survey.

oh and about healthcare in HK. There are sufficient low cost government medical facilities alongside private carers, but recently there have been problems of hospitals filled with Mainland Chinese mothers coming to HK to give birth.


You don't have universal sufferage, but these folks consider you among the freest? How does sufferage work in HK.

Also the land of two rings is Houston?
KevinNYC is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:06 PM   #18
LJJ
Extra Cheese
 
LJJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 15,002
LJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinNYC
I suspect it is because the bottom 10 all are more violent than north korea. I also suspect the rights of women are probably greater than in some of those countries. Here's what they considered.
http://www.fraserinstitute.org/resea....aspx?id=19171

Actually, North Korea isn't listed at all because of the extremely limited availability of objective information of any kind.

It's pretty safe to assume they would be at the very bottom though.
LJJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:09 PM   #19
kaiteng
CONGRATS MAN XD
 
kaiteng's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BMO Field
Posts: 18,660
kaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablekaiteng is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

So China seems to be happy to let Hong Kong being what it has been, and sucks some money out of it.
kaiteng is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:13 PM   #20
Bano114
Lets go Kni....Giants!
 
Bano114's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: MetLife Stadium
Posts: 3,571
Bano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brantonli
We basically run ourselves. Beijing does have a certain amount of influence in HK politics (the Chief Executive must be allowed by Beijing), but because politics tend to be fairly separate from the economics our economy is very free. Plus because we don't have universal suffrage, a lot of people's opinions are expressed in protests and town hall debates, which probably contributed to the freedom of expression bit of the survey.

oh and about healthcare in HK. There are sufficient low cost government medical facilities alongside private carers, but recently there have been problems of hospitals filled with Mainland Chinese mothers coming to HK to give birth.

Thats strange. How do other cities operate? I would think leaders of other cities in the country would push for the same kind of freedom?
Bano114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:16 PM   #21
bagelred
Weird
 
bagelred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 29,097
bagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginablebagelred is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

I'm actually stunned U.S. is 7th. I thought we were around 15th or so.....
bagelred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:23 PM   #22
JEFFERSON MONEY
A bit crazy
 
JEFFERSON MONEY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Pond near u
Posts: 8,476
JEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableJEFFERSON MONEY is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

lol like i care about what some jackazz biased canuck has to say while incorporating something like security in an abstract concept such as freedom.

MURICA NOW AND FOREVER.

we can dress like emos, we can order pizzas whenever we want we can ride motorsickles we can whine to big retail and they'll refund us back we can go out to a piss poor ghetto and walk to a rich az jework swuburb after.

I FUKKIN LOVE THE PLACE I LIVE IN. GOD BLESS AMERICA. Home of the brave land of the free. AND I WILL NOT LET TRAITORS LIKE KEVIN OR THE DUTCH RAIN ON M PARADE.

FUKK YEAH!

but to be fair hk and nz are awesome.

Last edited by JEFFERSON MONEY : 01-12-2013 at 02:25 PM.
JEFFERSON MONEY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:30 PM   #23
MMM
877-954-1893
 
MMM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 8,275
MMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bagelred
I'm actually stunned U.S. is 7th. I thought we were around 15th or so.....

I wonder how high America was in these type of ratings about a decade ago. Seems like we have given up a lot of liberty for a little security. Since then we have seen a surveillance state set up and where due process of American can be suspended if they are deemed a threat to national security.
MMM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:43 PM   #24
Bano114
Lets go Kni....Giants!
 
Bano114's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: MetLife Stadium
Posts: 3,571
Bano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMM
I wonder how high America was in these type of ratings about a decade ago. Seems like we have given up a lot of liberty for a little security. Since then we have seen a surveillance state set up and where due process of American can be suspended if they are deemed a threat to national security.
Today 02:23 PM

People seem more concerned about the abuse of power than the abuse of freedom. Both can be dangerous and a balance should be found between freedoms to the people and power of the government to limit the abuses of both.

I'd give up my second amendment right if it meant people would not be able to take advantage of this freedom and use fire arms to harm innocent people.

The only problem is, I'm not sure if that would solve the problem. I'm torn on gun control but I was just using that as an example.

EDIT: Thinking back I probably went a little to far with that statement. To clarify, I believe the right to bear arms should be held by American Citizens, but I would gladly have stricter regulation on owning guns to promote safety.

Last edited by Bano114 : 01-12-2013 at 02:47 PM.
Bano114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 02:56 PM   #25
MMM
877-954-1893
 
MMM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 8,275
MMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation hereMMM has a near all-star reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bano114
People seem more concerned about the abuse of power than the abuse of freedom. Both can be dangerous and a balance should be found between freedoms to the people and power of the government to limit the abuses of both.

I'd give up my second amendment right if it meant people would not be able to take advantage of this freedom and use fire arms to harm innocent people.

The only problem is, I'm not sure if that would solve the problem. I'm torn on gun control but I was just using that as an example.

EDIT: Thinking back I probably went a little to far with that statement. To clarify, I believe the right to bear arms should be held by American Citizens, but I would gladly have stricter regulation on owning guns to promote safety.

The problem in America is not the 2nd amendment, it is the unhealthy gun culture. The broad interpretation my some of the 2nd amendment doesn't help but overall that both sides can find common ground instead of inflaming the other side. I personally think that some common ground can be found in areas like mental illness, registrations, and stricter regulations. However, the devil would be in the details in such discussions.
MMM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 03:09 PM   #26
Bano114
Lets go Kni....Giants!
 
Bano114's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: MetLife Stadium
Posts: 3,571
Bano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation hereBano114 has an incredible reputation here
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MMM
The problem in America is not the 2nd amendment, it is the unhealthy gun culture. The broad interpretation my some of the 2nd amendment doesn't help but overall that both sides can find common ground instead of inflaming the other side. I personally think that some common ground can be found in areas like mental illness, registrations, and stricter regulations. However, the devil would be in the details in such discussions.

Agreed. I brought up gun control because the gun culture in our country is a shining example of those looking to prevent the abuse of freedoms in conflict with those in fear of the abuse of power.

In a country where many citizens do not trust the government, taking away the right to guns is tough to make popular. The whole reason for this amendment was due to the fact that nobody knew for sure how the new government would play out. When the government was formed people feared that they would abuse their power and they should be armed to protect themselves from tyranny.

Living with the freedom of having guns is necessary because if we surrender this right we essentially surrender all power to the government. At the end of the day, the power resides with the side who holds the weapons. They are the ones who have the most influence over all others.

On the other hand making weapons available to citizens has provided numerous examples of the abuse of this freedom (Aurora, Sandy Hook, Columbine, VT) and it is clear more regulation is needed to prevent the weapons from falling in to irresponsible hands.

The balance needs to found between those 2 aspects in order for the problem to be worked out correctly, at least in my opinion.
Bano114 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 03:21 PM   #27
LJJ
Extra Cheese
 
LJJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 15,002
LJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bano114
Thats strange. How do other cities operate? I would think leaders of other cities in the country would push for the same kind of freedom?

Macau and Hong Kong are pretty unique situations, the political and legal issues involved are more than a little complicated.

If other cities in China sought that type of autonomy that would basically be secession, Hong Kong however already was completely separate from China.
The other cities in China are historically part of the country and the leaders of those cities are part of the state party. If they had such ideas contrary to party policy, they obviously wouldn't be high ranking CPC officials in the first place.
LJJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 08:33 PM   #28
KevinNYC
Toronto Mayor Rob Ford
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 8,596
KevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginableKevinNYC is the Michael Jordan of posters with the best reputation imaginable
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LJJ
Actually, North Korea isn't listed at all because of the extremely limited availability of objective information of any kind.

It's pretty safe to assume they would be at the very bottom though.


Does it say that about North Korea? Because I guess it would be hard to that data about Myanmar as well.
KevinNYC is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 07:30 AM   #29
brantonli
In Morey We Trust!
 
brantonli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: 13433 km from Land of 2 Rings
Posts: 6,615
brantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterbrantonli is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinNYC
You don't have universal sufferage, but these folks consider you among the freest? How does sufferage work in HK.

Also the land of two rings is Houston?


I tried to find how they calculate the index which ranked HK as 3rd, and found this:

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/01...that-possible/

Quote:
Q: Does democracy matter?
A: The type of government was not included as a category in the Fraser Institute’s Index of Human Freedom. “We’re measuring freedom, not democracy,” Mr. McMahon said, adding that democracy should not be confused with freedom. He said that even though democracies may be better able to support stable freedom over the long term, it does not equal freedom. Democracy is a power relationship while freedom means lack of constraints, Mr. Mahon said. “Iran in many ways has a democracy, but it would be silly to say that people in Iran, because they can vote are freer than people in Hong Kong,” he said.“This is not to say that democracy is not a good thing … that is certainly a good thing, but democracy on its own is not freedom.”


BTW the headline of the above article is pretty sensationalist but content is alright. And No we don't elect our Chief Executive, he is elected by a group of 1200 people from varying industries and politicians. We do vote for Legislative Coucil members (I tink the equivalent of MPs in UK or Congressmen in USA?) which then decide on laws.

The Hong Kong people are quite politically active, for example 10 years ago, the Council considered a security bill called Article 23, which was perceived to severely limit freedom in HK and would enact punishments for any acts of treason, insubordination against the chinese government. I remember that around 500,000 people (estimated of course) showed up in marches and protest against the proposal. This was out of a population of 7 million, so imagine if in the USA, 21 million people marched in protest against some bill in the Senate. So we still have plenty of freedom of expression in HK.

Since the index seems to weight economic freedom quite heavily, then I'm not surprised HK is very high up. You can set up a business here incredibly quickly and not much (if any) government red tape.


HK and Macau are the only cities allowed to be like this in China, all the rest are Chinese and run by the Communist Party. The agreement which allows Hong Kong to be its own Special Administrative Region is set to expire by 2047, so that's one date that I absolutely dread to be honest.
brantonli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 07:38 AM   #30
LJJ
Extra Cheese
 
LJJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 15,002
LJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops posterLJJ is considered a brilliant InsideHoops poster
Default Re: According to new study, New Zealand is "most free" country in the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinNYC
Does it say that about North Korea? Because I guess it would be hard to that data about Myanmar as well.

Yeah, you can read the full document here:

http://www.fraserinstitute.org/uploa...an-freedom.pdf

It doesn't say anything in particular about Burma other than the ratings.

North Korea is included in a footnote:
[North Korea Note that the sources clearly indicate that the government of North Korea is among the most repressive in the world with respect to religion as well as other civil liberties. But because North Korean society
is effectively closed to outsiders, the sources are unable to provide the kind of specific and timely information that the Pew Forum coded in this quantitative study. Therefore, the report does not include a score for North Korea.]
LJJ is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:20 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy