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Old 12-15-2015, 04:58 PM   #31
oarabbus
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanners
QBR has both ryan fitzpatrick and tyrod taylor rated higher than cam newton for this season... so yeah no doubt its a great stat.

After this post, West-Side backtracks and says he wasn't talking about QBR


Quote:
Originally Posted by West-Side
I never once talked about the QBR, I could care less about this stat.
In fact, I enjoy putting context into every situation.

I'm not going to waste my time replying to prime-time, this guy only understands black & white.


Come on dude you made up an absurd, nonsensical scenario and got roasted in this thread.
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Old 12-16-2015, 09:47 AM   #32
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

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Originally Posted by West-Side
Not if it's a close game and you're trying to actually win the game.
Than your performance throughout the game matters.

I don't care about the QBR, I'm giving you a general overview of why clutch play is critical to evaluating QB's value.

It's not a matter of perception, it's a matter of reality.
If your QB (aka Manning) can rack up stats but fails to win big games, or has miscues in the 4th quarter; should you not penalize him for that?

Considering the QB is the single most important position on a team in late game situations.

oarabbus, I said this on the first page of this thread.
I wasn't even talking about the QBR and could care less about what it measures.

The only time I even bring up stats is when I'm proving a point, I tend to focus a lot more on context.

Back to my illustration;

QB A - 450 yards, 6 TDs, 1 INT & 80% completion
QB B - 450 yards, 6 TDs, 1 INT & 80% completion


QB A scores all six of his TDs in the 1st three quarter; the game is tied at 42-42. The team highly depends on him late in the 4th quarter down by 4 points, he ends up throwing an interception with 1 minute left in the game and the team losses the game.

QB B throws an interception in the 1st quarter, his team is down 42-35 to start the 4th. In the last 5 minutes, he leads his team to two scoring drives including a last second TD for the win.

Again, based on context, should the two QBs really have an identical QB rating?

You seem to emphasize that TEAMS win games, which is true. But just like a goaltender in hockey; or a pitcher in baseball; a QB is essential to success. Which is why ultimately they end up winning MVPs in the NFL.

That's all I was trying to say.
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Old 12-16-2015, 10:27 AM   #33
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

If the offense scored the exact same between QB A and QB B then it shouldn't matter WHEN they scored those TDs...1st quarter, 4th quarter, it doesn't matter. That's not even an opinion, it is a mathematical fact. Only simple minded tards would think 4th Q TDs are worth more than 1st Q TDs...they are literally worth the same.
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Old 12-16-2015, 10:38 AM   #34
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
If the offense scored the exact same between QB A and QB B then it shouldn't matter WHEN they scored those TDs...1st quarter, 4th quarter, it doesn't matter. That's not even an opinion, it is a mathematical fact. Only simple minded tards would think 4th Q TDs are worth more than 1st Q TDs...they are literally worth the same.

Typed like a true fantasy football stat ho.

Ever heard of pressure?

It's real.
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Old 12-16-2015, 10:52 AM   #35
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

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Originally Posted by ~primetime~
If the offense scored the exact same between QB A and QB B then it shouldn't matter WHEN they scored those TDs...1st quarter, 4th quarter, it doesn't matter. That's not even an opinion, it is a mathematical fact. Only simple minded tards would think 4th Q TDs are worth more than 1st Q TDs...they are literally worth the same.

There isn't a bigger idiot on this forum than you.

I give up.

If what you say is true, then Peyton Manning would have a shit load more success than Tom Brady. The difference? Is clutch play you shit for brains.

In fact, Manning has more impressive stats across the board.
In terms of value? Tom Brady and it's not close.

There's a reason people consider Joe Montana better than Dan Morino or Peyton Manning. It certainly isn't just "pure numbers".
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Old 12-16-2015, 10:57 AM   #36
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

So you have Eli ranked above Marino then?

Eli is so clutch in the 4th?!
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Old 12-16-2015, 10:59 AM   #37
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

West-Side and Bless...you guys should be huge fans of QBR...it puts all the emphasis on exactly what you are talking about.
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Old 12-16-2015, 11:06 AM   #38
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
West-Side and Bless...you guys should be huge fans of QBR...it puts all the emphasis on exactly what you are talking about.


There are definitely flaws. Games that make absolutely no sense.


But the cream usually rises to the top.
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Old 12-16-2015, 11:48 AM   #39
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

This is an older story, but it's ridiculous that they had such a huge rollout for this stat. The first thing you do when you develop a new index or metric is go back and apply it to historical data to make sure it makes sense.

They should have stopped the presses as soon as their #1 rating was a stinker from a backup QB.
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Old 12-16-2015, 11:53 AM   #40
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
So you have Eli ranked above Marino then?

Eli is so clutch in the 4th?!

Uhm no, you idiot.
If the stats are identical, clutch play determines who played better.

Which is my entire point.

Eli Manning's stats are no where near Marino's, so why would you say something so stupid???

You want me to break down your argument further?


Manning - 65.3 %, 71,871 yards, 539 TDs, 96.5 Rating, 271 YPG
Brady - 63.5 %, 57,396 yards, 425 TDs, 96.4 Rating, 258.5 YPG

99.9% of the world considers Tom Brady the better QB, most consider him the GOAT QB. But why? It looks like Manning has better numbers across the board on the surface.

It's because of PRESSURE & CLUTCH.
Brady has that ability and Manning doesn't, which goes back to my point precisely. Touchdowns aren't valued the same. Touchdowns scored under pressure to win games late in the game are far more valuable than non-pressure touchdowns early in the game. It's a simple concept really, I'm not sure why you brain can't comprehend that.

Further more, you said TEAMS win games. Okay, now let me break your theory down even further.

If TEAMS win games than why doesn't Manning have as many super-bowls as Brady? Despite him putting up better numbers.

Does it not directly have to do with the fact that Tom Brady is clutch as hell and is ice cold under pressure; while Peyton consistently makes key mistakes in pressure situations.

Like I said, if you analyze statistics only; Manning looks like the better QB, however, if you actually evaluate pressure & clutch ability, Tom Brady is clearly the superior player.

Now, my point comes full circle.

Even if;

QB A - 500 yards, 7 TDs & 2 INT
QB B - 450 yards, 6 TDs & 2 INT

I'd still think QB B should have a higher QB rating if he excelled in pressure situations and won the game for his team. While player A choked late in the game.

Last edited by West-Side : 12-16-2015 at 11:55 AM.
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Old 12-16-2015, 11:54 AM   #41
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
West-Side and Bless...you guys should be huge fans of QBR...it puts all the emphasis on exactly what you are talking about.

It clearly doesn't do a good job of it though.
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Old 12-16-2015, 12:32 PM   #42
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Using Brady vs Peyton is bad...it wasn't unanimous that Brady was over Peyton until the last couple years.

Using rings is also BAD...one of Brady's rings came on a tuck rule...another came on Pete Carroll's retarded play calling. Rings are won by teams and shouldn't be used as individual stats.
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Old 12-16-2015, 12:34 PM   #43
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by West-Side
Even if;

QB A - 500 yards, 7 TDs & 2 INT
QB B - 450 yards, 6 TDs & 2 INT

I'd still think QB B should have a higher QB rating if he excelled in pressure situations and won the game for his team. While player A choked late in the game.
lol, QB-A literally scored more points

you picked the QB who scored less points you dumb mfer

points are all that matters here...
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Old 12-16-2015, 01:10 PM   #44
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
lol, QB-A literally scored more points

you picked the QB who scored less points you dumb mfer

points are all that matters here...


That fantasy mindset


Points are in context doe.

You prolly think a garbage time td with a team down 30 is the same as a td by a qb last second two minute drill to win the game.
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Old 12-16-2015, 01:22 PM   #45
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Default Re: The Joke Of Total QBR Exposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~primetime~
lol, QB-A literally scored more points

you picked the QB who scored less points you dumb mfer

points are all that matters here...


You do realize that a player can win the week in fantasy points but still have a worse game than a player (in a similar position) who scored less points but accumulated stats during possessions that mattered most?

I see that you'll never understand that concept.

I'm wasting my time explaining this to you.
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