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Old 02-20-2008, 07:32 PM   #31
TheGame414
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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You guys are acting like he's was paying his players or something!
You don't think he wasn't?

Are you willing to bet your life on that?

That's besides the point, though, since those aren't current allegations. I don't care if it's "just freaking phone calls." And by the way, it isn't. It was a pattern of reckless disregard for NCAA rules, being a repeat offender and lying to investigators that killed him. It isn't the crime, it's the cover-up.

Even if it was "just freaking phone calls," they weren't legal. If you don't like the rules, don't play the game. If you want to try to change the rules, great. Go for it. But as long as the rules are what they are, there are consequences when you break them. He knew the consequences BECAUSE HE ALREADY GOT CAUGHT MAKING 577 ILLEGAL PHONE CALLS AT OKLAHOMA. And he showed total arrogance and disregard for the NCAA by doing the exact same thing again.

Make whatever criticism you want of the NCAA; I'll probably agree with some of it. But I didn't decide to take a multi-million dollar job at one of their institutions. If I did, I would agree to play by their rules.

And rules about phone calls...I don't see how you can argue with that. Allowing coaches to contact recruits as often as they want and whenever they want not only would be hell for the recruits, it would create an inequality in recruiting. If you completely open the floodgates on phone calls, the walls will tumble down on how much you can visit a kid and when, etc, etc. There have to be guidelines and limitations in recruiting, or else it will be totally lawless.

So it's not "just freaking phone calls." And even if it was, bringing up examples of something worse you can do doesn't mean what he DID do is wrong. That's like saying a guy who commits simple assault shouldn't go to jail since there's murderers out there.

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Besides, I bet Indiana will probably cave in, fire him, and bring in a coach with class who will finish at the bottom of the Big 12.
They've already decided to fire him, it's just a matter of when and how so he can't sue them. And I don't think Indiana will defecting from the Big Ten, but whatever.
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Old 02-21-2008, 02:24 AM   #32
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

Pat Forde's article actually summed up my point pretty well:

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There are some who believe the NCAA is overreacting to something considered as innocuous as excessive phone calls. But the it's-just-phone-calls crowd is missing a central point.

Read this paragraph from the NCAA Committee on Infractions report on Oklahoma in 2006, when Sampson and his staff were slammed for making 577 impermissible calls:

"The committee has consistently heard that the key to successful recruiting is being able to develop relationships with prospects and their families. The obvious purpose of these violations was to be the first institution to make recruiting contact with prospects and then to build on the relationship by having multiple impermissible contacts with the prospects in the very important early stages of their recruitment. These calculated violations created a significant recruiting advantage over institutions abiding by the telephone contact limitations."

Sampson then went out and allegedly attempted to create the same recruiting advantage at Indiana. While on probation.

I mean....if you can't understand that, and you still want to say, "Derrr...just phone calls," then I really don't know what to tell you. You just don't get it, I guess.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:56 AM   #33
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

but if it was a problem dont you think we'd hear more parents or families saying "damn coach K (or whoever) wouldnt stop calling.. I had to change my number, I had to do this , that , etc"... we never hear about that.
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Old 02-21-2008, 10:05 AM   #34
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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Originally Posted by Dizzle-2k7
but if it was a problem dont you think we'd hear more parents or families saying "damn coach K (or whoever) wouldnt stop calling.. I had to change my number, I had to do this , that , etc"... we never hear about that.
Whether it's a widespread problem or not isn't relevant. Maybe that just means that not as many people are breaking the rules as some people like to assume. And if that's the case, that makes Sampson's violation even worse.

But it doesn't matter how many others do it or don't, or how much worse that does or doesn't make it. Because we already know enough to know it was a major violation, a repeat violation, that he lied about it, and that he deserves to lose his job and is going to.
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:26 AM   #35
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

Rules are rules, regardless of whether they seem trivial or meaningless. I'm not a big fan of the 21-years drinking policy this country has, but nevertheless it's the rules and everyone has to follow them. No one gets any special treatment if they're caught and the everyone is punishible to the extremest measures.

It's the same here. They're just phone calls. Just like you would say, "it's just a beer." But it's the rule and everyone has to follow them accoridngly. To ***** and moan about it is fruitful, Kelvin ****ed up again and deserves all the negative press and punishment he gets cause he obviously cannot learn his leasson. He's like a chain smoker that can't quit.

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but if it was a problem dont you think we'd hear more parents or families saying "damn coach K (or whoever) wouldnt stop calling.. I had to change my number, I had to do this , that , etc"... we never hear about that.

That's Coach K. You picked the wrong guy. Coach K is not the standard or by any stretch of the imagination for college coaches. Your standard is your no-fame obscure college coaches in which high schoolers don't want to hear from them all day long for two phone calls a day. You want Horace Broadnax calling you twice a day? Hell, I don't even want my girlfriend to call me everyday, let alone a college basketball coach. What can happen in every 12-24 hours between each and every call? "Oh I went to the bathroom just now. Studied, hang out with my friends at the mall.." It's harassment.

Last edited by wang4three : 02-22-2008 at 08:31 AM.
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Old 02-22-2008, 10:09 AM   #36
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

http://www.cbs.sportsline.com/colleg...story/10659277

Now it gets interesting. The players will quit if Sampson is gone. I don't mind as that's one guaranteed win for MSU (I just wonder if Indy gets to keep their ranking as that would help our RPI ).
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:53 PM   #37
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

I just heard he's out.

Here's the link:

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaab/news;_...v=ap&type=lgns

I HOPE YOU GUYS ARE HAPPY.

Now Indiana can hire a classy and clean coach with a pathetic win-loss record.

This is why I've always felt that doing things the right way is ridiculous.

Just because a program has class and dignity, that doesn't mean things can't spiral out of control.

IMO, Indiana will live to regret this.

I would love to see Indiana crash and burn just to prove a point.

THEY ARE PHONE CALLS! FREAKING PHONE CALLS!!

He was actually doing a good job, and he's booted for PHONE CALLS?! IIRC, Jim Harrick actually managed to finish the freaking season after his trouble at Georgia!

I hope Indiana regrets this decision.

IMO, classy coaches can equal finishing in the cellar... Just because coaches have honor and dignity doesn't give them an excuse to flat out SUCK!!

This isn't like Jim Harrick or Dave Bliss.

We are talking about phone calls. PHONE CALLS!

They're just lousy cell phones, for god sakes!

How do you want him to recruit- drive around the country and go door-to-door while wasting time?!

If I'm a Hoosier fan, I'd be livid.
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Old 02-22-2008, 09:19 PM   #38
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

What world are you living in?
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Old 02-22-2008, 10:32 PM   #39
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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Originally Posted by ChrisKreager
I just heard he's out.

Here's the link:

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaab/news;_...v=ap&type=lgns

I HOPE YOU GUYS ARE HAPPY.

Now Indiana can hire a classy and clean coach with a pathetic win-loss record.

This is why I've always felt that doing things the right way is ridiculous.

Just because a program has class and dignity, that doesn't mean things can't spiral out of control.

IMO, Indiana will live to regret this.

I would love to see Indiana crash and burn just to prove a point.

THEY ARE PHONE CALLS! FREAKING PHONE CALLS!!

He was actually doing a good job, and he's booted for PHONE CALLS?! IIRC, Jim Harrick actually managed to finish the freaking season after his trouble at Georgia!

I hope Indiana regrets this decision.

IMO, classy coaches can equal finishing in the cellar... Just because coaches have honor and dignity doesn't give them an excuse to flat out SUCK!!

This isn't like Jim Harrick or Dave Bliss.

We are talking about phone calls. PHONE CALLS!

They're just lousy cell phones, for god sakes!

How do you want him to recruit- drive around the country and go door-to-door while wasting time?!

If I'm a Hoosier fan, I'd be livid.

Stop being a baby.
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Old 02-25-2008, 02:07 AM   #40
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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Originally Posted by wang4three

That's Coach K. You picked the wrong guy. Coach K is not the standard or by any stretch of the imagination for college coaches. Your standard is your no-fame obscure college coaches in which high schoolers don't want to hear from them all day long for two phone calls a day. You want Horace Broadnax calling you twice a day? Hell, I don't even want my girlfriend to call me everyday, let alone a college basketball coach. What can happen in every 12-24 hours between each and every call? "Oh I went to the bathroom just now. Studied, hang out with my friends at the mall.." It's harassment.

Excellent point that I did not realize. I agree with you and Game, now. Thanks for that analogy of the GF/Horace.
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Old 02-25-2008, 12:36 PM   #41
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisKreager
I just heard he's out.

Here's the link:

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaab/news;_...v=ap&type=lgns

I HOPE YOU GUYS ARE HAPPY.

Now Indiana can hire a classy and clean coach with a pathetic win-loss record.

This is why I've always felt that doing things the right way is ridiculous.

Just because a program has class and dignity, that doesn't mean things can't spiral out of control.

IMO, Indiana will live to regret this.

I would love to see Indiana crash and burn just to prove a point.

THEY ARE PHONE CALLS! FREAKING PHONE CALLS!!

He was actually doing a good job, and he's booted for PHONE CALLS?! IIRC, Jim Harrick actually managed to finish the freaking season after his trouble at Georgia!

I hope Indiana regrets this decision.

IMO, classy coaches can equal finishing in the cellar... Just because coaches have honor and dignity doesn't give them an excuse to flat out SUCK!!

This isn't like Jim Harrick or Dave Bliss.

We are talking about phone calls. PHONE CALLS!

They're just lousy cell phones, for god sakes!

How do you want him to recruit- drive around the country and go door-to-door while wasting time?!

If I'm a Hoosier fan, I'd be livid.
You're still making the comparison to people who have done something worse just to make it seem like Sampson did nothing. You're a moron. I've tried to explain to you why that is totally illogical, but you don't get it.

And considering most Indiana fans wanted him out because they don't want to support a cheater, I don't think they would want you speaking for them.

Why does it follow, in whatever universe you live in, that you have to be a filthy cheater to win? Why does it follow that a coach who follows the rules will definitely have a "pathetic won/loss record?"

Sure, they could go get someone with a pathetic won/loss record. Here's guessing they won't. Here's guessing they get someone who follows the rules AND wins. My guess is Scott Drew.

Last edited by TheGame414 : 02-25-2008 at 12:39 PM.
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Old 02-25-2008, 05:49 PM   #42
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGame414
Why does it follow that a coach who follows the rules will definitely have a "pathetic won/loss record?"

See Nebraska, Northwestern, Oregon State, Georgia, and Florida State.

Last edited by ChrisKreager : 02-25-2008 at 05:51 PM.
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Old 02-25-2008, 06:07 PM   #43
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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Originally Posted by ChrisKreager
See Nebraska, Northwestern, Oregon State, Georgia, and Florida State.
bill carmody from northwestern is one of the better coaches in the big ten. the guy does more with less talent and terrible administration that doesnt allow him to get anyone in. a couple years of go, jared dudley committed to paly at nu, but the stupid admissions people would not allow him to get in. talk about a guy who is a great coach doing the most with the least. he had ridiculous success at princeton! he outcoaches other people every night but is playing with a varsity high school team that cant shoot.
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Old 02-25-2008, 06:29 PM   #44
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

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Originally Posted by ChrisKreager
See Nebraska, Northwestern, Oregon State, Georgia, and Florida State.
Georgia sucks because they're still feeling the repercussions of Jim Harrick's violations just like Indiana's about to with Sampson's, so that kinda tears a massive hole in your retarded argument.

The other schools have almost no basketball history whatsoever.

How 'bout all those schools who win big without shamelessly breaking major rules? Like, say, I don't know....North Carolina? Duke? UCLA? Michigan State? Wisconsin? Illinois (until this year, of course)? Florida (Donovan's faced accusations, but nothing substantiated)?

Last I checked, Indiana won a few national titles without ever committing a violation.

You seem to be making two ongoing arguments, each of which is exceedingly stupid.

1. That "it's just phone calls," so it's not a big deal, because others do worse stuff. I had hoped I had explained to you how stupid that was with my earlier analogy, but apparently it went right over your head.

2. Though you haven't outright said it, you seem to be implying that cheating is integral to winning in college basketball, despite the litany of programs who have won big without having to fire a coach for repeated major violations.

You are quite possibly in the top 10 of all-time dumbest people I've ever posted with.
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Old 02-25-2008, 06:34 PM   #45
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Default Re: Breaking News: Indiana faces MAJOR sanctions

Give Doc some time and he could turn the Huskers into a good basketball program. Hey, if KU can have a great football team...
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