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Old 01-23-2013, 02:26 PM   #31
TheMarkMadsen
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuniva_dAMiGhTy
Right ...

Kobe averaged 10ppg on 37% shooting against the '98 Jazz (WCF) and 15ppg on 36% shooting against Reggie Miller's Pacers (Finals).


I love how you talk about putting things into context and then rattle off Kobe's 2000 finals stats to use it against him. If you were so concerned about context then you would mention how Kobe only played 9 minutes in game 2 because he got injured 9 minutes into the game and completely missed game 3.

Also for the stats you posted earlier.. I realize Jordan had a Higher fg% and was abetted player than Kobe, who's arguing that..

But honesty those number can be very misleading.


For instance, "games under 50% shooing" how many of those games did Kobe shoot 49% 48% 47%?

How many of those games where Kobe shot under 40% and under 30% were games from his first 2 years where he might have gone 1 for 4 and then was pulled and not put back in the game?

Last edited by TheMarkMadsen : 01-23-2013 at 02:32 PM.
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Old 01-23-2013, 02:37 PM   #32
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMarkMadsen
I love how you talk about putting things into context and then rattle off Kobe's 2000 finals stats to use it against him.

I just used his shitty logic against him. You actually think I put ANY stock into those numbers?
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Old 01-23-2013, 02:47 PM   #33
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMarkMadsen
I love how you talk about putting things into context and then rattle off Kobe's 2000 finals stats to use it against him. If you were so concerned about context then you would mention how Kobe only played 9 minutes in game 2 because he got injured 9 minutes into the game and completely missed game 3.

Also for the stats you posted earlier.. I realize Jordan had a Higher fg% and was abetted player than Kobe, who's arguing that..

But honesty those number can be very misleading.


For instance, "games under 50% shooing" how many of those games did Kobe shoot 49% 48% 47%?

How many of those games where Kobe shot under 40% and under 30% were games from his first 2 years where he might have gone 1 for 4 and then was pulled and not put back in the game?

Not only that, but late 90's/early 00's defense/pace waaaaay different than the majority of Jordans career. But what do you expect from someone who probably never saw the majority of Jordans career?
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Old 01-23-2013, 02:52 PM   #34
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eliteballer
Not only that, but late 90's/early 00's defense/pace waaaaay different than the majority of Jordans career. But what do you expect from someone who probably never saw the majority of Jordans career?



Jordan, at age 28, in the 1991 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 106):
32/6/6 on 54% shooting

Kobe, at age 28, in the 2007 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 106):
32/6/5 on 46% shooting

Jordan, at age 30, in the 1993 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 105):
35.1ppg, .475%fg, 6.7reb, 6.0ast

Kobe, at age 30, in the 2009 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 105):
30.2ppg, .457%fg, 5.3reb, 5.5ast

Jordan, at age 33, in the '96 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 105):
30.7ppg, .459%fg, 4.9reb, 4.1ast

Kobe, at age 32, in the 2011 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 106):
22.8ppg, .446%fg, 3.4reb, 3.4ast

Jordan, at age 34, in the '97 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 102):
31.1ppg, .456%fg, 7.9reb, 4.8ast

Kobe, at age 33, in the 2012 playoffs (opponents DRtg - 104):
30.0ppg, .439%fg, 4.8reb, 4.3ast
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:16 PM   #35
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

LOL........why don't you do some research on "D-Rating" and how it's calculated then get back to me.

Kobe at age 32 and 33- major knee problems and much more mileage than Jordan at equivalent age.

Short 3 point line benefitting Jordan in 96 and 97.

Try again....
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Old 01-23-2013, 03:21 PM   #36
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?



It adjusts everything per 100 possessions. As you can see, Kobe is still a poor mans Jordan.

MJ played college ball and didn't have Shaq, the most dominant player of his generation, sucking up double and triple teams. at "mileage"
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Old 01-23-2013, 05:28 PM   #37
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Some people tend to deify Jordan on these boards but honestly I think if you add a prime Jordan on this team, they have a chance to win it all. Jordan instantly solves the defensive backcourt issue as well as the lack of a slashing threat issue. He actually fits IF the whole team including Jordan play within their roles and adjust to each other. Shot management is something the coaching staff will have to really work on.
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Old 01-23-2013, 05:38 PM   #38
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMarkMadsen
Jordan FGA per game: 23

Kobe FGA per game: 20

What is Kobe's FGA per season if you exclude his rookie and sophomore seasons?
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:14 PM   #39
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blablabla
the difference between 45 and 50 on 20fga is one make/miss

Its still a pretty big deal. So many games are close first of all, and one more miss or make might not just be literally the difference in the outcome as it would be in a 1-3 point game difference, but if its a miss then the opposing team will usually get a better shot once they get the rebound, plus that one shot many times swings momentum in general. Plus, so many games are closer then their final score might indicate because of how the losing team will foul at the end of games. Its not anywhere near as simple as you're saying.
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:21 PM   #40
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

No the last thing the lakers need to add is another star with an ego. He might make the situation worst.
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:29 PM   #41
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eliteballer
Jordan played in an era where Barkley shot 60% in a season, the Bad Boys allowed more PPG than the Don Nelson Mavericks.....get your "stats" out of here.



You are Talking Like Charles was Just Too Small To Have a 60% FG Season?

Charles Was the Shaq of His Era.

Infact Barkley If You Take Away his 3-Point FGs/FGAs Shot 62-65% FG on Over 20 PPG for 6-7 Seasons
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:34 PM   #42
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blablabla
the difference between 45 and 50 on 20fga is one make/miss

The difference between 45 and 50 % over the course of a season is how many makes/misses? A playoff series? An entire playoff run?

A career?

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Old 01-23-2013, 06:37 PM   #43
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3LiftHeatCurse
and the Giants won the super bowl with a 9-7 regular season record. SO WHAT?

Facts are facts. The Giants were the best team in the NFL that year, and Jordan took the Bulls from a LOTTERY team to playoff team by adding Jordan.

How is that fact? In the NFL playoffs, the best team rarely wins due to the single elimination tournament format. It's actually the worst of the major sports in that regard.

In the NBA, rarely will you have superior teams losing to lesser competition, outside of ridiculous matchup problems.
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Old 01-23-2013, 07:54 PM   #44
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Default Re: Put Michael Jordan at small forward on the Lakers. They win the championship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eurobum
The difference between 45 and 50 % over the course of a season is how many makes/misses? A playoff series? An entire playoff run?

A career?


The nerd in me decided to do the math. For Kobe to have gotten to 50%, he would've had to make 1,099 more of the FGs he's attempted throughout his career. Assuming there all 2-pointers, thats about 2,198 points. The Lakers during Kobe's career have lost 455 games at an average differential of a little under 10 points per loss. That means on average if Kobe made up that 45% vs. 50% difference in the games they lost, the Lakers would've won about 220 games more. Now of course, to expect that all those shots he missed would've been made up in just those losses and that other factors of games with those differences is obviously not realistic. I'm just pointing out just how big of a deal that is, cause even if it was a quarter of that it would be a big deal.

Last edited by guy : 01-23-2013 at 07:57 PM.
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