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Old 05-14-2007, 01:55 PM   #1
OneWay
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Default Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I don't get it. I really don't.
Some of you act like the Lakers need to add 3-4 more all stars and then maybe, just maybe, there's a slight bit of a chance they can compete for a ring.

I've read posts saying that Kobe and JO aren't enough but also need Artest and Bibby. I see trade ideas suggesting that we get both Kidd and JO. LOL.
Then there are folks thinking we need to add a star while keeping Odom and even then they don't feel sure because we'd still be weak at the PG etc.

I say, wake the **** up. We're much closer than that.

Granted, the Lakers suck badly and need just about every element there is in basketball starting from shotblocking to perimeter shooting and in that regard they need just as much as any team but they have Kobe...and Phil too.

I don't get it why it's so weird to expect that adding just Artest or just JO even if the price is Odom would make this team a contender.
Artest and JO were contenders together. AI was a contender alone.
Kobe is certainly capable to do much with less than most people have.
You think he needs all players that Nash has?
No, he does not. Which's not saying that he's better than Nash.

He just needs the different team DYNAMICS. It's all about that dynamics. Dynamics makes all the difference.
Dynamics is the reason why the Suns play so badly without Nash. Because they have no one to push the tempo and that's the way they play. That's the way Nash plays. Suns system is good for his strengths.

You think this team would suck the way they suck now if they had different dynamics? If they only had defense?
AI was a one man offense a few years ago and it worked.
No way do I want a one man offense here but since that's what've been the last 2 years why didn't we at least focus on defense? Instead of adding players like Radmanovic.

Improve the defense, allow 5-7 points less and this is a good team.

Change the dynamics off the defense from a one man team to at least a two man team and this is a very good team. I'm talking Utah-Houston kinda good.

While talent is the problem, you folks just imagine this same team with different players. You see JO who does the same thing that Odom does but only blocks a few more shots.
It isn't that way. He changes the dynamics of the team. They go from a terrible defensive team to perhaps even a great defensive team.
You add Artest, he also has the same impact on defense.

And this is already a better team.

I really don't see it. You folks think we need the world to become a contender. I don't think so. I'm sure Kobe doesn't think so.

As long as Kobe is on the team, the Lakers are competitive and close to being a contender.

First change the team dynamics and then fix what there is to fix.

But a team built around Kobe cannot be like a team built around Steve Nash.
This team must be tough and defensive minded. This team doesn't need that much talent but it needs some post game and defense whereas Nash's team just needs offensive talent at all positions.

I'm talking dynamics here. Besides the talent, dynamics is another thing that's wrong with the Lakers. Kobe is not Steve Nash.
But he's good enough to take a good defensive team far by himself.
And when that defensive team is good or even better than good and he has also offensive support...it can be deadly.

In conclusion, the Lakers are much more closer than you think but they do need major changes to get on that next level and change the dynamics but despite what you think, they don't need all the talent in the world.
They just need people who will change the dynamics of the game and put Kobe's strengths on display. 30 points look much more impressive in a win. Scoring 30 consistantly is easier and better for the team than going off for 60 because your team allowed 120. Dynamics folks. Kobe Bryant. This team has all the wrong dynamics.
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Old 05-14-2007, 02:24 PM   #2
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I think it's two fold there's been kind of a hysteria since the end of the season... because mitch once said we were one or two players away and with the back lash against management of late it adds up to the team needs lots of help... i myself feel there are a couple main pieces missing and then some role players needed to fill out the team... i also am a firm believer in the team will be better simply because of some players not returning...
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Old 05-14-2007, 02:29 PM   #3
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I do agree with your post.

but if we do make these trades, it involves most players with defensive struggles while we're getting back star defensive players.

then if we do get ROn and JO, we dont exactly need a PG that can score a lot.

just plays Defense.

Thats why I want steve blake on the team.
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Old 05-14-2007, 02:47 PM   #4
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I think the majority of people are on the same page. But given that for a star ie, Pau or JO or whoever is concerned, a bunch of players are probably on the out. Then when you have all these players on everyones mind, people just get a lil wacky.

If we did get Pau and Artest, would it be stupid to think that KG would opt out for our MLE? Oh probably, but its fun thinking about it...
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Old 05-14-2007, 05:41 PM   #5
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I agree with you man. Me personally I feel a Solid PG and a good inside presence could take us to the next level. But even if we get JO or KG, if we and dont play D we are not going anywhere. Read this interesting fact about the Lakers Defense last year.

Quote:
Here’s a tidbit for you. Out of the 82 regular season games LA played, our opponents scored 100 pts or higher in 49 of them. That means in terms of percentages that we gave up 100 pts or more nearly 60% of the time. 59.76 to be exact and out of that 59.76% or those 49 games that our opponents score 100 or more pts we lost 27 of them. Again looking at those 27 losses that equates to just over 55%. 55.10 to be exact in terms of percentages. Yes Kobe needs help however all the help in the world won’t help him if the team doesn’t play better defense. We know we can score…..(81pts in a game by yourself?) enough said. Can we stop the opponents from scoring is the real question. Until we began to do this we can continue to expect 1st round playoff eliminations season after season. We can also expect to lose Kobe after the next season or two if this trends keep up. Now that’s what Mitch, Phil, and Jerry Buss need to be focused on.
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Old 05-14-2007, 06:24 PM   #6
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Theres two sides to this

-Kobe doesn't need much by his side to make Lakers a contender. I laugh when I see people saying get Artest, Kidd, and JO and then we'll contend.

-This roster is full of trash players.

So as much as a JO would help us, we still need to get rid of players like Cook, Sasha, etc. This roster needs an overhaul but not one that brings in 4 all stars but one that changes the complexion of the team.
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Old 05-14-2007, 06:26 PM   #7
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
I do agree with your post.

but if we do make these trades, it involves most players with defensive struggles while we're getting back star defensive players.

then if we do get ROn and JO, we dont exactly need a PG that can score a lot.

just plays Defense.

Thats why I want steve blake on the team.

FOr the last time, Blake is not the answer. No defense, inconsistent shooting. We dont need a PG that excels in running the offense (would be nice to have) BUT we need perimeter shooting and defense...2 areas Blake does not excel at.
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Old 05-14-2007, 08:03 PM   #8
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

The Lakers are a little ways away. They need a starting PG and they have some real needs on the bench too. If you look at teams that have won championships in the past, they have had 2 solid all-stars. The Lakers have one. Odom is good but he isn't an all-star. Like someone said before about the bench, Sasha, Cook, Mckie, etc, etc they just aren't that deep. They have a few like Farmar, Evans, Bynum, but most teams that win a championship have 5 solid starters plus they go about 4 deep on the bench. So the Lakers are still another solid player and a few solid starters (including another all-star) away from being a contender. The teams that were listed previously were in the East and that was when the East was even weaker than it is now. No way AI leads Philly out of the East against this years Pistons, Cavs, Bulls, or even Heat. Also they lost in the finals anyway. Really this team has been together for a couple of seasons, which is long enough to show there just isn't enough talent there to be considered an elite team.
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Old 05-14-2007, 10:50 PM   #9
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

We have the best coach of all time and the best player on the planet.

Last year we were a Tim Thomas drug scandal away from making it to the 2nd round vs. a highly beatable team in the Clippers and a not a all impossible team to beat in the WCF in the Mavs since Kobe pretty much owned them in the reg season prior. We were closer than you think.

This year we declined a bit. Both injuries and young idiots. More young idiots and realizing Odom isn't the 2nd option we've been waiting for.

All we need is a solid post presence that demands a double team with a good feel for the game that can anchor the defense, a RELIABLE and heady point guard (my pick still Brevin Knight), and good solid veterans.

Sounds easy but as we keep saying, it all depends on Mitch as this will be our most important off season in a long, long, long time. But it can be done.
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Old 05-14-2007, 11:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

I think there is one element here that has not been discussed. The Lakers team last season had major character flaws. We all have talked about it and been frustrated over it. It has been multiple players that have contributed to this.

Unfortunately, we know about it, but we are not in the locker room to actually see who contributes to this dynamic. So, if the Lakers stayed the same, the dynamic would not change and they would NEVER get to elite status.

So, while I don't think we need a bazillion "all-star" caliber players to get to the next level, I do think it is important to find a way to break up the broken dynamic that this Laker team seems to foster in its current state. That could likely involve ejecting quite a few players, including Smush who is gone, and potentially Brian Cook among others.

I am not sure if I articulated this well, but I know what I mean!


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Old 05-14-2007, 11:15 PM   #11
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
I think there is one element here that has not been discussed. The Lakers team last season had major character flaws. We all have talked about it and been frustrated over it. It has been multiple players that have contributed to this.

Unfortunately, we know about it, but we are not in the locker room to actually see who contributes to this dynamic. So, if the Lakers stayed the same, the dynamic would not change and they would NEVER get to elite status.

So, while I don't think we need a bazillion "all-star" caliber players to get to the next level, I do think it is important to find a way to break up the broken dynamic that this Laker team seems to foster in its current state. That could likely involve ejecting quite a few players, including Smush who is gone, and potentially Brian Cook among others.

I am not sure if I articulated this well, but I know what I mean!




Cook and Sasha! And some may say VRad but I look forward to see how he does next season, well if he's still here. Kwame is a good defender, but no offense. And very small hands. Hope Milm return work out well, I wonder how much he will be getting paid. And a healthy Odom would be great, but I have my worries. Look forward in seeing the improvement of our young guys, Turiaf Bynum and Farmar. And I do hope we get Artest, better than Odom but near half the price. To have Odom and Artest dam.
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Old 05-15-2007, 12:36 AM   #12
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by hotsizzle
FOr the last time, Blake is not the answer. No defense, inconsistent shooting. We dont need a PG that excels in running the offense (would be nice to have) BUT we need perimeter shooting and defense...2 areas Blake does not excel at.

Dude....are you kidding me?

Blake is known because of his defense. He is a defensive minded guard.
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Old 05-15-2007, 01:50 AM   #13
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
Dude....are you kidding me?

Blake is known because of his defense. He is a defensive minded guard.


I have to admit your right. Near the end of the season we played Denver when they killed us 113 86 if If I can remember Blake shut Kobe down for a lenghty period.

I don't think he's actually KNOWN as a defender but from watching him, he can play D.

Although sizzle is right on one thing, this guy's shot is pure ugly. But can be streaky.
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Old 05-15-2007, 02:46 AM   #14
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

compete for a ring or win a ring. look at who wins rings and who competes for rings. big difference. Go all the way back to 1980 to now. Lakers, Spurs, Rockets, Celtics, Pistons, Bulls and the heat are the only teams to win titles over the last 27 years. Each of those teams that won have had at least 2 all stars and a solid starting five. Lakers need more help than JO or Gasol and Artest to win a championship, but they could compete for one.
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Old 05-15-2007, 02:57 AM   #15
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Default Re: Why do you folks think we're THAT far away, we need THAT much to compete etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakerfreak
then if we do get ROn and JO, we dont exactly need a PG that can score a lot.

just plays Defense.

Thats why I want steve blake on the team.

you just kobe, and JO to do most of the scoring and Ron takes away points from appoinents and can score when he wants

i dont think we need blake though b/c shammond can play good defense and farmar is the startin point so theres no need for blacke unless u trade shamm
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