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Old 01-15-2008, 04:50 PM   #1
MJ(Mean John)
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Default Kobe taking too many shots?

Is it just me or has Kobe been shooting a lot more lately? Is this team looking a lot like last year? If your answers are "YES" then we have something in common. First of all I hate when Kobe starts the game shooting every shot.For what? We have a team that plays well, when they play together.
Anyone can argue that guys like lamar,luke,turiaf, kwame etc aren't playing as well as they can be and kobe is the only one who can playiing very well.

But let me ask this. Is it fair? Really I see that no laker outside kobe can get into a comfortable rythm. How has lamar been playing lately? Farmar? Fish? Luke? Kobe?. Maybe I am blind but I just feel like when farmar, Fish, lamar shoot it comes when no one creates for them or they get the ball in an uncomfortable spot where they can not be productive.

Correct me if I am Incorrect(please)

When someone is not being involved within the offense, wont it take away from that players all around play?(Mainly defense)


For example.
lets say lamar takes a shot in the start of the game. Thats fine. He doesnt take another until the 6 minute mark, then takes another at the end of the first. So how can lamar get into a rythm is he isnt getting a chance to get hott. That is for everybody else. Last night kobe took 44 shots. The lakers took 102. That means he took nearly 44% of the time.

I saw a play where kobe had 3 defenders around him and Fish was wide open and kobe still took the shot. Kobe is the best in the NBA. But I feel he should get everybody invloved.
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Old 01-15-2008, 05:51 PM   #2
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Yeah, it was commented on in the gamethread last night. I call it "Kobe Ball." I don't like it at all. I actually turned off the game last night. If the Lakers play Kobe Ball, you can say goodbye to any real competitive chances in the playoffs.

I *hate* Kobe Ball and I don't care how many points he scores.

Basketball is a team sport and when everyone is involved, the game flows and the team flows with it, both offensively and defensively.



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Old 01-15-2008, 06:52 PM   #3
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Its in Kobes nature to shoot first. You cant change that. He is not and never will be a pass first type of player. In Kobe's head, he is thinking with Bynum down, I have to pick up the slack. Kobes been shooting a litle more but ouside of last night, his shots are down. I dont expect him to shoot 44 times a night but with Bynum down, his shot attempts will go up.

Yea they are looking like last yrs squad because without bynum, they are essentially the same team as last year. Fact is, this team without Bynum cannot win consistently. Argue all you want but they are are a .500 team at best without Bynums play. He is why they are having the success they are having. Unfortunately, this injury is a long one and players are going to have to pick up the slack. Expect Kobe to be shooting more and expect more losses.

I think lamar struggles the most to get into an offensive rhythm. Once he bricks a few shots, he becomes much too passive and starts taking long jumpshots. When in rhythm, hes driving to the lane and getting in the paint. Key is to get him involved early. Have a few set plays for him to start out the game. This is how we should start every game and every half. Lamar needs to get going early. Fish is essentially a spot up shooter, im not too worried about him. Farmar has the ability to create his own shots and gets into rhythm rather quickly. My only issue is with lamar. KOBE GIVE HIM THE BALL.
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatetimthomas
Yea they are looking like last yrs squad because without bynum, they are essentially the same team as last year. Fact is, this team without Bynum cannot win consistently. Argue all you want but they are are a .500 team at best without Bynums play. He is why they are having the success they are having. Unfortunately, this injury is a long one and players are going to have to pick up the slack. Expect Kobe to be shooting more and expect more losses.

I agree with that statement.


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Old 01-15-2008, 08:03 PM   #5
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ(Mean John)
Is it just me or has Kobe been shooting a lot more lately? Is this team looking a lot like last year? If your answers are "YES" then we have something in common. First of all I hate when Kobe starts the game shooting every shot.For what? We have a team that plays well, when they play together.
Anyone can argue that guys like lamar,luke,turiaf, kwame etc aren't playing as well as they can be and kobe is the only one who can playiing very well.

But let me ask this. Is it fair? Really I see that no laker outside kobe can get into a comfortable rythm. How has lamar been playing lately? Farmar? Fish? Luke? Kobe?. Maybe I am blind but I just feel like when farmar, Fish, lamar shoot it comes when no one creates for them or they get the ball in an uncomfortable spot where they can not be productive.

Correct me if I am Incorrect(please)

When someone is not being involved within the offense, wont it take away from that players all around play?(Mainly defense)


For example.
lets say lamar takes a shot in the start of the game. Thats fine. He doesnt take another until the 6 minute mark, then takes another at the end of the first. So how can lamar get into a rythm is he isnt getting a chance to get hott. That is for everybody else. Last night kobe took 44 shots. The lakers took 102. That means he took nearly 44% of the time.

I saw a play where kobe had 3 defenders around him and Fish was wide open and kobe still took the shot. Kobe is the best in the NBA. But I feel he should get everybody invloved.

Even if Lamar was shooting more, is that his role? He misses open layups, and easy % shots..Lamar is more of a distributer not a shooter. Yes he can get in the lane and put a few in, and nail a few open jump shots but other then that he isnt a spot up shooter. Given the ball and an open look half the time if not more hed give the ball to someone with a worse look at the basket and a lower % shot.

I do agree with you to a certain degree, but can you tell me who would have combined for 48 points instead of Kobe last night? The lakers are dealing with injuries, PJ decided to have KB 24 do what he does best...SCORE...

He took alot of shots, but who won the game, who would you rather have shoot the last shot kobe or lamar, or farmar? Ill take kobe

Although, I do think they need to pass the ball around more like they were doing with bynum on the floor, get people open looks kobe draws double and tripple teams so people are open...fisher needs to shoot more hes a great ball shooter and get other teammates involved...

The lakers are playing like last year..kobe can outscore an opposing team in a half, but this is a team sport not individual so a bit of kobe scoring 20-30 points and getting people involved, i think they will have no problem winning, unless kwame keeps missing 1 foot shoots...dooooiiing!
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Old 01-15-2008, 08:05 PM   #6
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
Yeah, it was commented on in the gamethread last night. I call it "Kobe Ball." I don't like it at all. I actually turned off the game last night. If the Lakers play Kobe Ball, you can say goodbye to any real competitive chances in the playoffs.

I *hate* Kobe Ball and I don't care how many points he scores.

Basketball is a team sport and when everyone is involved, the game flows and the team flows with it, both offensively and defensively.




The chicago bulls that won 6 championships were playing Jordan ball...
Yes other people scored but when the clock is ticking down in the 4th and your down...who you want shooting kobe or kwame brown missing open layups?
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Old 01-15-2008, 08:31 PM   #7
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by driecken
The chicago bulls that won 6 championships were playing Jordan ball...
Yes other people scored but when the clock is ticking down in the 4th and your down...who you want shooting kobe or kwame brown missing open layups?

Different time, different era.


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Old 01-15-2008, 08:51 PM   #8
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
Different time, different era.



Its the same game, different team, same coach, different players..

And it worked
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Old 01-15-2008, 10:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by driecken
Its the same game, different team, same coach, different players..

And it worked

I could not disagree with you more. It is a different league, different rules, different time, the CBA, different coach (much older with different staff) and different players. There is NO blueprint or recipe here that you are trying to imply.

I do NOT want Kobe jacking up shots, and if it continues, the Lakers WILL lose and I simply will not watch that style of basketball.

Lakers > Kobe.... I am sorry but Team Ball wins championships moreso than ever in this era of basketball. The Lakers have proved it up to this point of the seaon. I dont want a repeat of the last few seasons. Its unwatchable and a losing proposition.



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Old 01-15-2008, 11:08 PM   #10
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
I could not disagree with you more. It is a different league, different rules, different time, the CBA, different coach (much older with different staff) and different players. There is NO blueprint or recipe here that you are trying to imply.

I do NOT want Kobe jacking up shots, and if it continues, the Lakers WILL lose and I simply will not watch that style of basketball.

Lakers > Kobe.... I am sorry but Team Ball wins championships moreso than ever in this era of basketball. The Lakers have proved it up to this point of the seaon. I dont want a repeat of the last few seasons. Its unwatchable and a losing proposition.




EXACTLY.
Honestly, when the lakers start playing or should I say, when kobe starts playing kobe ball, it bothers me. The game gets boring because all that happens is kobe starts playing no D(1). Kobes man starts scoring(2) Our team is out of it, so they dont play defense well(3) Kobe starts shooting even more(4) then it becomes a game of trading buckets with the other team and kobe.

driecken,
Bro are you serious? this was your original question

"He took alot of shots, but who won the game, who would you rather have shoot the last shot kobe or lamar, or farmar? Ill take kobe"

Ok, that arguement is weak here. No where in my post did I say I wanted lamar taking the last shot over kobe.(only guy I would be comfortable taking the last shot not named kobe is fish)
There is nobody in the league that I would rather have take that shot. As a matter of fact only guy in history that I would take is mr. 23, himself.(MJ)

What Im saying is that I am fine with Kobe taking the last shot. Even with him taking 20-30 shots. But 44? c'mon man. Im saying whats wrong with giving the ball out a little bit.

We should start by getting Lamar invloved early. Give him some early buckets. Then go with lamar playmaking and getting kwame invloved. Then luke, and all of a sudden our inside game is on and then that leaves fish open for a few open 3's. Then we give the ball to kobe to do his thing for a few minutes so we can mix it up.(While everyone is trying to score is when kobe brings his defensive side) That way everyone is in the funk and we can get the 2nd unit in when the other team is down. That is all I'm asking for. I hate it when kobe shoots every dang shot
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Old 01-15-2008, 11:18 PM   #11
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

On the final play of regulation last night, in a tie game... i would have loved to see them run something through Kobe for for D Fish.

With 3 guys all over Kobe you gotta think Fish would have got a good look.
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Old 01-16-2008, 05:47 PM   #12
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

The problem isn't with Kobe taking too many shots, its Kobe ball hogging and not making any effort to run the offense that is the real problem.

When he turns into "The Kobe Show" as I like to call it he is usually the first to touch the ball then he either 1. runs the clock down to under 10 seconds then forces a shot or 2. in that rare occasion he actaully passes early in the clock he demands it right back.

The other problem with not running the offense is that it hurts our offensive rebounding as the first pass hasn't happened and everyone can't move off of the pass. You end up having 4 guys stand around watching Kobe. If the ball doesn't move its hard to keep moving. And without movement, your rebounding suffers.

For those arguing about Kobe vs MJ three things:

1. In his prime MJ shot over 50% from the field and Kobe shoots a career 45.2% with a career best of 46.9% So at least when MJ was jacking up a ton of shots he shot a good percentage. MJ was just a better shooter than Kobe.
2. MJ ran the offense keeping his teammates involved. and
3. In MJ's era the guards where actually allowed to play defense and in the lane more contact was allowed. If Kobe and MJ switched eras, Kobe would be less productive and MJ more productive. Its definately tough to compare the different Eras but its hard to agrue the different defenses that were allowed. When MJ started his career they allowed a defender to keep a hand on you with your elbow locked, then in the middle of his career they changed to you can only put your forarm on the guy, and now you cant touch the guy outside the key. That is a HUGE difference.
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Old 01-16-2008, 05:53 PM   #13
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalMike
Yeah, it was commented on in the gamethread last night. I call it "Kobe Ball." I don't like it at all. I actually turned off the game last night. If the Lakers play Kobe Ball, you can say goodbye to any real competitive chances in the playoffs.

I *hate* Kobe Ball and I don't care how many points he scores.

Basketball is a team sport and when everyone is involved, the game flows and the team flows with it, both offensively and defensively.





Excellent post couldn’t have been said any better. Agree 100% especially the bold part and the Lakers>Kobe from the other post we need to keep playing team ball and I hope Kobe can stick to the way we have been playing let the game come to him not force the game

Last edited by schyza : 01-16-2008 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 01-18-2008, 09:18 AM   #14
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Default Re: Kobe taking too many shots?

I hope you all watch the game last night that if Kobe did not take the shoots, our chance of winning the game is pretty slim. Kobe was trying to defer to his teammates all game long as no one step up. Watch Kwame and Odom shooting point blank shot and miss the rim is pretty brutal. Until they gey Bynum back and have some inside game and can go inside-outside, I thnik the best chance for winning is still Kobe ball.
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