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Old 09-28-2017, 08:21 PM   #1
tpols
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Default Trumps tax reform plan

Cliffs:


(This is a fox news article btw)

Winners

Corporate tax rate down to 20% from 35%.
High income earners (repeal of estate tax and lower tax thresholds for big time investors)
Low income earners (caps on taxed amount)

Losers

Middle class in states that provide the most federal tax revenue (NY, Cali, northeast etc) through double down taxing, removal of state reductions.
National debt (you know the thing GOP is always crying about going up)



Trump is going around campaigning this bill as champion of the middle class.

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Old 09-28-2017, 08:50 PM   #2
bladefd
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Wasn't Trump saying he wants to bring down the national debt? Yet wants tax cuts at same time for those richest folks who don't need cuts, such as his billionaire buddies. I'm guessing he will try to pay for it with massive social program cuts to things like meal for school children and PBS while hiking up military spending at the same time. Trump suckers will buy it right away as they always do.
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:56 PM   #3
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

He's good at bankrupting things, no surprises here
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:59 PM   #4
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by bladefd
Wasn't Trump saying he wants to bring down the national debt? Yet wants tax cuts at same time for those richest folks who don't need cuts, such as his billionaire buddies. I'm guessing he will try to pay for it with massive social program cuts to things like meal for school children and PBS while hiking up military spending at the same time. Trump suckers will buy it right away as they always do.
Math. It's a thing.

The point of tax cuts is to stimulate growth. An extra 1% of growth is $1 trillion in new wealth. The taxes collected from that new $1 trillion of wealth is more than the cuts.
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:02 PM   #5
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by NumberSix
Math. It's a thing.

The point of tax cuts is to stimulate growth. An extra 1% of growth is $1 trillion in new wealth. The taxes collected from that new $1 trillion of wealth is more than the cuts.



What growth happened the last time taxes/regulations were cut?


Oh that's right...we sent the world economy into a tailspin.
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:02 PM   #6
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Winners: top 1%
Losers: everyone else
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:22 PM   #7
NumberSix
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by tpols


What growth happened the last time taxes/regulations were cut?
Well, the largest tax cut in recent history was in 1981. Let's just look at the facts.

In 1980, GDP growth was -0.04%. Taxes were cut in 1981. 1982 took at hit at -1.4%. 1983 growth exploded to 7.8%. The remaining 5 years of his presidency had an average growth rate of 4.2%. Those tax cuts worked out pretty fcking well.

Quote:
Oh that's right...we sent the world economy into a tailspin.
I don't know what this means. What crash are you talking about? When was there a crash because the government didn't collect enough taxes? How does that even cause a crash? It increases the debt. How would that cause a crash in the economy?

Last edited by NumberSix : 09-28-2017 at 09:25 PM.
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:25 PM   #8
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

I want him to bankrupt the nation. You're all a bunch of morons and we deserve it.

Go Clinton!
Go Bush!
Go Obama!
Go Trump!




Last edited by Orlando Magic : 09-28-2017 at 09:28 PM.
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:52 PM   #9
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by NumberSix
Well, the largest tax cut in recent history was in 1981. Let's just look at the facts.

In 1980, GDP growth was -0.04%. Taxes were cut in 1981. 1982 took at hit at -1.4%. 1983 growth exploded to 7.8%. The remaining 5 years of his presidency had an average growth rate of 4.2%. Those tax cuts worked out pretty fcking well.


I don't know what this means. What crash are you talking about? When was there a crash because the government didn't collect enough taxes? How does that even cause a crash? It increases the debt. How would that cause a crash in the economy?


You try too hard. Bush tax cuts. Your avy.
Coupled with Clinton's deregulation....culminating in '08.
Stop playing dumb.
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Old 09-28-2017, 09:55 PM   #10
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by NumberSix
Well, the largest tax cut in recent history was in 1981. Let's just look at the facts.

In 1980, GDP growth was -0.04%. Taxes were cut in 1981. 1982 took at hit at -1.4%. 1983 growth exploded to 7.8%. The remaining 5 years of his presidency had an average growth rate of 4.2%. Those tax cuts worked out pretty fcking well.
A few things:

A) 7.8% growth is an outlier caused mainly by the economy contracting. It's easier to grow percentage-wise from a smaller base and the economy hit a low in 1982. The Great Depression saw similar large spikes in GDP growth even as unemployment hovered around 15-20%. IIRC the unemployment rate only dipped under 6% in Reagan's last year in office.

B) Reagan and the Dem-controlled Congress spent like a drunken sailors and massively expanded the public sector. That's what led to the economic growth, not the tax cuts. Your own numbers prove it. All that economic growth yet the debt TRIPLED under Reagan. Without government spending the '80s economy would have looked like complete shit.
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Old 09-28-2017, 10:04 PM   #11
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

The estate tax is antiquated and accounts for hardly any tax revenue and the pool is shrinking so it's not worth the administrative costs to enforce. Plus, the OECD average is 15% with the median tax rate 7%.

The average OECD corporate tax rate is much lower as well. These have steadily declined across the world. The US is lagging behind.

Oh but wait, we only apply the "every single industrialized nation but the US" argument for healthcare.
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Old 09-28-2017, 10:09 PM   #12
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawker
The estate tax is antiquated and accounts for hardly any tax revenue and the pool is shrinking so it's not worth the administrative costs to enforce. Plus, the OECD average is 15% with the median tax rate 7%.

The average OECD corporate tax rate is much lower as well.

Oh but wait, we only apply the "every single industrialized nation but the US" argument for healthcare.


Corporations in other countries actually pay the tax rate poasted though (or at least much more than they do in the US).. Ironically a strictly enforced 20% tax rate would lead to companies paying EXTRA in taxes...lol. But they will still probably be allowed to abuse loopholes even at the 20% mark.
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Old 09-28-2017, 10:15 PM   #13
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by tpols
Corporations in other countries actually pay the tax rate poasted though (or at least much more than they do in the US).. Ironically a strictly enforced 20% tax rate would lead to companies paying EXTRA in taxes...lol. But they will still probably be allowed to abuse loopholes even at the 20% mark.

That's really not true. You're selecting applying a small base of companies (google, apple, exxon, GE etc.) and generalizing across the board.

I get what you're saying about corporations applying deductions but reducing the tax rate to begin with will help small business and allow business to start up much easier. This is how a job is created and I want it to be as easy as possible.

If you really do believe that, you'd be in favor of a low flat tax - ie 15%. That's what I want. Even lower than 15%.

We need to compete with other countries tax rates and lowering taxes does that. This would help the middle class.
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Old 09-28-2017, 10:26 PM   #14
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Cutting the corporate tax rate to help middle class families?
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Old 09-28-2017, 10:32 PM   #15
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Default Re: Trumps tax reform plan

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdreason
Cutting the corporate tax rate to help middle class families?

Do you understand how a job is created?
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