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Old 12-29-2017, 05:38 AM   #1
Im Still Ballin
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Question Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

It seems the most ****ed up people I know and have come across are all seeing shrinks and actively "seeking help" and "talking about their problems"

like tony soprano with his shrink

it only made him more of a criminal in the end, she was just spinning his wheels
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Old 12-29-2017, 07:00 AM   #2
Doomsday Dallas
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

idk... depends on the person you're talking to.

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Old 12-29-2017, 07:17 AM   #3
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

define worse
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Old 12-29-2017, 07:32 AM   #4
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddy
define worse


depends on who you trust also.

patriot act
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Old 12-29-2017, 11:34 AM   #5
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

Talking about it isn't bad. Talking about it is therapeutic. It's who you talk to and the advice they give that dictates the outcome
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Old 12-29-2017, 05:53 PM   #6
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

if you're aware that some particular personal problem area exists, then you're already "talking about it" silently. The only difference is the audibility of your words. You're thinking about it on the same terms, through the same frame, endlessly spinning and respinning the same sections of web because you aren't looking where you're going. So you get stuck in circles.

The beauty of talking about it is also a danger. The closer you get to exposing the roots to the light, the less comfortable becomes the warm bed of anxiety you've constructed at the surface. Uncomfortable possibilities poke through and disturb your familiar struggle.

Bring your mouth and ears into the play. You may as well. Your mouth can't keep up with your thoughts. Every consideration is forced to slow down and relax and breathe. You tire yourself out while you exercise the muscles of your focus. Speaking and listening simultaneously? That's a real workload.

Your ears can then provide a literal extra-sensory perspective, receiving only what you deemed appropriate to have been spoken, in contrast to the indiscriminate noise you have to hear the rest of the time. Listen to yourself consider, reason, and extract your worries into concrete verbal forms. The nature of your trouble becomes tangible, emphasized, and mounted on display, and so your own vantage point, your perspective, your place in the world at the core of the riddle is a little bit clearer. You look down, or back, in satisfaction.

Soon enough you reach a point of redundancy and fatigue running the same maze to your diminished amazement, and you're forced into a fresh approach, from the outside looking in, and then you can hardly believe anymore in the significance of that mess which once occupied so much of your mind. It looks small and silly and disastrous. That humiliation, of time and energy already wasted and irrecoverable has its own uses, namely preparing yourself to take advantage of what's still to come; but it's also yet another wormhole of its own and not very useful for the average workaday lifestyle.

But you won't be able to stop yourself from assembling some new structure, whatever you devise, now confidently astride a firmer foundation maintained by your prior resolution, but still unsound and wavering at the top. Keep building on that. Keep talking that through.



It's important to realize that vocalization isn't a solution in and of itself. It's just another tactic. Maybe it's true that tactics are the only solutions that are ever available, and the whole purpose of "getting by" is to discover and refine more and more of your tools lying latent in secret. I don't really believe that but it's a fancy thought to legitimize otherwise scary notions of risk, experiment, overcoming.

The pictorial aspect is another kind that's very different, maybe somehow opposite, but equally taxing. You have to start visualizing (body/head scanning), meditating, contemplating, and of course, always acting, or at least preparing for action. But for the neurotic type that plagues modern society, the wordless practise of spirituality gets easier after talking something through. The verbal process has exposed to the light all the dead-ends and detours and traps and tempting but false escape routes that are so ingrained into your instinct. Eventually, ideally anyway, you can access a sort of blueprint of your favourite anxiety outputs. You can't draw it but you can follow its rules confidently and without terribly hostile second thoughts.



That's all a matter of talking to yourself, which might well interest the OP if he's not already acquainted with the practise. It works just the way a scholar or mechanic talks his way through thorny and/or greasy problem to find a new level of analysis, and hopefully, a revelation of how to proceed further. If you are already so spiritually endowed with the magnificent spectacle of a selfless perspective, engaged and involved in the world at a large enough scale, it won't seem so useful... but try it and you might find still new heights.

As for talking TO people, as a means of therapy in the modern conventional sense, beware and be careful but certainly don't stop due to a single bad experience. You have to keep trying new people. Don't dwell with anger on the last guy that kept repeating the same shit. He's only saying what he saw work in the past. It might not be for you. Use everything at your disposal.

People who overseek council and come to enjoy recounting and recalculating their reservation and approach are also trapped. Though the cause and effect of the OP's formulation could also easily be reversed as is always the case.
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Old 12-29-2017, 05:58 PM   #7
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

I agree. You should just kill yourself instead, OP.
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Old 12-29-2017, 06:17 PM   #8
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

Marriage counseling works in a sense, not sure if this post is about that or just seeing shrinks solo. I have a friend who did pre-marriage counseling and it saved them from being broken up. They now have 2 kids and a normal family (from what I can tell). In a relationship/marriage, if a couple has problems being able to communicate and counseling will help them develop the skills to, then it definitely can help.
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Old 12-30-2017, 05:31 AM   #9
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RidonKs
if you're aware that some particular personal problem area exists, then you're already "talking about it" silently. The only difference is the audibility of your words. You're thinking about it on the same terms, through the same frame, endlessly spinning and respinning the same sections of web because you aren't looking where you're going. So you get stuck in circles.
....

People who overseek council and come to enjoy recounting and recalculating their reservation and approach are also trapped. Though the cause and effect of the OP's formulation could also easily be reversed as is always the case.
Where you got this from? Written a whole lot but not saying much... Resonates with the #2 post with Bill Burr.
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Old 12-30-2017, 10:36 AM   #10
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

depends on who. Both the talker and the listener, as to whether it will make a difference.

I'd say it's best to speak to someone who you are friends with, who has an actual sense of you, but also has an understanding of possible issues. They can then compare you/your problems with possible issues.

The problem with a shrink is incompetence (probably on both sides), the 'wall' that is between people in a professional setting trying to work out problems, and the lack of understanding that comes with words.

As said, it's better with someone you have known, who has seen you, if you express yourself to your psychiatrist, you are going to be guarded, if it's your long-term friend then you aren't. They have experience outside of that box.

Talking about it, in general, is helpful. Just putting your words down is helpful for awhile. That's why all of you dudes make long posts about your life on this forum haha. It feels good.

A lot of people cannot be rehabbed by 'talking about it', I'd say. They still probably enjoy emptying their tank once a week at the shrink. Or to a close friend. That's kinda what we do... we sit down, have a beer or coffee, and bitch about our problems, share our accomplishments. It's human nature. That's why I've always resented professionals. Even though they are supposed to have a more keen insight and be unbiased, it doesn't occur organically and it's also mostly one sided. I think healing comes from hearing other people's struggles/accomplishments as well.

People are better to understand than to diagnose. Some people have apparent issues, like you can look at them from afar and see they have a personality disorder, but even then... does that help them heal? If you say sir you have borderline personality disorder, these are your problems, this is how you can fix it, is that helpful? Is it more helpful than being like hey I love you, man, and I will always be there. I'll call you out on some bullshit if you pull some bullshit, but I'm not going to abandon you.

I think the root of most problems is believing you are not loved or lovable.

-Smak
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Old 12-30-2017, 11:19 AM   #11
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Default Re: Does anyone else also think "talking about it" only makes it worse?

People that need to work shit out by talking about it to others instead of resolving it in their mind on their own will always be nothing more than beta followers in this world that must always rely on alpha leaders to guide them.

Not everyone can be an alpha, which is understandable but let's just call it for what it is.
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