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Old 07-04-2007, 02:54 PM   #31
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Elgin Baylor
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Old 07-04-2007, 02:57 PM   #32
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Karl Malone
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:00 PM   #33
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

I'll vote Elgin for the 3rd straight time.
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:02 PM   #34
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Something I said in an old topic on Bob and Hondo:


Quote:
How can you be as accomplished as say....Bob Pettit and not get mention in the GOAT discussions? Or win 8 titles 2 of them as best player(and all as a key player), have over 26 thousand points, and 14 all star games and only get mentioned when the issue is best white players? Hondo and Bob get overlooked to a degree im not sure anyone in major american sports can say.

Pettit has the longest section in the video because I feel hes the most underrated of the group.

Bill russell, Wilt, West, Oscar, and John Wooden will all put Bob in the top 3 to 10 players ever. He won a title with the Hawks vs the dynasty Celtics(they had injury problems but still....). He also lost to them in a couple 7th games.

I used to think he got overlooked due to era but Oscar, Russell, and Wilt get credit. He had the second best numbers of them, won more than Oscar, and arguably outplayed Russell head to head. He gave Russell 50 points including 19 of the last 21 to win the title.

Im not saying Bob should be ranked alongside Russell, Wilt, and Oscar in the GOAT convo....but they would.

Not like hes some Mikan type with a game that just looked like he ws made by his weak era. You watch this guy he looks almost like a 60s Dirk. 6'10'' and one of the best shooters in the league. Mobile. Fast. He looked like he might be able to do well today.

His accomplishments are second to no power forward. His numbers second to few players period(26/16 for his career). He played the likes of Russell, Oscar, and maybe even Wilt as an equal.

So why is it when the issue is best player or even best 4s hes either not mentioned or only given a passing "Oh and he was pretty good too...." mention?

Is there any case at all against this guy being top 10-15 all time if you think Oscar Robertson is? I really dont think so.

Russell once ranked Bob as the equal of anyone to ever play himself, Wilt, and Jordan included. There is really little reason for Oscar or Baylor or anyone from his era but Wilt and Russell to be ranked over him.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=otCNaMba0AI
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:07 PM   #35
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Bob Pettit

2-time MVP (1955-56 and 1958-59)
5 times was selected within the top 3 for MVP
8 times was selected within the top 5 for MVP

An All-Star selection every season of his career
An All-NBA 1st Team selection every season of his career, except for his last season when he was on the 2nd Team

Played in the same era as Wilt Chamberlain, Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Bill Sharman, Sam Jones, John Havlicek, Oscar Robertson, Jerry Lucas, Jerry West, Elgin Baylor, Dolph Schayes, Paul Arizin and Hal Greer.

Was the best player on the 1958 NBA Champions St. Louis Hawks, which was one of only two teams to defeat the Russell-led Celtics dynasty.

Led the Hawks to the NBA Finals 4 times, including 1957 and 1960--losing to the Celtics in 7 games each time. And, Pettit's Hawks beat the West and Baylor-led Lakers in 1961 to reach the Finals.

Pettit had many great performances in big games, inlcuding 50 points in game 6 of the 1958 Finals to help the Hawks win the title.

He averaged 26.4 PPG and 16.2 RPG for his career.

He's one of only 4 players (I think) to average 20 points and 20 rebounds for an entire season (27.9 PPG and 20.3 RPG in 1960-61).
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:18 PM   #36
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

put me down for karl
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:22 PM   #37
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

George Mikan
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:27 PM   #38
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

This was tough to decide but I'd have to side with George Mikan.
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:28 PM   #39
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Lot of guys I cant see why Karl would ever be listed over. Bob is one. Hondo another. People put so much weight on winning yet an 8 time champ who led his team to 2 of them without Russell and led a 68 win team and has a rep as one of the most clutch players ever gets put behind Malone? Hondo was a 29/9/8 player in his prime. A finals MVP. 8 time all D player. About 11 all NBA teams. Maybe 12. 13 time all star. And even before his prime...in the last 2 title runs with Russell? He put up 25/10/6 in the 69 title run. 26/9/8 in the 68 title run. So he wasnt just some coattail rider. And he wasnt some old timer who couldnt do it in a respected era. He was an all star the season before Larry Bird was a Celtic. Had Bird left school when drafted he and Hondo would have been teammates.

Hondo won more than Karl, accomplished more, and had numbers to stack up to a lot of these guys up in the top 10-15. Malone included. Malone has a point total. I dont think he had a better career.

Hondo, Bob, Baylor, and Isiah Thomas all belong over Malone to me. He just didnt impress me all that much. I wouldnt say hes clearly a top 3 player at the 4 in the last 20 years. By accomplishments he is. But as an effective individual player? All at the tops of their games he wouldnt be #1 or #2 on a list with Duncan, Barkley, KG, Dirk, and Mchale if im picking a guy for my team.

Last edited by Kblaze8855 : 07-04-2007 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:29 PM   #40
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kblaze8855
Lot of guys I cant see why Karl would ever be listed over. Bob is one. Hondo another. People put so much weight on winning yet an 8 time champ who led his team to 2 of them without Russell and led a 68 win team and has a rep as one of the most clutch players ever gets put behind Malone? Hondo was a 29/9/8 player in his prime. A finals MVP. 8 time all D player. About 11 all NBA teams. Maybe 12. 13 time all star. And even before his prime...in the last 2 title runs with Russell? He put up 25/10/6 in the 69 title run. 26/9/8 in the 68 title run. So he wasnt just some coattail rider. And he wasnt some old timer who couldnt do it in a respected era. He was an all star the season before Larry Bird was a Celtic. Had Bird left school when drafted he and Hondo would have been teammates.

Hondo won more than Karl, accomplished more, and had numbers to stack up to a lot of these guys up in the top 10-15. Malone included. Malone has a point total. I dont think he had a better career.
if you were starting a franchise who would you take?
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:30 PM   #41
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Bob Pettit
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:49 PM   #42
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Quote:
Originally Posted by -primetime-
if you were starting a franchise who would you take?
That's the most flawed reasoning when ranking all-time players. If you went by that, then there's no reason Magic & Bird are that high. Big men would always be taken first.
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:50 PM   #43
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Quote:
Originally Posted by -primetime-
if you were starting a franchise who would you take?


Hondo
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:51 PM   #44
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Elgin Baylor.
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Old 07-04-2007, 03:52 PM   #45
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Default Re: Official #14 NBA Player Of All Time According To ISH

Damn Elgin or Pettit - Pettit or Elgin.


I'd have to give it to Baylor.
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