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Old 01-04-2013, 02:12 PM   #1
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Default GOAT defensive players?

Who you got? Is it LT followed by everyone else?

EDIT: Listening to the radio today, some names I've heard thrown out there (in addition to Lewis/LT):

Reggie White
Ronnie Lott
Rod Woodson
Mike Singletary
Deacon Jones
Ed Reed

Last edited by fpliii : 01-04-2013 at 02:51 PM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:17 PM   #2
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpliii
Who you got? Is it LT followed by everyone else?

I think LT is a bit overrated.

Not in the sense of how good he was, but how he is perceived vs. everyone else. There were others who were just as dominant, possibly even more like Reggie White.

Hell, I'd rank Ray Lewis' total career over LT's.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:28 PM   #3
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
I think LT is a bit overrated.

Not in the sense of how good he was, but how he is perceived vs. everyone else. There were others who were just as dominant, possibly even more like Reggie White.

Hell, I'd rank Ray Lewis' total career over LT's.

I'm not a big football guy (I watch every Jets game since I was indoctrinated as a fan lol...trying to follow the Colts too since Luck went to my school; I watch the playoffs and play fantasy, but don't feel like I have a great understanding/appreciation for the game). If I asked you for two top 5 lists:

Top 5 GOAT careers for defender
Top 5 GOAT impact for defender

how would they look (maybe not the OAT part, since I'm only interested in players post-merger)?
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:24 PM   #4
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

LT was amazing but yes, a little overrated...just a little though, he is probably still top-5 all time defender

Ware is bigger and faster than LT was, by a decent amount too...and Ware is on pace to have more sacks than LT did.

LT's rookie year they didn't record sacks but I know somewhere his rookie sack number exists and Ware will still beat it.




GOAT defensive player?...either Ray Lewis or White

Deion is top-5 all time too...his DMVP year maybe the most dominate ever by a CB, two rings on two different teams and it was him that put both teams over the top...I don't think SF or Dallas win in 94 or 95 without Deion
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:41 PM   #5
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
LT was amazing but yes, a little overrated...just a little though, he is probably still top-5 all time defender

Ware is bigger and faster than LT was, by a decent amount too...and Ware is on pace to have more sacks than LT did.

LT's rookie year they didn't record sacks but I know somewhere his rookie sack number exists and Ware will still beat it.




GOAT defensive player?...either Ray Lewis or White

Deion is top-5 all time too...his DMVP year maybe the most dominate ever by a CB, two rings on two different teams and it was him that put both teams over the top...I don't think SF or Dallas win in 94 or 95 without Deion

Ware doesn't have a fraction of the impact out there that LT did. Teams gameplanned specifically to block LT and keep LT away. Ware isn't even the dominant pass rusher in the league. I like Ware - please don't make me bash Ware by trying to compare Ware vs. LT.

Sacks aren't a good measure because teams pass much more now. If LT constantly faced teams that threw 50 times a game he'd have feasted. Strahan had 22 sacks. That tells you everything right there.

You are comparing Ware to one of the best defensive players of all time. I hope you are kidding.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:48 PM   #6
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

For me i like...
Reggie White
Lawrence Taylor
Ronnie Lott (i don't know if at his peak he was as good as some of the other people on this list but he was very good for very long. VERY good.)
Ray Lewis
Mike Singeltary
Rod Woodson
Ed Reed
Charles Haley
Deion Sanders

That jumps out at me right now. I'm sure i'll think of more. The thing that's different about these guys than a Ware (like PTiddy said), or a Polamalu (great as he is), or Revis or people like that is these were guys that when they were at their peak, the gameplan was "keep them from destroying the game". If LT wasn't blocked, your QB got hit every play and you couldn't function. Haley made every freaking tackle. We rave about Revis but Deion was much scarier because not only could he cover, he'd take the ball from you.

We should make a all time offense and defense. ISH ALL TIME TEAM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 03:56 PM   #7
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
Ware doesn't have a fraction of the impact out there that LT did. Teams gameplanned specifically to block LT and keep LT away. Ware isn't even the dominant pass rusher in the league. I like Ware - please don't make me bash Ware by trying to compare Ware vs. LT.

Sacks aren't a good measure because teams pass much more now. If LT constantly faced teams that threw 50 times a game he'd have feasted. Strahan had 22 sacks. That tells you everything right there.

You are comparing Ware to one of the best defensive players of all time. I hope you are kidding.
Ware has been the most dominate pass rusher for the past 6 or so years...he had a down year this year with only 11.5 sacks...injured

I watched LT, I am old enough to remember him completely...teams double Ware just like LT

I think Ware is a more dominate athlete in general...a stronger force...he will retire with better numbers than LT and he will be a first ballot HOFer
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:02 PM   #8
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Ware is just 22 sacks short of LT NOW...and he is only 30 years old

Ware is about 25 lbs bigger than LT was too...and runs a 4.65 at that size




fans might think the comparison is silly now...but once Ware retires people will start giving him props as one of the greatest pass rushers ever...maybe THE greatest pass rusher ever over White
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:05 PM   #9
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
Ware has been the most dominate pass rusher for the past 6 or so years...he had a down year this year with only 11.5 sacks...injured

I watched LT, I am old enough to remember him completely...teams double Ware just like LT

I think Ware is a more dominate athlete in general...a stronger force...he will retire with better numbers than LT and he will be a first ballot HOFer

Ware is not a player in LT's caliber, that's an absolutely ridiculous comparison. That's like me saying Strahan is better than Reggie White. It's total ridiculous homerism. Ware has never even been the dominant defensive player in the league. He's not an MVP level player. You're being ridiculous. Taylor redefined a position to the point that head coaches designed new ways of blocking in order to slow him down. You are comparing one of the greatest players of all time vs. a dominant pass rusher.

I'm disappointed in you. This is ridiculous even for you.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:09 PM   #10
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
Ware is just 22 sacks short of LT NOW...and he is only 30 years old

Ware is about 25 lbs bigger than LT was too...and runs a 4.65 at that size




fans might think the comparison is silly now...but once Ware retires people will start giving him props as one of the greatest pass rushers ever...maybe THE greatest pass rusher ever over White

LT had great impact beyond being a pass rusher. That you are comparing their resumes vs. how they did as pass rushers tells me you don't know Lawrence Taylor as a player. He was one of the best tacklers i ever saw. He chased plays down on the backside. He went side to side making tackles, Ray Lewis Style. he'd drop back in pass coverage and did that well.

Ware wasn't even as good a pass rusher as LT but i get that argument. All the other stuff is not even comparable.

Personally i think you are talking out of your ass and didn't see LT play except when you were young and he wasn't LT anymore. 84,85,86 LT played at a level that you'd need to be insane not to recognize.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:10 PM   #11
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

I assure you Ware will be a 1st ballot HOFer...it's not ridiculous at all

Look at numbers...look at highlights...Ware has ridiculous blind side sacks too...oh sacks aren't everything? okay then look at tackles, and forced fumbles...look at the whole picture if you want


there is no reason to think Ware isn't on the same level that LT was
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:11 PM   #12
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

niko I am 35, I have seen LT play LIVE in Texas Stadium

I remember mimicing him when I played...I used to yell "LT from the blind side" when tackling friends
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:11 PM   #13
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
I assure you Ware will be a 1st ballot HOFer...it's not ridiculous at all

Look at numbers...look at highlights...Ware has ridiculous blind side sacks too...oh sacks aren't everything? okay then look at tackles, and forced fumbles...look at the whole picture if you want


there is no reason to think Ware isn't on the same level that LT was
He wasn't. No one thinks so except you. Ware was never the dominant player LT was. There never was a time as a giant fan i thought OMG WARE IS COMING.

You can argue this by yourself, you are being a homer and im honestly dissapointed in you. Ware isn't in the top ten level pantheon. You're overrating him to a ridiculous degree.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:13 PM   #14
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Stop selling Ware short. Hes been dominant for far too long in both areas (run and pass) to not be compared.

If you don't think teams gameplan for Ware similar to how they did for LT, you're kidding yourself.



Ware is the prototype 34 OLB to which future generations will be judged upon.

Last six years, 91 sacks and 24 forced fumbles with great run defense.

Nobody can match that resume as a defender the last six years. I don't think anyone comes close actually, though I am not going to look it up.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:14 PM   #15
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Default Re: GOAT defensive players?

Quote:
Originally Posted by niko
He wasn't. No one thinks so except you. Ware was never the dominant player LT was. There never was a time as a giant fan i thought OMG WARE IS COMING.

You can argue this by yourself, you are being a homer and im honestly dissapointed in you. Ware isn't in the top ten level pantheon. You're overrating him to a ridiculous degree.
you SHOULD have, sacked the shit out of Eli more than LT did Aikman...

guess you will just have to be convinced when he enters the hall...IMO it is you being biased due to your Cowboy hate
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