Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops

Go Back   Message Board Basketball Forum - InsideHoops > NBA Team Forums > Dallas Mavericks Forum

Dallas Mavericks Forum Dallas Mavericks message board - mavs message board - dallas mavericks fan forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-03-2006, 07:36 PM   #1
BBallBeatwriter
Decent playground baller
 
BBallBeatwriter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 181
BBallBeatwriter has no real reputation yet.
Default Turmoil In Big D?

TURMOIL IN BIG D?
The Dallas Mavs may have a problem.
Although summer league has gone quite well, as rookie guard Marcus Ager showed potential and third-string center DJ Mbenga showed an increased arsenal of post moves that included a baby-hook, it is the off-court decisions made during the Mavs off-season that has fans most concerned. Asides from the recent contract renegotiation spout between owner Mark Cuban and head coach Avery Johnson, (more on that next time)I question the motives behind the moves the team has made during the past few weeks. This raises a question: ďCan the Mavs still maintain their team identity and championship-level of play while losing two of its key pieces? The trading of locker-room favorite and wily veteran Darrell Armstrong, along with forwards Josh Powell and Rawle Marshall for Indian Pacers guard Anthony Johnson makes no sense from a personnel standpoint. Darrell Armstrong held the position of Locke room leader, team motivator, and even served as Avery Johnsonís second voice. He reiterated points of emphasis made by Mavs coaching staff during timeouts, and exuded his trademark veteran savvy on the floor when called upon for defensive purposes. Even Avery himself said ďin order to win a championship, every team needs a Darrell Armstrong.Ē In exchange they get Anthony Johnson, who even though is six years younger and two inches taller than Armstrong, isnít nearly the defender or leader Armstrong is. I understand the need to get younger in the backcourt, but if the Mavs were serious enough, they would have pursued guard Mike James more aggressively. James already possesses championship experience and defensive intensity, which perfectly fits the mold of an Avery Johnson-type player. This is such a key issue because with Adrian Griffin gone and Jerry Stackhouse more-than-likely coming off the bench, and newly-acquired Greg Buckner unlikely to start, the Mavs may have to use starting lineup that was so successful during their title run. This lineup puts Jason Terry at the off-guard, while Devin Harris is running the point. If this is the case, then where would the instant energy off the bench provided by Armstrong come from? Certainly not in the form of Anthony Johnson.

Another key piece gone from last seasonís title run is guard Adrian Griffin. Griffin, who was signed mid-season, was widely regarded as the teamís x-factor. The Mavs will sorely miss his seemingly relentless hustle and mid-range abilities. Griffin finished 11th in rebounding among shooting guards with 4.4 per contest, and tied for fifth in offensive boards among two-guards. His 1.9 offensive caroms led to countless second-chance points and he could hit the occasional open jumper when Dirk or Terry got double-teamed. In an effort to suppress the absence of Griffin, the Mavs signed veteran Greg Buckner. Maybe a sufficient off-guard, Buckner isnít nearly as serviceable as Griffin. He shot the ball almost 5 percent worse, averaged two fewer rebounds, and lacks the intense hustle that Griffin posses.

Another key issue yet to be addressed is a backup power forward. Last year saw Dirk Nowitzki play 38 minutes per game. And with Keith Van Horn and his enormous contract thrown out the window (about the only smart move Dallas made this off-season)
Who will back up the Big German to rest him for his trademark fourth-quarter takeovers? Certainly not Austin Croshere, a stand-still shooter with no athleticism. And now with the departure of Marshall and Powell the Mavs have absolutely NO true backup to Dirk. While they got rid of fan-favorite Marquis Daniels in exchange for Croshere, who will be their backup small forward? The Mavs had the chance to sign rookie free-agent Kevin Pittsnogle, who played for Dallas in the summer league, but are now looking at the prospect of signing another one-dimensional player: Deavin George. Although he can light it up from deep, he lacks the defensive prowess and athleticism that makes up this teamsí identity. So with all that said, MY BURING QUESTION FOR YOU GUYS IS CAN THE MAVS MAINTAIN THEIR IDENTITY, REPEAT AS WESTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPS, AND DO THEY HAVE AN EVEN BETTER SHOT AT WINNING THE TITLE? OR DID THEY JUST TAKE A STEP BACKWARDS?
BBallBeatwriter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 08:40 PM   #2
Silent Mav
Local High School Star
 
Silent Mav's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Old Folks Home
Posts: 1,639
Silent Mav has decent reputationSilent Mav has decent reputation
Default

I don't know who wrote that article, but there's not much that I agree with. It seems to be his opinion, which is fine. I'd like to know where he got the idea that most fans seem to be concerned about the moves. Sure there are differences of what they should have done. But most of the comments I've seen are favorable.

About the only part I agree with is Ager and MBenga in summer league. More on DJ later.

The contract deal between Cuban and Avery is way overblown. Cuban has responded to it as such. And has taken the writer who started that to task. It's nothing more than lack of news during the off-season

While DA was a great locker room guy, and will make a good coach someday. When he was on the floor he was a detriment offensively. Noone respected his shot and that allowed double teams or zones when he was in. Whatever hustle he had on defense was overshadowed by this. I wouldn't have minded seeing him back at all. But getting Johnson was an upgrade. Worth it for the youth and offense alone. Not a bad 3rd pg. And do you really think any moves are being made without Avery's approval? They gave James their best shot. From reports the clincher that got him was the trade kicker. If it meant that much to him to get that and not play with a team that went to the finals, oh well. Plus that would've made for a small backcourt.

Nothing is set in stone that Buckner isn't going to start at sg. I think there will be times that Devin and Jet are in the backcourt together. But nothing has been said about that being the starting guards. Griff was a great glue guy. But again, drew no respect on offense. He might have shot better than Buckner, but then Buckner shoots more and a lower percentage isn't that big a deal. With the Denver players in the post, he wouldn't have as much opportunity to rebound. Whereas in Dallas, when Dirk plays on the wing or high post. That left more opportunities for Griff to go in and get boards. Griff did bring intangibles, but I think some of the positive for Buckner offset that.

Croshere will be fine as a replacement for Van Horn. They really aren't that different as players. And MBenga could actually log some minutes at pf. Stack will come off the bench at sf. You can also use George there. Again, I don't think Avery would sign off on this if he didn't think George could follow his defensive plan.

When did Marquis become a huge fan favorite? And he was injured more than not. And when he wasn't, he was in Avery's doghouse and really didn't get much burn.

They kept their top 7 intact. And added Croshere, Johnson, George, and Ager. Also kept DJ in the fold. I really don't see a dropoff there. Yes, I do think they can maintain their identity. Have just as good a chance to be WC champs as they did last year. And they have as good as shot at the title as last year. Experience is a great teacher, for both players and coach. The west be tough again next year. But their chance is as good as anyone in the conference. They may have improved or stayed the same, but they didn't step backwards.

Last edited by Silent Mav : 08-03-2006 at 08:58 PM.
Silent Mav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 08:49 PM   #3
mavsfan4zindagi
Decent college freshman
 
mavsfan4zindagi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,656
mavsfan4zindagi has an OK reputation so far
Default

One of the worst things I've read in recent months. Let me tear it apart piece by piece.


Quote:
it is the off-court decisions made during the Mavs off-season that has fans most concerned.

What fans are you talking about? I haven't heard anyone around here "concerned" with what the Mavs are doing.

Quote:
Asides from the recent contract renegotiation spout between owner Mark Cuban and head coach Avery Johnson, (more on that next time)

Both Avery and Mark have both said publicaly that there was no problem what so ever with Avery's contract. Avery also said he plans to honor his contract and if there were an extention, the media wouldn't necessarily have to know about that.

Here's the proof:http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont....1c38e6a5.html

(Just saved you from writing more garbage "next time").

Quote:
I question the motives behind the moves the team has made during the past few weeks. This raises a question: “Can the Mavs still maintain their team identity and championship-level of play while losing two of its key pieces?

Why wouldn't they? They kept their top 7 intact and gave or will give extentions to their best 3 players. What makes you think they're about to lose their identity and are no longer capable of playing championship ball? 'Cause they lost Darrell Armstrong? Get outa here.

Quote:
The trading of locker-room favorite and wily veteran Darrell Armstrong, along with forwards Josh Powell and Rawle Marshall for Indian Pacers guard Anthony Johnson makes no sense from a personnel standpoint. Darrell Armstrong held the position of Locke room leader, team motivator, and even served as Avery Johnson’s second voice. He reiterated points of emphasis made by Mavs coaching staff during timeouts, and exuded his trademark veteran savvy on the floor when called upon for defensive purposes. Even Avery himself said “in order to win a championship, every team needs a Darrell Armstrong.”

True DA was a strong locker room presence and a good team leader, but you're frickin delusional if you think he was the difference to being a championship team. The guy played spordically and only came in to provide energy. His on-court impact(pretty important) was non existent.

Darrell Armstrong

Quote:
In exchange they get Anthony Johnson, who even though is six years younger and two inches taller than Armstrong, isn’t nearly the defender or leader Armstrong is.

Not only is Johnson the better defender, but he's the better player in general. DA was gonna be 38 once the season starts and he already showed that he couldn't be relyed on as a backup PG just in case Terry/Harris got hurt. With Quis gone, it became an even greater need to get a guy that could handle the ball.

Getting AJ for DA was probably the biggest steal of the offseason.

Quote:
I understand the need to get younger in the backcourt, but if the Mavs were serious enough, they would have pursued guard Mike James more aggressively. James already possesses championship experience and defensive intensity, which perfectly fits the mold of an Avery Johnson-type player.

Championship experience? As the 12th man that played about as much as Darko did in that series?

Sure James may have helped, but doesn't this contradict what you're arguing for? If you're so concerned with the Mavs losing their "identity" wouldn't Mike James be one of the last people you go after?

The guys a loose canon that could explode at anytime, yet we're suppose to go after him more aggresively because he has "championship" experience? Nice.


Quote:
This is such a key issue because with Adrian Griffin gone and Jerry Stackhouse more-than-likely coming off the bench, and newly-acquired Greg Buckner unlikely to start, the Mavs may have to use starting lineup that was so successful during their title run. This lineup puts Jason Terry at the off-guard, while Devin Harris is running the point. If this is the case, then where would the instant energy off the bench provided by Armstrong come from? Certainly not in the form of Anthony Johnson.

Avery has gone on record as saying he thinks Terry is the best PG on the team and that he'd really like to avoid having to play Harris at the SG position. So if we put two and two together, we get that Terry is the starting PG and Buckner is probably the starting 2 guard.

With this lineup, you get Harris and Stackhouse first off the bench to provide the energy.

Do you realise that Armstrong wasn't a focal point of this offense in anyway other then being a cheerleader? He may have provided some energy in a couple of regular season games, but when the playoffs came along, he was right where he should have been. On the bench, waving a towel.

Quote:
Another key piece gone from last season’s title run is guard Adrian Griffin. Griffin, who was signed mid-season, was widely regarded as the team’s x-factor.

X-factor? Did you actually watch the games before you came here spewing your bull****?

An X-factor has an BIG impact on the outcome of a game, someone along the lines of a Jason Terry or a Josh Howard. Someone that can actually have an impact at all.


Quote:
The Mavs will sorely miss his seemingly relentless hustle and mid-range abilities. Griffin finished 11th in rebounding among shooting guards with 4.4 per contest, and tied for fifth in offensive boards among two-guards. His 1.9 offensive caroms led to countless second-chance points and he could hit the occasional open jumper when Dirk or Terry got double-teamed.


So 2 offensive rebounds, coming out to a maximum of 6 points, led to counless second-chance points? How'd ya figure?

One of the biggest problems for the Mavs against the Heat was the inablity of the other guys hitting shots when Dirk/Terry got doubled. Griff was frequently left open because his jumpshot was one UNRELIABLE. Of course you'd need to have watched the games to notice this one.

Quote:
In an effort to suppress the absence of Griffin, the Mavs signed veteran Greg Buckner. Maybe a sufficient off-guard, Buckner isn’t nearly as serviceable as Griffin. He shot the ball almost 5 percent worse, averaged two fewer rebounds, and lacks the intense hustle that Griffin posses.

He shot the ball more, hence the lower percentage. He didn't play the same "dirty" guy that Griff did, hence the difference in boards.

Bucks been known for his defense and hustle. He was actually here in Dallas before and was pretty well liked because of his hustle.


Quote:
Another key issue yet to be addressed is a backup power forward. Last year saw Dirk Nowitzki play 38 minutes per game. And with Keith Van Horn and his enormous contract thrown out the window (about the only smart move Dallas made this off-season)
Who will back up the Big German to rest him for his trademark fourth-quarter takeovers?

If you hadn't noticed, teams tend to want their Superstars on the court for a good majority of the game. Usually gives the team a better chance to win. With Croshere/George/Howard/Pops all capable of playing the 4, there should be plenty of opportunity to drop Dirks PT a minute or two.

Quote:
Certainly not Austin Croshere, a stand-still shooter with no athleticism.

Easily an upgrade to KVH, especially in the athleticism department. Guy hits the boards well and should be an upgrade on the defensive end as well. Probably one of the better backup PF's in the league too.

Quote:
And now with the departure of Marshall and Powell the Mavs have absolutely NO true backup to Dirk.

Since when were either of these guys backups to Dirk? Marshall's a SF ffs.

Quote:
While they got rid of fan-favorite Marquis Daniels in exchange for Croshere, who will be their backup small forward?

Wow. Confirmed for me that I'm talking to some kid thats never seen a basketball game, much less a Maverick game in his life.


Quote:
The Mavs had the chance to sign rookie free-agent Kevin Pittsnogle, who played for Dallas in the summer league, but are now looking at the prospect of signing another one-dimensional player: Deavin George. Although he can light it up from deep, he lacks the defensive prowess and athleticism that makes up this teams’ identity.

Ahhh, the hypocrisy continues.


Quote:
So with all that said, MY BURING QUESTION FOR YOU GUYS IS CAN THE MAVS MAINTAIN THEIR IDENTITY, REPEAT AS WESTERN CONFERENCE CHAMPS, AND DO THEY HAVE AN EVEN BETTER SHOT AT WINNING THE TITLE? OR DID THEY JUST TAKE A STEP BACKWARDS?

Wasted 7 minutes of my life.

Last edited by mavsfan4zindagi : 08-03-2006 at 08:58 PM.
mavsfan4zindagi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 08:55 PM   #4
Silent Mav
Local High School Star
 
Silent Mav's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Old Folks Home
Posts: 1,639
Silent Mav has decent reputationSilent Mav has decent reputation
Default

Z
Silent Mav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 09:03 PM   #5
mavsfan4zindagi
Decent college freshman
 
mavsfan4zindagi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,656
mavsfan4zindagi has an OK reputation so far
Default



Nice work Silent. Can't let anyone come into our forum with that kinda crap.
mavsfan4zindagi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 09:17 PM   #6
lebron_zoom
Great young streetballer
 
lebron_zoom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: tiger airways
Posts: 428
lebron_zoom has an OK reputation so far
Default

if i was BBallBeatwriter the only thing he should be saying now is "touche"
lebron_zoom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 10:33 PM   #7
LiL Stevie
Decent college freshman
 
LiL Stevie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,897
LiL Stevie has decent reputation
Default yikes

As soon as I read "Marcus Ager" I knew I couldn't take this article seriously
LiL Stevie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2006, 10:54 PM   #8
MFFL
I airball my layups
 
MFFL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Big D, Texas
Posts: 53
MFFL has an OK reputation so far
Default

The Mavericks can't win for losing. I wish these folk just let the season speak for itself. Who died and left these people NBA psychics. Just shut the hell up and wait till the season starts.
MFFL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2006, 02:28 AM   #9
different107
National High School Star
 
different107's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: michigan
Posts: 1,637
different107 has decent reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Mav
Z

haha..amen to that
different107 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 01:51 AM   #10
Milkman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

HAHA straight garbage! well done Silent Mav, props
  Reply With Quote
This NBA Basketball News Website Sponsored by:
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:40 PM.




NBA Basketball Forum Key Links:
InsideHoops Home
NBA Rumors
Basketball Blog
NBA Daily Recaps
NBA Videos
Fantasy Basketball
NBA Mock Draft
NBA Free Agents
All-Star Weekend
---
High School Basketball
Streetball
---
InsideHoops Twitter
Search Our Site













Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Terms of Use/Service | Privacy Policy