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Old 07-20-2013, 09:50 PM   #31
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eurobum
I accept the cluster****ity of MOS, because it's f*cking Superman. It's probably one of the only contemporary movies in recent times where I was able to sit through 20+ minutes of actions sequence without falling asleep/just starring blankly "through" the screen almost.

How do you expect a Superman-movie without massive amounts of CG?

I liked Zod, but I can see how people doesn't like him, so I'll give you that. But they're following the Nolan-Batman recipe (again, Hollywood won't take chances, if there's a formula, they will go for it). Second movie will be his arch nemesis, Lex Luthor, like Dark Knight was the Joker.

The video game lifeless cutscenes weren't the main issue, the hollow characters, story and rushed sequences killed it. I could write an essay about all the horrible things in that movie but you can just read any of the bad reviews on Rottentomatoes for the cliff notes. The movie just felt empty, it was no different than Transformers, I would ask you to tell me in detail what exactly you liked in the movie but there wouldn't be anything you could describe because the movie had nothing redeeming. It was a typical cookie cutter, mindless pop corn flick. No memorable acting, story, humor, action, dialogue or characters.

Compared to X-Men First Class, Avengers, Iron Man, The Dark Knight Trilogy and even Watchmen it was garbage. And mostly due to the script, and they hire the same guy to write Superman/Batman movie.
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Old 07-20-2013, 09:54 PM   #32
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

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Originally Posted by Killbot
Needs to be animated.

Already done.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsFleNBp9eM
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Old 07-20-2013, 09:57 PM   #33
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graviton
Yea if you actually think Man of Steel was better than Avengers/Iron Man 1 then I don't know what to tell you. Avengers was actually well developed and gave real screentime and dialogue to characters instead of speeding everything up and throwing in some cliche flashbacks to make us feel for Clark. Watchmen was much better than POS that was Man of Steel too. It's not as much Snyder's fault as it is that GARBAGE script, did you not notice how basically no character got more than 2 lines of dialogue in every scene? It was a rushed video game cut scene of a movie with no substance. Hiring Goyer to write the script again is just hilarious.

"Iron Man" was very good. Sequels were eh as f*ck. The third one? Wow.

Avengers was just wack to me, the universe and the lightheartedness (though Hulk was the only positive) and the over-the-top 40 minute ending. Just eh.

I do concede MOS is .... wouldn't say shallow but aside from young Clark it isn't very deep, and my hope is that the sequel will be more deep in character development. As mentioned before though, I fully accept this video-game style, because it's cot damn Superman. I thought this was a perfect introduction to get audiences hooked, and I actually didn't find the flashbacks forced at all.

Zod, I thought he was good and his motivations were justified and his development (not as a character, but 'physically' in terms of adapting to earth with newfound powers) was really good setting up for the final fight.

Jor-El was great. Personally, I thought he was a little too present (like he was actually there), but that's just my opinion.

Jonathan Kent was also great. I didn't find his death cheesy.

The only real gripe I had was the very end when Clark is hired at the Daily Planet and no one recognizes him. This just doesn't cut it for me in a modern day setting. With globalization, the very second he outed himself as an alien he would instantly become the most recognizable face on earth, no? I thought Snyder was bold in leaving behind elements of the classical Superman (we can't forgot he is an old character that needs to be refreshed for modernity): the trunks (LOL, Superman finally figured out that underpants go under the pants), the logo and the fact that he killed, which had fans irate, because Superman doesn't kill. I loved it. It fit. So I thought it would've been even bolder to just delete the whole Clark Kent persona the instant Superman was 'out.' But I guess that would've been too much against tradition.

Another thing that was great and is always great in Snyder movies is the attention to detail: sets, costumes, etc, ESPECIALLY the sci-fi aspect where Avengers and the likes don't measure up at all. Won't get into that now, doe.

Would've been a nice detail if they started out speaking Kryptonian, but only for, like, two lines and then switching to English, like they started Valkyrie with Cruise's character speaking German. And then having 'the ghost' of Jor-El speak English would be easily explained, since he was basically a computer program from an intelligent civilization that thrived for 100,000 years, meaning technology could allow for this.

Last edited by eurobum : 07-20-2013 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:08 PM   #34
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graviton
The video game lifeless cutscenes weren't the main issue, the hollow characters, story and rushed sequences killed it. I could write an essay about all the horrible things in that movie but you can just read any of the bad reviews on Rottentomatoes for the cliff notes. The movie just felt empty, it was no different than Transformers, I would ask you to tell me in detail what exactly you liked in the movie but there wouldn't be anything you could describe because the movie had nothing redeeming. It was a typical cookie cutter, mindless pop corn flick. No memorable acting, story, humor, action, dialogue or characters.

Compared to X-Men First Class, Avengers, Iron Man, The Dark Knight Trilogy and even Watchmen it was garbage. And mostly due to the script, and they hire the same guy to write Superman/Batman movie.

I just don't agree with your points except for the hollow characters aside from Clark, Jor-El and to a little extent Zod.

Please don't compare it to Transformers. MOS was a popcorn flick yes, but, to me, not a mindless one. I don't normally watch "cookie cutter, mindless popcorn flicks."

No memorable action? Okay, I can see if you at some point decide you aren't into the movie you just zone out, which is what I normally do for instance when Johnny Depp is being chased for 30 minutes in a semi-comically choreographed manner or Transformers, etc.

I thought it was one hell of a ride. Watched it twice in theaters and a couple of times more in a cam version, I've not seen a cam-version of a film for as long as I can remember.

The dialogue writing is not bad at all, sometimes it's even very good. Mostly Jor-El's part, though.

"They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."

I, too, could write an essay but about the good things.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:20 PM   #35
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eurobum
"Iron Man" was very good. Sequels were eh as f*ck. The third one? Wow.

Avengers was just wack to me, the universe and the lightheartedness (though Hulk was the only positive) and the over-the-top 40 minute ending. Just eh.

I do concede MOS is .... wouldn't say shallow but aside from young Clark it isn't very deep, and my hope is that the sequel will be more deep in character development. As mentioned before though, I fully accept this video-game style, because it's cot damn Superman. I thought this was a perfect introduction to get audiences hooked, and I actually didn't find the flashbacks forced at all.

Zod, I thought he was good and his motivations were justified and his development (not as a character, but 'physically' in terms of adapting to earth with newfound powers) was really good setting up for the final fight.

Jor-El was great. Personally, I thought he was a little too present (like he was actually there), but that's just my opinion.

Jonathan Kent was also great. I didn't find his death cheesy.

The only real gripe I had was the very end when Clark is hired at the Daily Planet and no one recognizes him. This just doesn't cut it for me in a modern day setting. With globalization, the very second he outed himself as an alien he would instantly become the most recognizable face on earth, no? I thought Snyder was bold in leaving behind elements of the classical Superman (we can't forgot he is an old character that needs to be refreshed for modernity): the trunks (LOL, Superman finally figured out that underpants go under the pants) and the fact that he killed, which had fans irate, because Superman doesn't kill. I loved it. It fit. So I thought it would've been even bolder to just delete the whole Clark Kent persona the instant Superman was 'out.' But I guess that would've been too much against tradition.

Another thing that was great and is always great in Snyder movies is the attention to detail: sets, costumes, etc. Won't get into that now, doe.

Yea Avengers was a little corny but the actual acting, dialogue, cgi mixed with REAL LIFE set pieces made it great. Robert Downey, Mark Ruffalo, Loki and even the minor characters actually displayed some real acting and were developed. In MOS not even Clark got more than one liners outside his flashbacks. Every person was like a guest star in a TV show episode.

The issue with the CGI in Man of Steel was the fact it felt like an empty Matrix, people were being crushed left and right and Clark couldn't give two shits while the whole city is being destroyed. You never felt the shock and horror of the people running around and being smashed like ants, all the focus was on the aliens. Compare that to the New York scene in Avengers when you actually see real cars and people running around and Avengers trying to rescue them, the action felt organic and "realistic". You never got a video game feel out of it, the buildings, aliens and everything else in that set piece kept you in the experience. They mixed CGI with real sets and kept it grounded. While in Man of Steel you basically couldn't give a shit because it looked like a Matrix demo and none of the destruction and chaos mattered. It was 100% CGI.

There were lote of wtf unrealistic moments for me in the story in MOS, one was when Clark heard about some discovery in the ice in that shithole bar, then in the next scene he is working with the crew there which is supposed to be a secured base. Like seriously? This homeless dude somehow got fake documents and conveniently got a job there in like a day or two?

Another was how Lois found out who Superman was by just following local freak stories but the almighty US government with all their modern technology couldn't figure it out even after Clark told the general "I grew up in Kansas". LIKE WOW, they couldn't do the exact same shit as Lois and search for weird stories about some events that involved "miracles".

Oh and the reporters saw Clark's face when he saved/kissed Lois in the city, they were like 20 feet away from him. But then they see him again few days later with glasses and they are like who the **** is this?

This basically details all the wtf story developments and ridiculous plot points.

http://io9.com/the-most-important-sc...emem-516405346
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:25 PM   #36
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Sorry for editing my posts, but I keep forgetting some good points after I post.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:25 PM   #37
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eurobum
I just don't agree with your points except for the hollow characters aside from Clark, Jor-El and to a little extent Zod.

Please don't compare it to Transformers. MOS was a popcorn flick yes, but, to me, not a mindless one. I don't normally watch "cookie cutter, mindless popcorn flicks."

No memorable action? Okay, I can see if you at some point decide you aren't into the movie you just zone out, which is what I normally do for instance when Johnny Depp is being chased for 30 minutes in a semi-comically choreographed manner or Transformers, etc.

I thought it was one hell of a ride. Watched it twice in theaters and a couple of times more in a cam version, I've not seen a cam-version of a film for as long as I can remember.

The dialogue writing is not bad at all, sometimes it's even very good. Mostly Jor-El's part, though.

"They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."

I, too, could write an essay but about the good things.

You just gave me a cliche one liner, that's basically proving my point.

There was no detailed explanation about anything in the movie. Or some deep conversation between anyone. Just rushed one liners in every scene, even when Clark finds the ship and is like "I have so many questions". Around 1 minute later he is outside in his new costume all ready for saving the world, he found his answers and filled the hole in his heart in that time.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:34 PM   #38
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graviton
Yea Avengers was a little corny but the actual acting, dialogue, cgi mixed with REAL LIFE set pieces made it great. Robert Downey, Mark Ruffalo, Loki and even the minor characters actually displayed some real acting and were developed. In MOS not even Clark got more than one liners outside his flashbacks. Every person was like a guest star in a TV show episode.

The issue with the CGI in Man of Steel was the fact it felt like an empty Matrix, people were being crushed left and right and Clark couldn't give two shits while the whole city is being destroyed. You never felt the shock and horror of the people running around and being smashed like ants, all the focus was on the aliens. Compare that to the New York scene in Avengers when you actually see real cars and people running around and Avengers trying to rescue them, the action felt organic and "realistic". You never got a video game feel out of it, the buildings, aliens and everything else in that set piece kept you in the experience. They mixed CGI with real sets and kept it grounded. While in Man of Steel you basically couldn't give a shit because it looked like a Matrix demo and none of the destruction and chaos mattered. It was 100% CGI.

There were lote of wtf unrealistic moments for me in the story in MOS, one was when Clark heard about some discovery in the ice in that shithole bar, then in the next scene he is working with the crew there which is supposed to be a secured base. Like seriously? This homeless dude somehow got fake documents and conveniently got a job there in like a day or two?

Another was how Lois found out who Superman was by just following local freak stories but the almighty US government with all their modern technology couldn't figure it out even after Clark told the general "I grew up in Kansas". LIKE WOW, they couldn't do the exact same shit as Lois and search for weird stories about some events that involved "miracles".

Oh and the reporters saw Clark's face when he saved/kissed Lois in the city, they were like 20 feet away from him. But then they see him again few days later with glasses and they are like who the **** is this?

This basically details all the wtf story developments and ridiculous plot points.

http://io9.com/the-most-important-sc...emem-516405346

I thought the Avengers was more than a little corny, it was way too much.

In response to the bolded part of your post: Did you feel that horror in Avengers? Honestly, not at all, I tuned out like you did for MOS, because how many times have we seen that familiar sequence in grand-scale action movies the last twenty years? Too many times, we've been completely desensitized. Which is why I liked the action more in MOS; yes the basic premise is similar but the execution of the action -- 100x faster, testosterone sequences coupled with ultra-fast pacing (which you didn't like) ... it's just > Avengers, to me. I rather like that there wasn't an army, that became so generic and bland in Avengers. I liked the focus on only two or three actual villains who did the actual fighting.

Again, I accept the collateral damage, because it fits in nicely with a more realistic, modern day Superman. This is a major gripe for critics of MOS that Superman is supposed to not allow these things to happen. What was the alternative? Alien invasion and a complete takeover.

As far as the plot holes are concerned, I can't defend those. I just can't. Of course. I take the film for what it is. All in all it was a GREAT action movie to me. Gave it an 8 on IMDb. Think I gave Avengers 6. Dark Knight 9. Iron Man 7.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:39 PM   #39
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graviton
You just gave me a cliche one liner, that's basically proving my point.

There was no detailed explanation about anything in the movie. Or some deep conversation between anyone. Just rushed one liners in every scene, even when Clark finds the ship and is like "I have so many questions". Around 1 minute later he is outside in his new costume all ready for saving the world, he found his answers and filled the hole in his heart in that time.

I don't think it's that cliche :) .. for a comic book interpretation I think it's pretty good.

"There was no detailed explanation about anything in the movie."

What, in your opinion, needed more explanation? I thought most of the things were unveiled nicely, but yes, VERY quickly. I also thought the different angles from Jor-El and Jonathan Kent gave way for some nice one-on-one scenes with very good dialogue. But like I said before, I do agree that the other stuff wasn't ..... I'll say: was more shallow.
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Old 07-20-2013, 10:41 PM   #40
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

By the way, I also thought the two-three DIRECT Jesus references were ridiculous and shouldn't have been there in MOS.

Last edited by eurobum : 07-20-2013 at 10:44 PM.
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Old 07-20-2013, 11:41 PM   #41
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

How is $600mil for a reboot a huge disappointment?

It's a teriible film, but far from a disappointment. MOS is a success actually. WB has done enough that Superman is back in people's consciousness.
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Old 07-20-2013, 11:44 PM   #42
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

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Originally Posted by D-Wade316
How is $600mil for a reboot a huge disappointment?

It's a teriible film, but far from a disappointment. MOS is a success actually. WB has done enough that Superman is back in people's consciousness.
Compared to Marvel's major movies and even TDK trilogy that's pretty weak, if you gonna do a total brainless action movie may as well go full Transformers route, MOS was half and half.

They are trying to compete with Marvel, but the fact they didn't try to somehow get Nolan involved deeper and instead went with Goyer again is just retarded.
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Old 07-21-2013, 12:00 AM   #43
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graviton
Compared to Marvel's major movies and even TDK trilogy that's pretty weak, if you gonna do a total brainless action movie may as well go full Transformers route, MOS was half and half.

They are trying to compete with Marvel, but the fact they didn't try to somehow get Nolan involved deeper and instead went with Goyer again is just retarded.
We're discussing the film's financial success, not it's quality(which we agree upon). MOS isn't that far apart from SR you know, which made what? $600mil will get people talking and that's just what WB set out do with MOS. I'm fine with Snyder directing, but Goyer should only be an "idea man". His scripts are nothing but hollow exposition.
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Old 07-21-2013, 12:08 AM   #44
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killbot
Needs to be animated.

check out these two animated movies

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superma...Public_Enemies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superma...an:_Apocalypse

heres a list of all the animated movies theyve put out in the last 5yrs

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DC_Univ...riginal_Movies

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Old 07-21-2013, 12:13 AM   #45
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Default Re: batman-superman team-up movie is next DC movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Wade316
We're discussing the film's financial success, not it's quality(which we agree upon). MOS isn't that far apart from SR you know, which made what? $600mil will get people talking and that's just what WB set out do with MOS. I'm fine with Snyder directing, but Goyer should only be an "idea man". His scripts are nothing but hollow exposition.
225 million budget and earned 620 million, that's less than 400 million profit. While it's technically a success, I doubt it's what they really expect from SUPERMAN. Thor had a profit of like 300 million and no one even knew who the **** that character was.

If they just want some profit with shallow Superman, movies, I guess they can be successful, but there is so much more potential if they just get rid of garbage Goyer at least.
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