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Old 01-20-2014, 04:03 AM   #121
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

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Originally Posted by Go Getter
I know it seems like I want to tear down hockey but I'm not. I'm challenging people's perception of hockey players compared to the perception of other athletes.

Which is easily answered. One sport it's allowed. Why it's allowed or should it be allowed? Say what you will. It is tho. Other sports it's not allowed. That's why people perceive them different. With that being said people/media do give NHL players shit for certain stuff surrounding fights, guess you miss it.

I'm sure other factors come into play, not that naive. NHL players make waaaaay less money, aren't in the media as much in America, come from different backgrounds, don't have as much off the court issues such as the Kobe incident, obviously racist people out there and it's mostly white guys. Compare Crosby, Duchene, Doughty to LeBron, J.R Smith etc. or whatever and yeah people are douchebags about it.

That's subjective tho, not concrete. Whats concrete is the rule book allows for players to fight in hockey and than get sent to the penalty box, NBA/NFL don't allow that.
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:42 AM   #122
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Seriously, I've never seen a thread go in this many circles
I guess what it boils down to is this (not directed at you Go getter)
Humans are ignorant when it comes to things they are unfamiliar with. That's really the explanation to why hockey fights are not accepted outside the hockey culture.

Let's look at it another way.

What if someone up in Flin Flon, Manitoba, Canada who has never seen a lick of basketball in his life catches an NBA game. He notices that when a shot goes up from deep nobody goes up and challenges it before it goes in the net. We explain it's called goal tending, it's not a new rule, it's been around forever, it gives the other team a shot at scoring from far. The guys says, well in every other sport you can contest a ball/puck from the goal line in any spot on the field/court/ice, why is it different in basketball? Is it hypocrisy?

Is there something wrong with his perception? That's the way he sees it in other sports? What makes basketball any different? It all boils down to accepting different cultures
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:46 AM   #123
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

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Originally Posted by hateraid
Seriously, I've never seen a thread go in this many circles
I guess what it boils down to is this (not directed at you Go getter)
Humans are ignorant when it comes to things they are unfamiliar with. That's really the explanation to why hockey fights are not accepted outside the hockey culture.

Let's look at it another way.

What if someone up in Flin Flon, Manitoba, Canada who has never seen a lick of basketball in his life catches an NBA game. He notices that when a shot goes up from deep nobody goes up and challenges it before it goes in the net. We explain it's called goal tending, it's not a new rule, it's been around forever, it gives the other team a shot at scoring from far. The guys says, well in every other sport you can contest a ball/puck from the goal line in any spot on the field/court/ice, why is it different in basketball? Is it hypocrisy?

Is there something wrong with his perception? That's the way he sees it in other sports? What makes basketball any different? It all boils down to accepting different cultures

what kind of analogy is that. Fighting is not enabled by the rules of the sport, it's prohibited in Hockey just as it is in basketball. what we are discussing is why society and audience tacitly acknowledge and accept fighting between players in hockey while abhor it in basketball. it's decidedly not an issue of rules but perception
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Old 01-20-2014, 11:07 AM   #124
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by STATUTORY
what kind of analogy is that. Fighting is not enabled by the rules of the sport, it's prohibited in Hockey just as it is in basketball. what we are discussing is why society and audience tacitly acknowledge and accept fighting between players in hockey while abhor it in basketball. it's decidedly not an issue of rules but perception
You've just agreed with me and didn't realize it
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Old 01-20-2014, 11:48 AM   #125
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Baseball has dugout clearing brawls every year, that result in only cupcake penalties, lets add them into the discussion.
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Old 01-20-2014, 12:08 PM   #126
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

ahhh can't wait to watch this flyers and islanders game in an hour, hopefully wayne simmonds(he's black since this is really what this thread is about) beats the shit out of an islander.
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Old 01-20-2014, 12:24 PM   #127
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

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Originally Posted by Styles p
ahhh can't wait to watch this flyers and islanders game in an hour, hopefully wayne simmonds(he's black since this is really what this thread is about) beats the shit out of an islander.



Man sit yo simple ass down.
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Old 01-20-2014, 12:26 PM   #128
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norcaliblunt
Baseball has dugout clearing brawls every year, that result in only cupcake penalties, lets add them into the discussion.



Cupcake penalties? People get suspended for games that results in the loss of thousands of dollars.


Hockey players are the only athletes that get a slap on the wrist for fighting.
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Old 01-20-2014, 03:22 PM   #129
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Go Getter



Cupcake penalties? People get suspended for games that results in the loss of thousands of dollars.


Hockey players are the only athletes that get a slap on the wrist for fighting.

You are not automatically penalized for leaving the dugout in a baseball brawl like you are for leaving the bench in the NBA. Major League Baseball continues to allow dugout clearing brawls to be apart of the game for some reason.

And for the thousandth time, fighting is apart of the sport historically/traditionally and within the rules of Hockey, and people still look at it negatively. As for perception, all you have to do is play hockey while not even being an enforcer or brawler, and people have stereotypes about you being some rugged toothless goon. Quit acting like hockey is looked at in some fashionable light.

Lastly I find it interesting that basketball is the only team sport I can think of off the top of my head where a team can commit a penalty and benefit from it. You can commit fouls in hope the other team misses the free throws in all sorts of different situations such as hack a Shaq, players going hard in the paint, and end of the game scenarios. How is committing penalties aka breaking the rules supposed to help you win? BECAUSE IT IS PART OF THE GAME.
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Old 01-20-2014, 04:36 PM   #130
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norcaliblunt
You are not automatically penalized for leaving the dugout in a baseball brawl like you are for leaving the bench in the NBA. Major League Baseball continues to allow dugout clearing brawls to be apart of the game for some reason.

And for the thousandth time, fighting is apart of the sport historically/traditionally and within the rules of Hockey, and people still look at it negatively. As for perception, all you have to do is play hockey while not even being an enforcer or brawler, and people have stereotypes about you being some rugged toothless goon. Quit acting like hockey is looked at in some fashionable light.

Lastly I find it interesting that basketball is the only team sport I can think of off the top of my head where a team can commit a penalty and benefit from it. You can commit fouls in hope the other team misses the free throws in all sorts of different situations such as hack a Shaq, players going hard in the paint, and end of the game scenarios. How is committing penalties aka breaking the rules supposed to help you win? BECAUSE IT IS PART OF THE GAME.

Don't bother. He's blindly talking about something he has no idea about and actually thinks he's making sense.

Doesn't matter what reasons you give. I think a big thing with perception is country for sure. Hockey is Canada's game much like the NBA/NFL is American. Alot of Americans don't grow up with hockey as much therefore the concept of fighting seems crazy where as everywhere in Canada are comfortable with it. Therefore the people in and around hockey perceive the players differently when they fight where in the NBA people are NOT comfortable with fighting therefore when it happens those fans attack it.

Quote:
Here's bottom line: Whether u like or hate CGY-VAN line brawl - plenty of views both way - it's "accepted" in NHL with prescribed penalties.

- Bob McKezie. Basically our guy at the ESPN of hockey, since you know ESPN could give a shit about it. Big analyst at TSN.

What Go Getter can't grasp is people will call some guys out for it. They will get called goons. Coaches will get heat. Players will be perceived differently. Even with fighting being apart of the game it still happens. You just have no idea about hockey.
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Old 01-20-2014, 04:46 PM   #131
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Maybe if NBA players didn't have a rep for throwing bitch ass sucker punches in fights they wouldn't get hated on so much.



Or maybe, just maybe, its as simple as 6'8 dudes pack such a heavier punch than the average 5'10 to 6'1 sized guys in other sports that its wise to not allow them to potentially KO a fool and wreck his career.

Its not like you can punch a guy as hard on skates like you can on an NBA court. Even baseball fights tend to end in a tackle in the dirt more than anything.

Hell, I once saw Shaq take a swing at Brad Miller after he had turned his head and started walking the other way. Had Shaq connected it probably would have killed Miller.
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Old 01-20-2014, 09:52 PM   #132
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by NuggetsFan
Don't bother. He's blindly talking about something he has no idea about and actually thinks he's making sense.

Doesn't matter what reasons you give. I think a big thing with perception is country for sure. Hockey is Canada's game much like the NBA/NFL is American. Alot of Americans don't grow up with hockey as much therefore the concept of fighting seems crazy where as everywhere in Canada are comfortable with it. Therefore the people in and around hockey perceive the players differently when they fight where in the NBA people are NOT comfortable with fighting therefore when it happens those fans attack it.



- Bob McKezie. Basically our guy at the ESPN of hockey, since you know ESPN could give a shit about it. Big analyst at TSN.

What Go Getter can't grasp is people will call some guys out for it. They will get called goons. Coaches will get heat. Players will be perceived differently. Even with fighting being apart of the game it still happens. You just have no idea about hockey.

I get it. And I ACCEPT it. Hell, I even LIKE it. But I still think that it's hypocritical that we view ball players as thugs for their image and speech yet hockey players are seen as tough for fighting and knocking each other's teeth out.

I agree that I do not know about hockey which is why I am asking...I appreciate you guys explaining your POV to me the best you can and being respectful and patient with me.

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Old 01-20-2014, 09:54 PM   #133
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

Quote:
Originally Posted by kentatm
Maybe if NBA players didn't have a rep for throwing bitch ass sucker punches in fights they wouldn't get hated on so much.



Or maybe, just maybe, its as simple as 6'8 dudes pack such a heavier punch than the average 5'10 to 6'1 sized guys in other sports that its wise to not allow them to potentially KO a fool and wreck his career.

Its not like you can punch a guy as hard on skates like you can on an NBA court. Even baseball fights tend to end in a tackle in the dirt more than anything.

Hell, I once saw Shaq take a swing at Brad Miller after he had turned his head and started walking the other way. Had Shaq connected it probably would have killed Miller.


C'mon man hockey players cheap shot each other in the nuts and break sticks over each other's bodies....
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:06 PM   #134
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

I think pure Hockey fans appreciate the fighting as a "part of the game" and don't differentiate the way other fans who go between Hockey and other sports do..

some people love hockey fighting, but act like a fight in basketball is a sign of societal decay..

"I wont be taking my kids to any more NBA games... Too much thuggish behavior"

But the same mofo will rave about an "epic" hockey fight and not view it as a moral problem...
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Old 01-20-2014, 11:08 PM   #135
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Default Re: The hypocrisy of hockey

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Originally Posted by Rasheed1
I think pure Hockey fans appreciate the fighting as a "part of the game" and don't differentiate the way other fans who go between Hockey and other sports do..

some people love hockey fighting, but act like a fight in basketball is a sign of societal decay..

"I wont be taking my kids to any more NBA games... Too much thuggish behavior"

But the same mofo will rave about an "epic" hockey fight and not view it as a moral problem...


Exactly my point.
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