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Old 07-06-2006, 08:32 PM   #61
Knoe Itawl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey Zaza

Can't we just enoy the fact that Wade played great in these Finals and Kobe played like a$$ in the 03 Finals.

Heh heh.

What annoys me is that stuff like the Pistons series and the Phoenix series gets swept under the rug by Bryant fans when all I use to hear was how Kobe would never blow a 3-1 lead in the playoffs and how he would never have a record approaching TMac's 1-19 and all of that. Now that it happened to Kobe it has to be qualified by team specifics when they wanted no part of that about TMac. Or how any other sg would have been crucified for those performances. Imagine if Wade played like that against the Pistons and then was the best player on a team that blew a 3-1 lead. You'd never hear the end of it about how Bryant would have faied better.

But then, they also try to minimize Wade's Finals performance and MVP. ISH would have had nothing but Kobe topics on the first two pages straight if Kobe had done it.
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:33 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by BFRESH44
Excellent points. I hate when peeps resort to hyptheticals that have no validation whatsoever.

exactly. all zo said was that kobe>wade. and then this place turned into hell with hypotheitcals
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:34 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Joey Zaza
Lets not pretend that Wade simply replaced Kobe and thus Wade's win is Kobe's defeat.

Different players, different series, different results...however, Shaq was better in the 2003 Finals, but Payton wasn't the starting pg, J.williams was. Between J.Will and Payton, the Heat were able to better control pick/rolls directed at Shaq.

Shaq was older, but did a much better job helping on the p/r.

Wade also played better than Kobe did in 2003 - in the Finals and against the Pistons.

I'm not sure that a healthy Malone wins a title in 2003 or that Wade in place of Kobe wins a title in 2003. I'm not sure that Kobe in place of Wade wins a title in 2006.

Different guys, different games.

Can't we just enoy the fact that Wade played great in these Finals and Kobe played like a$$ in the 03 Finals.


joey...2004 finals

different year...

malone made THAT MUCH of a difference. we were 18-3 before his injury in december. it went south from that point on...
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:36 PM   #64
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Well I guess that wade and his most pub got Alonzo saying that kobe>wade.

Alonzo hauling his butt to Miami instead of LA says a lot more. Both Alonzo and Payton had chance to go to lakers and get their ring with Bryant. They didn't.
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:38 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by jan803
joey...2004 finals

different year...

malone made THAT MUCH of a difference. we were 18-3 before his injury in december. it went south from that point on...

Malone wasn't going to make THE difference in that series. Shaq was shooting 60% and if LA had gone to him more and Kobe could have upped his game to like 28 on 47% shooting or better, LA could have had a chance. But that didn't happen.

The Pistons were a better team, and Malone wouldn't have changed a 4-1 (almost 4-0) throttling.
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:40 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by Knoe Itawl
Malone wasn't going to make THE difference in that series. Shaq was shooting 60% and if LA had gone to him more and Kobe could have upped his game to like 28 on 47% shooting or better, LA could have taken it. But that didn't happen.

The Pistons were a better team, and Malone wouldn't have changed a 4-1 (almost 4-0) throttling.

you just won't acknowledge what happened to the lakers back in december.

the team chemistry changed when malone wasn't on the floor.

sh*t, slava vs malone. give me a frinking break!
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:45 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knoe Itawl
Heh heh.

What annoys me is that stuff like the Pistons series and the Phoenix series gets swept under the rug by Bryant fans when all I use to hear was how Kobe would never blow a 3-1 lead in the playoffs and how he would never have a record approaching TMac's 1-19 and all of that. Now that it happened to Kobe it has to be qualified by team specifics when they wanted no part of that about TMac. Or how any other sg would have been crucified for those performances. Imagine if Wade played like that against the Pistons and then was the best player on a team that blew a 3-1 lead. You'd never hear the end of it about how Bryant would have faied better.

But then, they also try to minimize Wade's Finals performance and MVP. ISH would have had nothing but Kobe topics on the first two pages straight if Kobe had done it.

works both ways buddy.

ppl like you will disregard all the free throws called for wade while if it was kobe, you would be all over it. i could care less about those free throws, imo, wade attacked the basket more and thus was rewarded, im cool with that. but honestly, if it was kobe gettin all thos FT... if he would have gone 11/28 and had 40 somethin points...would you still be praising his game 5 performance

what if wade would have scored 81 points...i have yet to see you give kobe credit for that historical performnce.

what about takin lakers to 45 wins? i know you didnt expect them to go that far. and the 3-1 lead on the suns, i bet you would have never thought that would happen either.

theres more but those are on the top of my mind.

im not excusing all of kobe's failures. ppl have to fail in order to succeed. im aware of that but you on the other hand dont mention anything but kobe's failures. for instance, you talk like he was the main reason for lakers losing that series to the suns. yes, he should take alot of the blame for it since hes the leader but you yourself didnt expect lakers to get that far, they were young and inexperienced. take a look at the whole story bro.
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:51 PM   #68
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Difference to be noted.

2006 NBA Finals were single handedly turned around by Dwyane Wade. Shaq was damn near useless for half the series. Wade could have just shrugged off after the team was down 13 in game 3. And nobody would have blamed him. All the blame would have been on SHAQ. But Wade instead STEPPED UP and just took over the series. It wasn't just offense, he was snatching away big rebounds also.

Ship was sinking in Miami (around game 3) and Wade just took over. Ship was sinking for LA also against Phoenix and there Kobe abandoned ship in the 2nd half in a gutless cowardly fashion.

One guy stepped up even though he didn't have to. The other guy HAD to (with elimination at stake) and didn't.
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:55 PM   #69
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malone made THAT MUCH of a difference. we were 18-3 before his injury in december. it went south from that point on...

This is what makes me absolutely CRAZY about Kobe fans, they live in the "imagine if..." world. Its not good enough that Kobe is a great player who had a great season and has had a great career, its always ...imagine if....and then they keep going.

When they first put him on the All-Star team. Kobe is the youngest all-star ever in the history of the world...imagine if he was allowed to start, he would easily average...

Then when he and Shaq were winning and making All-NBA teams...it was imagine if Kobe didn't have to hold himself back to play with Shaq he could easily average....

Then when Shaq did leave and Kobe lost a bunch of games, its was "Imagine if Kobe actually had a team around him..."

Then when he scored 60points in 3 quarters...imagine if PJax let him play the fourth he could have easily had...

Imagine if Malone was healthy ,they would've won the title and Kobe would've finally been crowned as king of the universe

Lets stop imagining. Imagine if...Imagine if...Imagine if Kobe groupeis would live in the world with the rest of us. Imagine if their Kobe arguments didn;t always end with ..."but if only...then Kobe would have easily."
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Old 07-06-2006, 08:59 PM   #70
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Nice to hear Kobe receiving some praises around the league, I think if it was up to the players...Kobe would be the leagues MVP.
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Old 07-06-2006, 09:03 PM   #71
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Nice to hear Kobe receiving some praises around the league, I think if it was up to the players...Kobe would be the leagues MVP.

Then lakers should have no trouble signing big stars for cheap.
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Old 07-06-2006, 09:10 PM   #72
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Then lakers should have no trouble signing big stars for cheap.

money controls everything.
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Old 07-06-2006, 09:15 PM   #73
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Then lakers should have no trouble signing big stars for cheap.

What big stars can you sign for cheap?

40 year old Gary Payton, and Alonzo Mourning?
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Old 07-06-2006, 09:18 PM   #74
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I'm surprised that Zo said all of that... You'd think he'd give D. Wade most of the props... Was there any pushing or probing on the part of the interviewer to get Zo to mention Bryant?
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Old 07-06-2006, 09:21 PM   #75
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I think it's obvious to any real ball fan that Kobe is the best player in the league.
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