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Old 04-10-2007, 02:16 AM   #31
AtTheDriveIn
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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if your a black american Muslim... I don't really consider your religion to be the same as the Islam over there.

It's a religion, get over it.


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First off most american muslims don't even speak let alone read arabic. You have to be able to read Arabic to read the true Kuran. I know there are English versions but its not the same thing. As person with some linguistic experience I'd say at least a third of the nuances and meanings are lost in translation with any language.

Ever heard of converting?
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Another big difference is the environment. In the middle east and even now in Indonesia and other Muslim parts of the world Islamic leaders wield a lot of political power. The Sheiks and Imams hold as much authority as the government. We don't have any Sheiks or Imams over here, do we? We don't have any Sharia police running around making sure that all the women are nice and snug in their beekeeper uniforms do we?

Oh really, thanks for pointing that out, we didn't know. Yes, i will admit that some Islamic Extremist do take things too far, ordering private police etc. but if that's what the people choose to believe then so be it.

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And lastly... the culture in America, obviously, is much different than over there. Our people are generally more educated and have a higher standard of living.

What makes you think you're better then a Muslim person? Because you have a computer with super fast internet?, that still doesn't mean you're more educated. As far as the standard of living, come to my house, I'm almost certain i live 100 times better then you do. Your religion doesn't control what kind of house you have, and how you live your life.

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Besides... black islam in america is what... 40 or 50 years old? And I mean its basically a protest religion to me. Throwing away the "white" Christianity and moving to Islam. During the racial tension in the 60's guys like Malcom X popped up and became popular mostly because of their racial politics... not their religious views. Without the civil rights movement (thats probably the wrong term here... MLK was a civil rights activist... but Malcom wasnt) we probably wouldn't even have Islam amoung african americans.

Again, people can choose to believe what they want to believe. Religion is politics nowadays. That's not going to change any time soon.


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I try not to judge anyone by what they believe. Especially if it gives them hope and happiness. So this is strictly a personal oppinion, but i think believing in magical prophets like Jesus and Mohammed is not very intelligent.

So, you're a hypocrit too?

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What makes your God the right one? The fact that your parents think so? Did you even choose to be a muslim? Did your parents give you the chance to make your own decision? I doubt it.

When did any of us say, ALLAH IS THE GREATEST WORSHIP ALLAH, HES THE BEST. Not once has that been said. Yes, most of us go from what our parents are, and then we choose wether to be into religion or not at an older age. My parents have told me that i can choose what religion i am, and they will respect it. They've told me never to judge someone on what colour skin they are and what god they worship.

To sum it up, no, my parents didn't choose my religion for me.

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Because thats not how religions work. Your parents and culture tell you what to beleive and 9/10 you follow that. Especially if your Muslim, because leaving that religion is pretty impossible in most parts of the world.

Read up ^^ You're thinking of extremist societies where you'd get killed if you weren't Muslim, it doesn't work like that everywhere. In my home country of Bosnia (Muslim country) you can choose to worship whomever you want.

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In the end Christianity, Islam, Judaeism and whatever will fade away just like the old pagan religions have. Remembered only in history books or more likely stored in some virtual memory bank somewhere. Good riddance I say. It's high time we use our powers of observation to approach the great mysteries instead of telling eachother stories.

Not anytime soon, buddy.
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Old 04-10-2007, 02:47 AM   #32
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

Well you know what they say,

Not all muslims are terrorists but all terrorists are muslim.
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Old 04-10-2007, 03:08 AM   #33
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

You're country? I'm pretty sure the country you knew as Bosnia is gone. Muslims weren't even a majority in Bosnia were they? You're probably more Australian than Bosnian anyway. Either way, it's not like Bosnia is a typical example of Muslim culture and politics.

I'll ignore you putting words in my mouth claiming I think I'm better than Muslims and ****. Stop thinking I'm talking about you all the time. I'm talking about the majority of Muslims when I said we in the west have a higher standard of living. Thats fact buddy. Go to the mid-east and see for yourself.
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Old 04-10-2007, 03:10 AM   #34
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

Why the **** did you come into a "Who's a muslim'' thread anyway?

To piss people off, and then say OH I DON'T BELIEVE IN ANYTHING?

grow up you wanker.
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Old 04-10-2007, 03:12 AM   #35
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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Originally Posted by AtTheDriveIn


Reported :)

i took it down for a reason... but whatever free speech biyatch.

i'm angry at ****ing people who worhsip martyrs and build bombs in the name of religion. and you're trying to make it seem like thats a small minority of muslims. its not buddy. its a lot more than you want to admit.

islam sucks.

Last edited by final.wrath : 04-10-2007 at 03:16 AM.
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Old 04-10-2007, 03:17 AM   #36
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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Originally Posted by AtTheDriveIn
Why the **** did you come into a "Who's a muslim'' thread anyway?

To piss people off, and then say OH I DON'T BELIEVE IN ANYTHING?

grow up you wanker.

why.... is this a non-beleiver free zone? you sound like you're 14 by the way, are you?
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Old 04-10-2007, 03:29 AM   #37
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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Originally Posted by final.wrath
if your a black american Muslim... I don't really consider your religion to be the same as the Islam over there.

Most forms of Christianity have very little in common with the forms that were practiced in other times. Also, you rarely see the average Muslim in the Middle East. What good is that? You see some guy holding the Qur'an and calling for the head of the infidel. You're never going to see the family that has a small farm and does good deeds in their community? Why? Because 1) that doesn't promote the divide and conquer agenda 2) no one gives a crap.

Even I myself am often surprised and underestimate the people of the Middle East. I have a friend that is Muslim and I've basically tried using this same line on her ("Yes, but the Islam over there is different"), except she knows Muslims from Palestine and Saudi Arabia. I asked her if they hate Jews and stuff like that. "They all seem pretty normal to me?"

Another thing I find interesting is how many critics of Islam essentially take the wahhabi/salafi/Qutbist/"excommunicator" position when debating Muslims. They say the same thing that an extremist like bin Laden would say: "You're not a true Muslim."

Again, you're never going to see the average Muslim. You're only going to see the crowds at a Hezbollah or Hamas rally.

Images of Tehran, Iran you don't see every day

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First off most american muslims don't even speak let alone read arabic. You have to be able to read Arabic to read the true Kuran. I know there are English versions but its not the same thing. As person with some linguistic experience I'd say at least a third of the nuances and meanings are lost in translation with any language.

They're taught Arabic in their mosques. By the way, you realize that most versions of the Qur'an are approved by the Saudi Royal Courts, correct? A man (Rashad?) was killed by an extremist for removing a line from the Qur'an. (He also attempted to molest a girl. Founded his own version of Islam in Arizona. They're called "Submitters" or something like that.) So, do you really think the Islam in America is really that much different? Like the entire book is different?

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Another big difference is the environment. In the middle east and even now in Indonesia and other Muslim parts of the world Islamic leaders wield a lot of political power. The Sheiks and Imams hold as much authority as the government. We don't have any Sheiks or Imams over here, do we? We don't have any Sharia police running around making sure that all the women are nice and snug in their beekeeper uniforms do we?

"Iman" means "faith", "imam" means "man of faith", if I recall correctly. If you are the head of a mosque, you're an imam.

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And lastly... the culture in America, obviously, is much different than over there. Our people are generally more educated and have a higher standard of living.

So basically you're saying this is less of a religion issue and more of an education/cultural environment issue? A bit of a 180, but I applaud you anyways.

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Besides... black islam in america is what... 40 or 50 years old? And I mean its basically a protest religion to me. Throwing away the "white" Christianity and moving to Islam. During the racial tension in the 60's guys like Malcom X popped up and became popular mostly because of their racial politics... not their religious views. Without the civil rights movement (thats probably the wrong term here... MLK was a civil rights activist... but Malcom wasnt) we probably wouldn't even have Islam amoung african americans.

Black Islam? You mean Nation of Islam? Malcolm X converted from Nation of Islam to Sunni Islam after attending his first Hajj.

I think many blacks also like the fact that the Qur'an says that no man is superior to another man based on his the color of skin. The ancestors of blacks that were forced to convert to Christianity might find that appealing. Especially when some of the oppressors were using the Bible to defend slavery and segregation.

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I try not to judge anyone by what they believe. Especially if it gives them hope and happiness. So this is strictly a personal oppinion, but i think believing in magical prophets like Jesus and Mohammed is not very intelligent. Whats the difference between that and beleiving in Zeus or all of the ancient gods our ancestors beleived in? What makes your God the right one? The fact that your parents think so? Did you even choose to be a muslim? Did your parents give you the chance to make your own decision? I doubt it. Because thats not how religions work. Your parents and culture tell you what to beleive and 9/10 you follow that. Especially if your Muslim, because leaving that religion is pretty impossible in most parts of the world.

That seems to be the perspective shared by Oxford professor Richard Dawkins. I don't necessarily disagree. I forget the quote, but it's something like, "May the god of your choosing grant you peace." That's my outlook on things.

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In the end Christianity, Islam, Judaeism and whatever will fade away just like the old pagan religions have. Remembered only in history books or more likely stored in some virtual memory bank somewhere. Good riddance I say. It's high time we use our powers of observation to approach the great mysteries instead of telling eachother stories.

You know that sounds nice and all, but when you think about it.. have there ever been any great atheist/agnostic revolutions? I mean, when the down trodden poor stood up and fought a numerically superior force and defeated them? The mysticism of a greater calling in life can be empowering and lead you to accomplishing great things. Yes, it can also lead you to do bad things, too. But in my opinion, that's human nature to an extent.

Last edited by reppy : 04-10-2007 at 03:48 AM.
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Old 04-10-2007, 04:10 PM   #38
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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Originally Posted by reppy

I think many blacks also like the fact that the Qur'an says that no man is superior to another man based on his the color of skin. The ancestors of blacks that were forced to convert to Christianity might find that appealing. Especially when some of the oppressors were using the Bible to defend slavery and segregation.

That's almost comical, since more blacks in North Africa have been forced into Islam than American blacks forced into Christianity can even come close to and slavery is still taking place in some of these Qu'ran abiding, Islam majority countries.
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Old 04-10-2007, 06:01 PM   #39
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

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Originally Posted by Cavs Fan
That's almost comical, since more blacks in North Africa have been forced into Islam than American blacks forced into Christianity can even come close to and slavery is still taking place in some of these Qu'ran abiding, Islam majority countries.

I imagine they also have the added advantage of not having to cross the Atlantic Ocean in a boat to do so, huh?

At any rate, that doesn't change the reason why blacks in America converted to Islam. Islam forbids racial superiority and forcing your religion in someone. Just because people are doing it does not mean it is OK according to the Qur'an.
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Old 04-12-2007, 10:45 AM   #40
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Default Re: Who Is Muslim Here

most of my family is muslim but i wouldnt really call myself a muslim.i dont eat pork but then i dont go to a mosque and i dont know too much about it.
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