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Old 09-19-2015, 02:48 AM   #31
Bless Mathews
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1987_Lakers
It's a team game, but lets not ignore all the weapons Manning had with both the Colts & the Broncos, this guy had more weapons throughout his career than Marino ever had, Brady too. And are we going to ignore all the playoff failures? Yes, Manning at times didn't have the best team around him to win, but there are also a good chunk of times where he had championship caliber teams and he just blew it.

I've always switched back and forth when it came to Brady and Manning. From 2003-2007 I liked Brady, From 2008-2013 on some days I thought Manning was greater, but what has happened in the last couple of years leaves no doubt that Brady is greater. Manning's playoff performances with the Broncos really hasn't helped his case to avoid the "chokes in big games" talks while what Brady did last year in the Super Bowl was was legendary s.hit, the 4th quarter vs Seattle was one of the most badass/clutchest performances I have ever seen from a QB.

Actually last point sums it up.

Against the same defense, on the worlds biggest stage, the one with more weapons absolutely didn't do shit, and the other got it done in yes, painful as fucc to type for me, like a legend.

What the fucc did all those records and fancy stats mean manning got during that regular season after getting DESTROYED in the super bowl???

Not a got damn thing.

Last edited by Bless Mathews : 09-19-2015 at 02:57 AM.
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Old 09-19-2015, 09:07 AM   #32
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

It wasn't against the same defense. Cliff Avril got hurt early, tharold Simon couldn't defend anybody he was giving up uncontested catches all game. Earl Thomas was hurt in the conference title game and cause he's a tough SOB was playing in the super bowl with an injury that he had surgery for and missed all off-season, training camp and pre season with. No browner.


No Walter Thurmond who I believe was your nickle corner. No Clemons, Clint Macdonald or Malcom Smith.

Same defense though! **** outta here. I shouldn't have to correct you on your own team.
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Old 09-19-2015, 11:42 AM   #33
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by CelticBaller
They both average around the same Y/A And manning has had better receivers for most of his career

Try again
Exactly why I don't debate...There's no point in debating a guy with Tom Brady in his freaking avatar...Seriously, whats the point?

Regardless of WR talent, which Brady has had plenty of himself, he's still played in a system where he's surrounded with guys who fit the system.

I remember when Manning was playing with scrubs at WR also a few years before he was waived so lets not act like he's played with superstars his entire career....EVERYBODY who plays with Manning basically turns into a better player....He makes his team better, its that Lebron argument. His makes his average o-line look great with his quick decisions...I remember when Brady used to be able to literally stand in the pocket for what seemed like an eternity and find receivers.

I remember when Brady had an outstanding defense every year while the Colts were giving up 200 yards rushing to Eddie George in the playoffs, was that Manning's fault?

Brady drove his team down and team won with FG's, would Brady even have those rings without Adam V? Dudes acting like Brady drove his team down with some memorable drives and scored TD's or something...No, he got them close enough for his FG kicked to win the game...His drive against Seattle was outstanding, got to give him that.

I'm sorry, I agree with Carbine, when I watch week to week over their careers, I"m seeing Peyton doing more to help his team win. I was used to seeing the Colts HAVING to score 30 points to win because the defense couldn't stop anybody.

The playoffs crap is overblown too, always has been. Peyton's had some great playoff performances...Sure I think he should have a least 2 more rings but blaming him for losing to the Pats in freaking snow storms is ridiculous. Was it his fault that Mike Vanderjackass missed a FG against the Steelers? Adam V wouldn't have missed it and Tom had Adam then, Peyton didn't.

And don't get me started on the Pats controversies...I'm not gonna yell cheats because I'm sure that'll piss people off but they sure as hell skate the rules whenever they get a chance and thats also an advantage to Brady...

And up until recently, Brady hadn't won a ring in a WHILE, people were starting to say the same thing about him...

The biggest thing for me is Peyton taking his game to an entirely different team and quickly getting them to the superbowl and its clearly HIS system....Denver runs almost the same plays the Colts ran as far the receiver routes. He's had great success with 2 different teams, his way.

The Superbowl is one freaking game. Its not like a 7 game series in the NBA Finals where Jordan dominates and is clearly the GOAT.

Anything can happen in ONE game and in the NFL, and it obviously does. Rings should not hold the same weight in the NFL like they do in the NBA where you just ignore everything a guy's done in his career....When I think of QB's, I think of talent, intelligence, control of the offense, making shit wideouts look good(which both have done), and overcoming bad defense. Like Manning having to throw for like 500 yards just to still lose to KC.

Last edited by Dro : 09-19-2015 at 12:01 PM.
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Old 09-19-2015, 12:37 PM   #34
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
It wasn't against the same defense. Cliff Avril got hurt early, tharold Simon couldn't defend anybody he was giving up uncontested catches all game. Earl Thomas was hurt in the conference title game and cause he's a tough SOB was playing in the super bowl with an injury that he had surgery for and missed all off-season, training camp and pre season with. No browner.


No Walter Thurmond who I believe was your nickle corner. No Clemons, Clint Macdonald or Malcom Smith.

Same defense though! **** outta here. I shouldn't have to correct you on your own team.

Browner????

Manning went against him?

Come on lil carby.

The same defense that was number one across the board??!!!?!!!!!

Stop reaching lil niggah.

Those SLIGHT changes are worth 40 points?????????


Come on carby. Manning got DESTROYED and Brady pulled out a CLUTCH win.

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Old 09-19-2015, 12:48 PM   #35
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Dro
Exactly why I don't debate...There's no point in debating a guy with Tom Brady in his freaking avatar...Seriously, whats the point?

Regardless of WR talent, which Brady has had plenty of himself, he's still played in a system where he's surrounded with guys who fit the system.

I remember when Manning was playing with scrubs at WR also a few years before he was waived so lets not act like he's played with superstars his entire career....EVERYBODY who plays with Manning basically turns into a better player....He makes his team better, its that Lebron argument. His makes his average o-line look great with his quick decisions...I remember when Brady used to be able to literally stand in the pocket for what seemed like an eternity and find receivers.

I remember when Brady had an outstanding defense every year while the Colts were giving up 200 yards rushing to Eddie George in the playoffs, was that Manning's fault?

Brady drove his team down and team won with FG's, would Brady even have those rings without Adam V? Dudes acting like Brady drove his team down with some memorable drives and scored TD's or something...No, he got them close enough for his FG kicked to win the game...His drive against Seattle was outstanding, got to give him that.

I'm sorry, I agree with Carbine, when I watch week to week over their careers, I"m seeing Peyton doing more to help his team win. I was used to seeing the Colts HAVING to score 30 points to win because the defense couldn't stop anybody.

The playoffs crap is overblown too, always has been. Peyton's had some great playoff performances...Sure I think he should have a least 2 more rings but blaming him for losing to the Pats in freaking snow storms is ridiculous. Was it his fault that Mike Vanderjackass missed a FG against the Steelers? Adam V wouldn't have missed it and Tom had Adam then, Peyton didn't.

And don't get me started on the Pats controversies...I'm not gonna yell cheats because I'm sure that'll piss people off but they sure as hell skate the rules whenever they get a chance and thats also an advantage to Brady...

And up until recently, Brady hadn't won a ring in a WHILE, people were starting to say the same thing about him...

The biggest thing for me is Peyton taking his game to an entirely different team and quickly getting them to the superbowl and its clearly HIS system....Denver runs almost the same plays the Colts ran as far the receiver routes. He's had great success with 2 different teams, his way.

The Superbowl is one freaking game. Its not like a 7 game series in the NBA Finals where Jordan dominates and is clearly the GOAT.

Anything can happen in ONE game and in the NFL, and it obviously does. Rings should not hold the same weight in the NFL like they do in the NBA where you just ignore everything a guy's done in his career....When I think of QB's, I think of talent, intelligence, control of the offense, making shit wideouts look good(which both have done), and overcoming bad defense. Like Manning having to throw for like 500 yards just to still lose to KC.

I guess there are just stat whores and those that understand winning is the most important thing.

Even manning will tell you winning is most important

All this typing about his team failing him....

How many times did his TEAM get manning a number one or number two seed going into the playoffs, and how many first round losses did manning have with those top seeds????????

That's all you need to know and slays your argument.
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Old 09-19-2015, 12:55 PM   #36
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

I'm not reaching. That defense in the super bowl gave up uncontested catch after uncontested catch. Brady didn't have to be laser accurate to complete most of those passes. Gronk running straight by Wright on a go for a TD. Just roasted him.

It is what it is. Great defense doesn't always play great. Just like great offense doesn't always play great. In the Super Bowl the Seahawks pass defense was giving up uncontested catch after uncontested catch.

Brady was not perfect. He threw a redzone pick which is about as bad a thing as you can do as a QB. He got picked on another pass.

Peyton didn't even play THAT bad - his team just got destroyed. Special teams have up huge plays. Defense couldn't stop anyone. Center snapped the ball over his head for a safety. Peyotn had one bad pick. Probably a few inaccurate passes. The pick 6 his arm got hit. His left tackle got obliterated and gave up instant pressure. No run game to relieve some pressure. Not excuses just realty of the two games.

Like Dro said its pointless to argue. Ive already said Brady will end up the GOAT most likely. But as we stand today it's still a debate. I'm not saying anything earth shattering or bold. I'm sure te majority of true football people hold the same opinion. Flip a coin.
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:11 PM   #37
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

If stats were everything Dan Marino would have been considered greater than Montana during his day, but he isn't. At the end of the day no matter how much you try to argue it Tom Brady will be looked at as greater than P. Manning when both are retired.

When you look at it Brady already has a better resume than Montana, no doubt he will be considered the GOAT when its all set and done.
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:21 PM   #38
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
I'm not reaching. That defense in the super bowl gave up uncontested catch after uncontested catch. Brady didn't have to be laser accurate to complete most of those passes. Gronk running straight by Wright on a go for a TD. Just roasted him.

It is what it is. Great defense doesn't always play great. Just like great offense doesn't always play great. In the Super Bowl the Seahawks pass defense was giving up uncontested catch after uncontested catch.

Brady was not perfect. He threw a redzone pick which is about as bad a thing as you can do as a QB. He got picked on another pass.

Peyton didn't even play THAT bad - his team just got destroyed. Special teams have up huge plays. Defense couldn't stop anyone. Center snapped the ball over his head for a safety. Peyotn had one bad pick. Probably a few inaccurate passes. The pick 6 his arm got hit. His left tackle got obliterated and gave up instant pressure. No run game to relieve some pressure. Not excuses just realty of the two games.

Like Dro said its pointless to argue. Ive already said Brady will end up the GOAT most likely. But as we stand today it's still a debate. I'm not saying anything earth shattering or bold. I'm sure te majority of true football people hold the same opinion. Flip a coin.

We give teams the short passes.

Manning set super bowl record for most completions against us.



Manning beat Rex gross man for his only rang.

His team got him top 2 seed many times.

He failed in playoffs.

At the end of the day for me there is no debate.

When you typing about GOAT, you have to weigh winning more than stats.

This fantasy football world done made yall loose sight of the most important thing.
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:22 PM   #39
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Smook B
Where would you ranking these guys?

Brady
Manning
Montana
Elway
Marino
Untias

Is anybody going to answer my question?
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:31 PM   #40
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by 1987_Lakers
If stats were everything Dan Marino would have been considered greater than Montana during his day, but he isn't. At the end of the day no matter how much you try to argue it Tom Brady will be looked at as greater than P. Manning when both are retired.

When you look at it Brady already has a better resume than Montana, no doubt he will be considered the GOAT when its all set and done.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1987_Lakers
If stats were everything Dan Marino would have been considered greater than Montana during his day, but he isn't. At the end of the day no matter how much you try to argue it Tom Brady will be looked at as greater than P. Manning when both are retired.

When you look at it Brady already has a better resume than Montana, no doubt he will be considered the GOAT when its all set and done.

Actually Montana is more individally decorated.

5 time All Pro selection
2 MVPs
Multiple SB MVPS

Marino is a 6 time All Pro
1 MVP

Montana has a considerable advantage in passer rating. Marino has what.... 20000 more yards. 100 more touchdowns but he also had 3000 more passes.

Overall they're very even individually accolades and stats. Montana gets a huge whe for post season play and That's why he's considered clearly a greater QB.
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:54 PM   #41
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Smook B
Is anybody going to answer my question?

1. Montana
2. Brady
3. Elway
4. Manning
5. Marino
6. Unitas
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:56 PM   #42
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Carbine

Overall they're very even individually accolades and stats. Brady gets a huge whe for post season play and That's why he's considered clearly a greater QB than manning

There ya go lil niggah
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Old 09-19-2015, 01:57 PM   #43
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by 1987_Lakers
If stats were everything Dan Marino would have been considered greater than Montana during his day, but he isn't. At the end of the day no matter how much you try to argue it Tom Brady will be looked at as greater than P. Manning when both are retired.

When you look at it Brady already has a better resume than Montana, no doubt he will be considered the GOAT when its all set and done.

Brady's 2 cheating scandals, and Montana's perfect SB play will guarantee he won't.
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Old 09-19-2015, 02:09 PM   #44
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Bless Mathews
There ya go lil niggah

Peyton's individal accolades are on a different level (maybe two levels) than Brady. Not the same.
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Old 09-19-2015, 02:10 PM   #45
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Default Re: is there still doubt that Tom Brady is the GOAT footballer?

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Originally Posted by Dro
Exactly why I don't debate...There's no point in debating a guy with Tom Brady in his freaking avatar...Seriously, whats the point?

Regardless of WR talent, which Brady has had plenty of himself, he's still played in a system where he's surrounded with guys who fit the system.
what system are you even talking about? do you realize the 2003 patriots ,the 2007 and the 2011 patriots were all ran differently offensively?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dro
I remember when Manning was playing with scrubs at WR also a few years before he was waived so lets not act like he's played with superstars his entire career....EVERYBODY who plays with Manning basically turns into a better player....He makes his team better, its that Lebron argument. His makes his average o-line look great with his quick decisions...I remember when Brady used to be able to literally stand in the pocket for what seemed like an eternity and find receivers.
Could you name these scrub receivers he made so good? and the **** do you mean about his Oline, the early 2000 colt teams always had a beast O-line, and same with the 2013/2014 broncos

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dro
I remember when Brady had an outstanding defense every year while the Colts were giving up 200 yards rushing to Eddie George in the playoffs, was that Manning's fault?
so that span of 2010-13 when he had to carry a dead last defense to the playoffs didn't matter? when Julian Edelman played CB against the ravens in the AFC Conference game?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dro
Brady drove his team down and team won with FG's, would Brady even have those rings without Adam V? Dudes acting like Brady drove his team down with some memorable drives and scored TD's or something...No, he got them close enough for his FG kicked to win the game...His drive against Seattle was outstanding, got to give him that.
You do realize the only times Peyton got close to winning the SB he either screwed himself out of the game, or was blown out right? that the difference people usually point out, Brady doesn't let his team slip away that easily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dro
I'm sorry, I agree with Carbine, when I watch week to week over their careers, I"m seeing Peyton doing more to help his team win. I was used to seeing the Colts HAVING to score 30 points to win because the defense couldn't stop anybody.
lol ignoring the fact that the only team he won the superbowl with bailed him out cause he was playing horribly

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dro
The biggest thing for me is Peyton taking his game to an entirely different team and quickly getting them to the superbowl and its clearly HIS system....Denver runs almost the same plays the Colts ran as far the receiver routes. He's had great success with 2 different teams, his way.
so when Brady apparently plays 1 system that takes away from his game, but when the teams Peyton plays with adjust to his same system you account that to greatness?
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