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Old 12-12-2007, 12:00 PM   #16
jamal99
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Nobody mentioned Nikola Pekovic in their list? Why?
Igor Rakocevic?
Tadija Dragicevic from Red Star is young but in top 5 in ULEB Cup.
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Old 12-12-2007, 01:46 PM   #17
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamal99
Nobody mentioned Nikola Pekovic in their list? Why?
Igor Rakocevic?
Tadija Dragicevic from Red Star is young but in top 5 in ULEB Cup.

I mentioned both as candidates for my 10th spot. And also said that I was being homer taking Gasol
I don't see any of them above the 10th though. Rako can not be today above Macijauskas (same work, much better performance by Arvydas). And I want to see if Pekovic can sustain his performance and lead his team to the top16. Anyway, I would not mind putting him at the end of the list, really. I'm really surprise with the kid.
On the other hand, I haven't seen Dragicevic (it seems ULEB Cup is not shown in Spain or at least I haven't found it), so I can not judge him.
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Old 12-12-2007, 03:53 PM   #18
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

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Originally Posted by la bomba
1st of all I am not new to euroleague or Uleb!!I have been following european basketball well before the ULEB was conceived!Secondly you are obviously the one that doesn't have a clue,you can't even make a top ten list and when you do you mention an american and a brazilian out of three.
Thirdly DKV JOventud currently lead the ACB(the fact that they are not in the Euroleague means jack****!)Are Brose basketball club,roanne,prokom,zalgiris,virtus,milano,partizan ,aris better than DKV?chances are they are not.CSKA players?you said rudy shouldn't count cause he is injured?He has missed 3 or 4 games,half the cska team is injured!Papaloukas,smodis and savrasenko.So the only europeans left are Zisis,Pashutin(who rarely plays) and siskauskas,plus a host of russian players like vorontsevich who don't feature much.
I mean really you have done justice to your name.

It's great your a new fan of european basketball but when you make statements like Dkv Joventut leads the ACB when they didn't win the preseason tournament and don't include that they haven't played the better ACB teams yet, Dkv Joventut is a better team than Zalgris or Aris, playing euroleague doesn't mean jack and Tiago Splitter and Trajen Langdon are not european players even if they play in the europe and Tiago Splitter has spanish citizenship and Trajen Langdon has russian citizenship since both leagues have quotas against foreigners. If you wanted european players born in europe ask specifically for european players born in europe. It's one thing to have an opinion but if you act like a european basketball expert you should have a clue of what you're writing about because right now you look foolish. Lastly, at least spell Dkv Joventut correctly if they're your favorite team.

Last edited by b.jerk : 12-12-2007 at 04:00 PM.
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Old 12-12-2007, 07:59 PM   #19
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Ok but when you think of Europeans dont you think of people born IN Europe? Take an example of Ronaldinho. Everyone knows he's Brazilian, but he has dual citizenship, his native Brazil and Spain so FC Barcelona wouldn't go over the foreigners limit so they gave him a Spanish passport. Does that make him European? Didn't think so. He still plays fro Brazil, just like Tiago Splitter. About Langdon, russian isn't really European, and he's not good enough to be on either the russian team or USA. But I'm still curious to your list b.jerk. If your gonna take all of those players off, then let's see a list.

Last edited by simasu01 : 12-12-2007 at 08:01 PM.
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Old 12-12-2007, 08:55 PM   #20
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

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Originally Posted by b.jerk
It's great your a new fan of european basketball but when you make statements like Dkv Joventut leads the ACB when they didn't win the preseason tournament and don't include that they haven't played the better ACB teams yet, Dkv Joventut is a better team than Zalgris or Aris, playing euroleague doesn't mean jack and Tiago Splitter and Trajen Langdon are not european players even if they play in the europe and Tiago Splitter has spanish citizenship and Trajen Langdon has russian citizenship since both leagues have quotas against foreigners. If you wanted european players born in europe ask specifically for european players born in europe. It's one thing to have an opinion but if you act like a european basketball expert you should have a clue of what you're writing about because right now you look foolish. Lastly, at least spell Dkv Joventut correctly if they're your favorite team.
1st of all I don't know what your problem is with my opinion and why you think I am a new fan.Then the citizenship thing is ludicrous!Langdon is a yank and splitter is brazilian!Shammond williams plays for georgia cause he has somehow a georgian passport!but he is a yank!I did not categorically say that DKV joventut(right spelling,as you are so hot in spellings its trajan not trajen,thought I'd mention it)are better than those teams,I questioned whether those teams mentioned are any better than them.They do lead the ACB!its not an opinion its a fact!what pre-season tournaments are you on about?do you think anyone cares about pre season??I still consider Barca as a big club,Joventut beat them by 21.I also think Akasvayu are a strong side,Joventut beat them by 19.As for thinking I am a dkv fan,well that shows how little you know about euorpean basketball and in particular spanish basketball.With a nic like La Bomba it would be obvious I support another team to most fans.The thread was about top ten european(yes we all know what we mean by european,no splitter is not european!)not in the nba.so make a list and show us your expertise or don't bother commenting in this thread.I have been following european cup basketball for a couple of decades,since meneghin,berkowitz,corbalan,epi,sibilio,chomicious ,kurtinaitis,tarakanov fernando martin gallis fassoulas yannakis christodoulou volkov tkshenko sabonis kukoc radja savic riva premier brunamonti romay itturiaga dacoury ostrowski jamchy obradovic petrovic etc etc
Personally I think you are making a better job than I am at making yourself look foolish.

Last edited by la bomba : 12-12-2007 at 09:09 PM.
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Old 12-12-2007, 09:01 PM   #21
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamal99
Nobody mentioned Nikola Pekovic in their list? Why?
Igor Rakocevic?
Tadija Dragicevic from Red Star is young but in top 5 in ULEB Cup.
Pekovic has been fantastic .thats what the thread is for discussion,put down a list.when making a list you are always going to miss some.I mean from my list according to the jerk there is only 1 he would have so it shows that there is a lot of quality,having said that we are all still waiting for the jerk's list.
I think Rakocevic is one of those players that can either blow you away or be blown away.He has a lot of bad games,Like Berraco says I think Macijauskas is better.still he is a legitimate top tenner.
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Old 12-12-2007, 10:58 PM   #22
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by la bomba
1st of all I don't know what your problem is with my opinion and why you think I am a new fan.Then the citizenship thing is ludicrous!Langdon is a yank and splitter is brazilian!Shammond williams plays for georgia cause he has somehow a georgian passport!but he is a yank!I did not categorically say that DKV joventut(right spelling,as you are so hot in spellings its trajan not trajen,thought I'd mention it)are better than those teams,I questioned whether those teams mentioned are any better than them.They do lead the ACB!its not an opinion its a fact!what pre-season tournaments are you on about?do you think anyone cares about pre season??I still consider Barca as a big club,Joventut beat them by 21.I also think Akasvayu are a strong side,Joventut beat them by 19.As for thinking I am a dkv fan,well that shows how little you know about euorpean basketball and in particular spanish basketball.With a nic like La Bomba it would be obvious I support another team to most fans.The thread was about top ten european(yes we all know what we mean by european,no splitter is not european!)not in the nba.so make a list and show us your expertise or don't bother commenting in this thread.I have been following european cup basketball for a couple of decades,since meneghin,berkowitz,corbalan,epi,sibilio,chomicious ,kurtinaitis,tarakanov fernando martin gallis fassoulas yannakis christodoulou volkov tkshenko sabonis kukoc radja savic riva premier brunamonti romay itturiaga dacoury ostrowski jamchy obradovic petrovic etc etc
Personally I think you are making a better job than I am at making yourself look foolish.

Rudy Fernandez is a nice player and DKV Joventut is a nice team but they didn't win the supercopa, they haven't played a euroleague team in the ACB season and DKV Joventut isn't expected to beat those euroleague teams in the acb. If you want to familiarize yourself with the supercopa and it's mvp here's a link.
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Old 12-13-2007, 03:44 AM   #23
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Well, DKV didn't played the Supercopa because the hosting city team has to play (this year was Iurbentia Bilbao). However they did the merits to do it, after being semifinalist in ACB last year. They also did enough to be playing Euroleague, but Unicaja filled the last spanish spot because they reach the Final Four although they had an average domestic season (just earned the last playoff seed).
This year they have a better team than last season. They have already blown out Barça (which is an Euroleague team). And for me they are very close to the level of Real Madrid and Tau and a bit above over Unicaja (today). I don't know if you watched the semifinal against Real Madrid last playoffs, but DKV were really close to win it (3-2, Real Madrid won their three games by 4 points or less). And they have one of the players with more potential in Europe in Ricky Rubio.

Regarding the naturalized players, I don't consider them european unless they can apply for the national team and I think the rules say Tiago can not since he already played for Brazil. And for Trajan Langdon I think it is the same, I think he won a U-18 or U-20 WC with the US, so maybe he can not play (BTW I think he still doesn't have the russian passport, but he was gonna apply for it). Anyway, I don't see Splitter in the top ten. He is improving and will be a great player but he is still not at the level of many others (e.g. Pekovic is showing a lot more than him). He hasn't shown to be the dominant player he should be.

Last edited by berraco : 12-13-2007 at 04:02 AM.
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Old 12-13-2007, 06:59 AM   #24
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by berraco
Well, DKV didn't played the Supercopa because the hosting city team has to play (this year was Iurbentia Bilbao). However they did the merits to do it, after being semifinalist in ACB last year. They also did enough to be playing Euroleague, but Unicaja filled the last spanish spot because they reach the Final Four although they had an average domestic season (just earned the last playoff seed).
This year they have a better team than last season. They have already blown out Barça (which is an Euroleague team). And for me they are very close to the level of Real Madrid and Tau and a bit above over Unicaja (today). I don't know if you watched the semifinal against Real Madrid last playoffs, but DKV were really close to win it (3-2, Real Madrid won their three games by 4 points or less). And they have one of the players with more potential in Europe in Ricky Rubio.

Regarding the naturalized players, I don't consider them european unless they can apply for the national team and I think the rules say Tiago can not since he already played for Brazil. And for Trajan Langdon I think it is the same, I think he won a U-18 or U-20 WC with the US, so maybe he can not play (BTW I think he still doesn't have the russian passport, but he was gonna apply for it). Anyway, I don't see Splitter in the top ten. He is improving and will be a great player but he is still not at the level of many others (e.g. Pekovic is showing a lot more than him). He hasn't shown to be the dominant player he should be.

No offense to DKV Joventut but they are a nice team that has played an easy schedule, they haven't played CSKA or Olympiacos twice and there's a reason Tau Ceramica is a heavy favorite over DKV Joventut. Nicola Pekovic is a nice player but Partizan is playing in group C, the weakest group in the euroleague and Nicola Pekovic isn't likely to lead Partizan to the next stage. The Tau Ceramica and Olympiacos was the meanest and most physical match of the year, including the nba and Tiago Splitter was defended by as many as four player at once that are big even for the nba. Despite all the schemes of Olympiacos, Tiago Splitter still dished out the pain and still had crucial rebounds, assists and points to win the game. Your assertion of Tiago Splitter being soft or "not as dominate as he should be" is wrong, right now he's arguably one of the most physical and dominate basketball players in the world. He's Cassio Splitter's son and he's not going have an issue with physical play or hurting someone in the euroleague or the nba, his father probably already taught him how to better than any other player in the nba and he's more than big enough to do some serious harm. Without him Tau Ceramica wouldn't of won the supercopa and probably wouldn't even qualify for the second stage. He's being compared to Arvydas Sabonis before Arvydas Sabonis played in the nba and when he was actually good. Any reasonable or knowledgeable fan would understand that Rudy Fernandez and Nicola Pekovic are not even close to the talent of Tiago Splitter and would view him as one of the ten best players playing in europe.
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Old 12-13-2007, 08:21 AM   #25
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by b.jerk
No offense to DKV Joventut but they are a nice team that has played an easy schedule, they haven't played CSKA or Olympiacos twice and there's a reason Tau Ceramica is a heavy favorite over DKV Joventut. Nicola Pekovic is a nice player but Partizan is playing in group C, the weakest group in the euroleague and Nicola Pekovic isn't likely to lead Partizan to the next stage. The Tau Ceramica and Olympiacos was the meanest and most physical match of the year, including the nba and Tiago Splitter was defended by as many as four player at once that are big even for the nba. Despite all the schemes of Olympiacos, Tiago Splitter still dished out the pain and still had crucial rebounds, assists and points to win the game. Your assertion of Tiago Splitter being soft or "not as dominate as he should be" is wrong, right now he's arguably one of the most physical and dominate basketball players in the world. He's Cassio Splitter's son and he's not going have an issue with physical play or hurting someone in the euroleague or the nba, his father probably already taught him how to better than any other player in the nba and he's more than big enough to do some serious harm. Without him Tau Ceramica wouldn't of won the supercopa and probably wouldn't even qualify for the second stage. He's being compared to Arvydas Sabonis before Arvydas Sabonis played in the nba and when he was actually good. Any reasonable or knowledgeable fan would understand that Rudy Fernandez and Nicola Pekovic are not even close to the talent of Tiago Splitter and would view him as one of the ten best players playing in europe.
still no list.made a fool of yourself again when you said joventut had not beaten a euroleague team even though I told you they'd blown barca away,you obviously don't read the responses.Berraco has explained really well why DKV aren't in the euroleague.and as for DKV not playing the supercopa,so what,had they played it they would have had as good a chance as TAU,barca or Iurbentia.No one is saying that tiago splitter isn't good,its just that this list I was after(as I started the thread) Was about european players!!not south american players.I don't know if group C is the weakest. Madrid,barca,pana,ulker,partizan, it seems to me like a tough group,having said that all 3 groups are fairly balanced.If you are a half decent side going through to the last 16 isn't too hard.
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Old 12-13-2007, 12:41 PM   #26
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by la bomba
still no list.made a fool of yourself again when you said joventut had not beaten a euroleague team even though I told you they'd blown barca away,you obviously don't read the responses.Berraco has explained really well why DKV aren't in the euroleague.and as for DKV not playing the supercopa,so what,had they played it they would have had as good a chance as TAU,barca or Iurbentia.No one is saying that tiago splitter isn't good,its just that this list I was after(as I started the thread) Was about european players!!not south american players.I don't know if group C is the weakest. Madrid,barca,pana,ulker,partizan, it seems to me like a tough group,having said that all 3 groups are fairly balanced.If you are a half decent side going through to the last 16 isn't too hard.

Sorry but I'm not arrogant enough to make a list of the ten best europeans before the second stage. The euroleague is more like major league baseball than the nba because a lot of the best players play for the same team and it's hard to tell who's the best until the later stages of better competition. I might write something foolish like Rudy Fernandez is the best european born player or Danilo Gallinari is the tenth best european born player or DKV Joventut is more than a nice little team. Both are good nice young players but they're not the best european born players.
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Old 12-13-2007, 03:22 PM   #27
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

I thank god you come here to enlighten us. I would wait 4 months to make the list of current best players. Yeah, that makes sense.
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Old 12-13-2007, 03:53 PM   #28
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamal99
Nobody mentioned Nikola Pekovic in their list? Why?
Igor Rakocevic?
Tadija Dragicevic from Red Star is young but in top 5 in ULEB Cup.
yeah celebrate serbia & montenegro



marcus brown was superior today. 7/9 i believe from three point line and absolute abusing of his talent on the court. at one moment the lead was 37 (virtus bolognia @ kauno zalgiris)
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Old 12-13-2007, 04:43 PM   #29
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

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Originally Posted by berraco
I thank god you come here to enlighten us. I would wait 4 months to make the list of current best players. Yeah, that makes sense.

Sorry I'm honest I can't, La Bomba tried and looked silly. European leagues like the euroleague is in transition to becoming as good as the nba and because of that the league unlike the nba in most aspects of it's game is undefined and unpredictable.
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Old 12-13-2007, 07:05 PM   #30
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Default Re: top ten european players not in the nba.

Quote:
Originally Posted by b.jerk
Sorry I'm honest I can't, La Bomba tried and looked silly. European leagues like the euroleague is in transition to becoming as good as the nba and because of that the league unlike the nba in most aspects of it's game is undefined and unpredictable.
I don't see how I can look silly by making a top ten list of current players that are in form.anyway just piss off from this thread and do us all a favour by stopping to make a fool of yourself.This is not a thread about DKV Joventut,whether they are a nice team a good team or a bad team is irrelevant.we are talking about the players.The list was for people to discuss,no one is going to have the same list,even I could make a different list,it is not arrogance to make a list of what you think are 10 top players.
Anyway I saw barca play partizan and Pekovic didn't have a good game.Still definately a player to watch.Jerk i am sorry but I am tired of your insults,so unless you put down a list(which you won't cause you can't think of one as it is incredibly arrogant!)or discuss players I will not reply to anymore of your nonsensical replies.all the best
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