Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > InsideHoops Main Basketball Forums > Off the Court Lounge

Off the Court Lounge Basketball fans talk about everything EXCEPT basketball here

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-14-2013, 10:07 AM   #166
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

no, they aren't pretty much murders...most of them are just careless kids who are intoxicated

speaking of MADD, many of them are the mothers of the actual drunk driver who died...they will get you to feel for their son's death and plead for you not to make the same costly mistake.

is "costly mistake" okay for you?
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 10:08 AM   #167
Legend of Josh
Banned
 
Legend of Josh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Alch|e|mist
Posts: 10,076
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

There's a difference between making the careless (or even reckless) decision to get behind the wheel of a vehicle and operate it under the influence, while on sleep medication, other narcotics, etc. and simply making the decision to murder someone in cold blood ... yes people, there is a difference.

Just like PT pointed out way earlier in this thread, the law agrees. Most of you in this thread believe fair and complete justice was served, but that doesn't mean you're right. The actual law disagrees with the majority of you people in this thread, and rightfully so.
Legend of Josh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 10:11 AM   #168
OhNoTimNoSho
Your King
 
OhNoTimNoSho's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 3,395
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
Perhaps "careless choice" is better wording...you're right

Sorry if "careless mistake" rubs some of you the wrong way...mistakes are mistakes though, and getting in a car drunk is careless...it fits imo but whatever
Dude just put yourself in the situation, if someone close to you got killed.. would you be brushing it off as a careless mistake a careless choice? Is that how you would approach it? Your lack of perspective is whats bothering people.


How would you want a person that killed someone you know drunk driving to be punished?
OhNoTimNoSho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 10:18 AM   #169
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhNoTimNoSho
Dude just put yourself in the situation, if someone close to you got killed.. would you be brushing it off as a careless mistake a careless choice? Is that how you would approach it? Your lack of perspective is whats bothering people.


How would you want a person that killed someone you know drunk driving to be punished?
again, *broken record* Im not "brushing anything off"...and IMO it is most of you that lack perspective on this subject, I'm the one that has gone through all the DUI classes and MADD meetings

but to answer your question it completely depends upon the person driving...if it was some 19 year old college girl coming back from a party then I would be more understanding than if it was a 50 year old man covered in tats drinking a beer while driving who has 20 DUIs under his belt, and if that is the case I might actually want death for him...perhaps the law would too, idk for that situation
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 10:26 AM   #170
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

One of the MADD meetings I took, the mother of a victim was giving a speach with the mother of the driver who killed her child (who also died that night)...they were friends, and both felt for each other's loss...both preached to not make the same mistake
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 12:46 PM   #171
ProfessorMurder
I am your soldier!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: In the year 2525
Posts: 30,269
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
again, *broken record* Im not "brushing anything off"...and IMO it is most of you that lack perspective on this subject, I'm the one that has gone through all the DUI classes and MADD meetings

You being a confirmed drunk driver won't help drive home your point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
but to answer your question it completely depends upon the person driving...if it was some 19 year old college girl coming back from a party then I would be more understanding than if it was a 50 year old man covered in tats drinking a beer while driving who has 20 DUIs under his belt, and if that is the case I might actually want death for him...perhaps the law would too, idk for that situation

That's the same thing. Just because one guy was caught more doesn't mean he's worse. Assault is assault, drunk driving is drunk driving, murder is murder. For something like this it doesn't matter who commits it from a moral standpoint, only their jail time.


And f*ck the guy might have wanted to die once the law took over. Killing two kids from drunk driving, losing a massive legal battle, money given to the victims' family, shitloads of jail time. Getting killed might've been the lucky way out. (The murderer is obviously bad too.)
ProfessorMurder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 12:59 PM   #172
Legend of Josh
Banned
 
Legend of Josh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Alch|e|mist
Posts: 10,076
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Drunk driving laws have become stricter and stricter over the years, so it's headed in the right direction, and there's still work to be done, but IMO, the laws are fair.

I've had two DUI's BTW.
Legend of Josh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 01:50 PM   #173
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorMurder
You being a confirmed drunk driver won't help drive home your point.



That's the same thing. Just because one guy was caught more doesn't mean he's worse. Assault is assault, drunk driving is drunk driving, murder is murder. For something like this it doesn't matter who commits it from a moral standpoint, only their jail time.


And f*ck the guy might have wanted to die once the law took over. Killing two kids from drunk driving, losing a massive legal battle, money given to the victims' family, shitloads of jail time. Getting killed might've been the lucky way out. (The murderer is obviously bad too.)

no, as viewed by the law and by myself multpile strikes does certainly matter...a first time offender is not viewed anywhere the same as a repeat offender by the judge

the way you are wording it all drunking driving should be the exact same punishment, even if you were lucky enough to not kill anyone...but that isn't reality.

I like the 3-strike rule, I think that drunk driving is a crime that one should get another chance on...but if it is shown it is a constant problem - prison
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 01:53 PM   #174
intrinsic
Local High School Star
 
intrinsic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,672
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue&Orange

Now apparently the fact that one kid was on his way to the hospital it's incredibly relevant and important, the other one laying dead it's of no importance and it's irrelevant. And apparently these "people" are not only a fathers but a "good" fathers! lol

"Hey look you killed my son while driving drunk, but that's ok, the other one is going to the hospital, wanna go for drink? Now if you killed them both, man you would be in trouble!"

Seriously how retarded can you be?

I can only assume the first paragraph is a response to me since I pointed it out.

Here's the relevance:
Barajas did not know the driver was drunk. It was proven later.
Barajas did not know both of his children were dead. One died after being transported to the hospital.
All accounts of the story have Barajas going back into his home before returning to shoot the other man -- in the head.

Barajas could have spent those minutes helping his one son clinging to life. Crying for help to neighbors, passersby, family, whoever. He made the terrible choice to go back inside the house, get a gun and execute this man. He's a much less sympathetic figure to me because of these actions.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpuente
911 would have been called either way.



Anyways 1 dying would have been enough to kill either way.

I cant believe we are still arguing this.

I don't know if this touches you personally, or what it is. There's no "enough" granting a license to kill in this situation.
intrinsic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 01:56 PM   #175
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Macho Man
Arguing over the choice of words used to describe drunk driving. Primetime has sucked you all in.
no they sucked me in..."careless mistake is too kind, use the word 'reckless' instead please"

it's so silly and insignificant in this debate

*goes on to read article where Mother's Against Drunk Driving use the exact words "carelss mistake"



reckless/costly/careless/desasterous/horrible/awful/etc mistake...just pick one and move on
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 03:10 PM   #176
ProfessorMurder
I am your soldier!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: In the year 2525
Posts: 30,269
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by -p.tiddy-
no, as viewed by the law and by myself multpile strikes does certainly matter...a first time offender is not viewed anywhere the same as a repeat offender by the judge

the way you are wording it all drunking driving should be the exact same punishment, even if you were lucky enough to not kill anyone...but that isn't reality.

I like the 3-strike rule, I think that drunk driving is a crime that one should get another chance on...but if it is shown it is a constant problem - prison

Yeah I said the amount of times you're caught matters for your sentence, but not from a moral point. If you do something terrible once or ten times it's still terrible.

All drunk driving should have the same base punishment, and then escalate it for each repeated offense, manslaughter, how far over the limit, etc. - It's like that now, but it should be harsher right off the bat. Increase the stigma.

I mean how many times does the average person drive drunk before they were caught? Probably a few.

Three strikes sounds fine in principal, but one do over should be enough. You should get one f*ck up if it wasn't too serious. Your own personal drunk driving is very easy to control, it's all on the individual and how much they value their life, car, privilege to drive, insurance rate, and other people.
ProfessorMurder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 03:27 PM   #177
rufuspaul
Kubla Kemba
 
rufuspaul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Charlotte
Posts: 21,553
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorMurder
Yeah I said the amount of times you're caught matters for your sentence, but not from a moral point. If you do something terrible once or ten times it's still terrible.

All drunk driving should have the same base punishment, and then escalate it for each repeated offense, manslaughter, how far over the limit, etc. - It's like that now, but it should be harsher right off the bat. Increase the stigma.

I mean how many times does the average person drive drunk before they were caught? Probably a few.

Three strikes sounds fine in principal, but one do over should be enough. You should get one f*ck up if it wasn't too serious. Your own personal drunk driving is very easy to control, it's all on the individual and how much they value their life, car, privilege to drive, insurance rate, and other people.


I don't know if the laws are still the same but when I lived in Germany if a cop stopped you for suspicion of drunk driving you would get a blood test on the spot (no right to refuse). It was illegal for anyone under the age of 21 to have any alcohol in their system. Over 21 the legal limit was 0.05%. If you're over the limit your car is confiscated and sold. Your license is taken for 6 mo.s and you have to pay a hefty fine and/or face jail time depending on the % of alcohol in your system. A 2nd violation involves a lengthy prison sentence and revocation of your license.

So despite a strong drinking culture, Germans generally avoid driving drunk. Of course it helps that they have a great public transportation system.
rufuspaul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 03:33 PM   #178
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorMurder
Yeah I said the amount of times you're caught matters for your sentence, but not from a moral point. If you do something terrible once or ten times it's still terrible.

All drunk driving should have the same base punishment, and then escalate it for each repeated offense, manslaughter, how far over the limit, etc. - It's like that now, but it should be harsher right off the bat. Increase the stigma.

I mean how many times does the average person drive drunk before they were caught? Probably a few.

Three strikes sounds fine in principal, but one do over should be enough. You should get one f*ck up if it wasn't too serious. Your own personal drunk driving is very easy to control, it's all on the individual and how much they value their life, car, privilege to drive, insurance rate, and other people.
for many people one time IS the eye-opener

and yes some people can get away with it literally hundreds of times before caught

kids are stupid...you can tell a child a million times to "say no to drugs" but most will still say yes at some point. In fact telling them not to do something can make them want to do it more. They have to find out for themselves. And once a kid drives drunk once and gets away with they start to think they are above the norm..."oh but I am great drunk driver"...they don't learn until something bad actually happens. I knew dozens of people with this mind set when I was a youngster...eyes don't open until DUIs start getting handed out.

That's why I like the 3-strike system...I am willing to accept the fact that kids are dumb and do dumb things, esp when drunk.
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 03:34 PM   #179
Legend of Josh
Banned
 
Legend of Josh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Alch|e|mist
Posts: 10,076
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

In my much younger years I had two DUIs back-to-back within a 3 year period. As a result, I automatically lost my license for 4 years, and then after the 4 years, I had to have a breathalyzer on my vehicle for 3 additional years. At the time, I thought my life was over, I thought the penalty was way too harsh, etc. Today, I think it was pretty fair, especially considering the hundreds of times I've driven drunk, I could have killed someone (thank God that never happened). Even still to this day (until Oct 11th of 2014) I have a 0.00 tolerance meaning if I get pulled and blow anything up until that date, automatic 3rd DUI offense.

Many would say that's harsh punishment. I think it's fair. Some say it isn't enough.

I've had two DUIs ... should I be locked up for life? WHAT IF I was unfortunate enough to have say my first DUI ... say it was only my 2nd time driving drunk ever, and I just happen to slam into someone, killing them.

Who deserves the more harsh punishment, the guy who's driven 100+ times drunk out of his mind or the guy who only his 2nd time got behind the wheel and slammed into said dead subject?



The laws are designed a specific way for a reason. Raw emotion shouldn't drive the law... logic should. LOL, which is why so many of you are so off on this "the drunk driver deserved it" etc bullshit.
Legend of Josh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2013, 03:40 PM   #180
-p.tiddy-
the Sho Kosugi of ISH
 
-p.tiddy-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: -dallas, texas-
Posts: 14,335
Default Re: Man Murders A Drunk Driver After Car Crash

Damn Josh...yeah if you get one more you're gone

hope that is behind you
-p.tiddy- is offline   Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:41 AM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site















Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy