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Old 09-09-2018, 12:07 PM   #1
jongib369
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Default Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?



https://youtu.be/KHwOqPZSCnQ

This man is absolutely ridiculous, that finger roll jelly floater or w.e the hell you want to call it is a thing of beauty. But could they have fit together? I know Jordan didn't initially think too highly of him, nor want him on the team...But did that change over time?

Also for shits and giggles if you want to go further, if the Bull develop the same way with the only difference being Scottie Pippen not existing how do they do?

Last edited by jongib369 : 09-09-2018 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:27 PM   #2
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

Likely not because they did have one overtime game. I'd think prime Gervin could've tipped that game in favor of the Bulls.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:30 PM   #3
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Originally Posted by iamgine
Likely not because they did have one overtime game. I'd think prime Gervin could've tipped that game in favor of the Bulls.
Yeah I'd have to agree, I guess the better/more interesting question would of been would Jordan be as successful with Gervin instead of Pippen.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:40 PM   #4
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

If we think about how Jordan had won two threepeats with Pippen, it's hard to say he's likely to do that with anyone else. Even with people better than Pippen like Olajuwon or Shaq. There might be personality, ego, on court style clashes. And then there's injuries and the physical/mental toll of winning six championships.

I'd say Gervin has on court style and personality clash with MJ. It's not to say they wouldn't do as well, just unlikely.
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Old 09-09-2018, 01:51 PM   #5
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jongib369


https://youtu.be/KHwOqPZSCnQ

This man is absolutely ridiculous, that finger roll jelly floater or w.e the hell you want to call it is a thing of beauty. But could they have fit together? I know Jordan didn't initially think too highly of him, nor want him on the team...But did that change over time?

Also for shits and giggles if you want to go further, if the Bull develop the same way with the only difference being Scottie Pippen not existing how do they do?

The thing is, if the Bulls wanted to become somewhat less predictable, Gervin could have some bigger role in that series. Did the Bulls really have to play with a limited guard like Kyle Macy as a traditional PG starter instead of trying to use a Jordan-Gervin tandem for some time, with Jordan bringing down the ball, which is what they tried with Jordan in '89 anyways? As an alternative, couldn't they use Gervin a bit as a SF and give Woolridge some more rest (assuming he doesn't ever play PF)? His playing time was ridiculously low, and that's someone who averaged more than 20 ppg in the previous season.
Anyway, still I don't think they'd co-exist as well as Jordan-Pippen did. Gervin didn't really care much about defense, he was a much better scorer than passer/playmaker and, although Jordan was more versatile, I don't think he'd love to share the spotlight with another elite scorer who wasn't really great at something else. Pippen and later Rodman were the perfect teammates for him, the perfect dirty job-doers, who were not elite enough at scoring to steal much of Jordan's glory.
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Old 09-09-2018, 04:11 PM   #6
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

No. He would be turned into a spotup shooter.
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Old 09-09-2018, 05:13 PM   #7
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Old 09-09-2018, 05:14 PM   #8
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

Is this the Iceman with a coke habit ? If so the Bulls might get a game
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Old 09-09-2018, 10:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Old 09-09-2018, 10:35 PM   #10
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Originally Posted by jongib369
Yeah I'd have to agree, I guess the better/more interesting question would of been would Jordan be as successful with Gervin instead of Pippen.
I'll answer that for you with a question

Would the bulls have made the Finals in 1990 if they had 3rd year Gervin instead of 3rd year pippen?

3rd year Gervin ABA: 25/9/2 on 47%... the "Iceman"
3rd year Gervin NBA: 30/5/3 on 54%... the "Iceman"
3rd year Pippen NBA: 16/7/5 on 47%... the "Migraine"


Bro, pippen was a P-R-O-J-E-C-T... If MJ never built him, he'd never be mentioned..

considering the significant development that pippen needed, he's extremely lucky to land next to the best offensive and defensive player in the league as a rookie (dpoy and scoring champ MJ)
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Old 09-09-2018, 11:15 PM   #11
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Originally Posted by 3ball
I'll answer that for you with a question

Would the bulls have made the Finals in 1990 if they had 3rd year Gervin instead of 3rd year pippen?

3rd year Gervin ABA: 25/9/2 on 47%... the "Iceman"
3rd year Gervin NBA: 30/5/3 on 54%... the "Iceman"
3rd year Pippen NBA: 16/7/5 on 47%... the "Migraine"


Bro, pippen was a P-R-O-J-E-C-T... If MJ never built him, he'd never be mentioned..

considering the significant development that pippen needed, he's extremely lucky to land next to the best offensive and defensive player in the league as a rookie (dpoy and scoring champ MJ)

I only have one question then, who the hell built Giannis who has increased by 4-5ppg ever year of his career, even bigger progression than pippen. You make it seem like pippens progression was unprecedented when Giannis has done it even more drastically playing with no one.

When the hell did another player start getting more credit than yourself or your coach for your own development, itís comical.
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Old 09-09-2018, 11:41 PM   #12
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

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Originally Posted by NBAGOAT
I only have one question then, who the hell built Giannis who has increased by 4-5ppg ever year of his career, even bigger progression than pippen. You make it seem like pippens progression was unprecedented when Giannis has done it even more drastically playing with no one.

When the hell did another player start getting more credit than yourself or your coach for your own development, it’s comical.
Maybe I shouldn't have added that last part about project pippen

It allowed you to avoid the main point of this thread - the bulls' potential with a prime gervin.... and how they would've made the Finals easily in 1990 with Gervin, but missed it with pippen..

This demonstrates how much MJ was doing with very little - he took a dynasty 7 games with 16 ppg, migraine pippen, when MANY other 3rd year players would've helped him to the Finals, i.e. Dominique, Gervin, Worthy - basically anybody

Regarding Giannis - he's a more talented scorer than pippen WITHOUT mj, while pippen developed into a much more limited scorer WITH mj (only a 22 ppg peak in 94' as #1 option)... Sorry, but I don't think that playing with the goat scorer hurt pip's development as a scorer - so it's much more likely that he developed the limited scoring ability he had BECAUSE of mj.. he was lucky to have mj - he's simply no Giannis, offensively.. not close either
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Old 09-09-2018, 11:42 PM   #13
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

Replace Ordan with Paul George and they sweep the Celtics
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Old 09-10-2018, 12:24 AM   #14
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ball
Maybe I shouldn't have added that last part about project pippen

It allowed you to avoid the main point of this thread - the bulls' potential with a prime gervin.... and how they would've made the Finals easily in 1990 with Gervin, but missed it with pippen..

This demonstrates how much MJ was doing with very little - he took a dynasty 7 games with 16 ppg, migraine pippen, when MANY other 3rd year players would've helped him to the Finals, i.e. Dominique, Gervin, Worthy - basically anybody

Regarding Giannis - he's a more talented scorer than pippen WITHOUT mj, while pippen developed into a much more limited scorer WITH mj (only a 22 ppg peak in 94' as #1 option)... Sorry, but I don't think that playing with the goat scorer hurt pip's development as a scorer - so it's much more likely that he developed the limited scoring ability he had BECAUSE of mj.. he was lucky to have mj - he's simply no Giannis, offensively.. not close either

I’m not saying Jordan’s stunted pippens growth, however I do challenge how much credit you give mj to pippens growth. Giannis is strong example of developing without “mentorship” from another player.

Giannis even just 2 years ago was a 17ppg guy who couldn’t shoot. He developed greatly on his own, why couldn’t pippen being better by 91 which was only his 4th year be mostly due to his own hard work. Also ofc you only cared about the Gervinho topic when pippen came up

Last edited by NBAGOAT : 09-10-2018 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 09-10-2018, 12:33 AM   #15
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Default Re: Do the 85/86 Bulls get swept by the Celtics with prime George Gervin?


Last edited by 3ball : 09-10-2018 at 01:01 AM.
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