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Old 05-16-2008, 05:00 PM   #16
tsforthrees
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

i think the mayo vs. lee comparison just popped up in this thread. they aren't very similar players, and mayo is already much better at a younger age. not a very good comparison imo
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Old 05-16-2008, 06:05 PM   #17
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

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Originally Posted by tsforthrees
well considering i am high on bayless and not as high on rose, i would pick him first. so that's my reason. and i'm pretty sure i'd get a season to prove i'm right about it too, not one night.
Nothing wrong with being high on one guy and not on another. However, you need to at least back it up with something stronger than "it's my opinion and Bayless will prove me right... eventually".
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Old 05-16-2008, 06:21 PM   #18
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

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Nothing wrong with being high on one guy and not on another. However, you need to at least back it up with something stronger than "it's my opinion and Bayless will prove me right... eventually".

i didn't say he'd prove me right, i'm just saying i would get a season to see if it worked out or not. rose was surrounded by the best supporting cast in college basketball last season, bayless did not, yet still showed the same leadership qualities and basketball talent that rose did. i'm not saying rose sucks, i just think he has a lot of hype going his way because of the system he played in and the coach he had. i think bayless will be a better pro, and that is why i would draft him first.
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Old 05-16-2008, 11:43 PM   #19
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

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Originally Posted by tsforthrees
i didn't say he'd prove me right, i'm just saying i would get a season to see if it worked out or not. rose was surrounded by the best supporting cast in college basketball last season, bayless did not, yet still showed the same leadership qualities and basketball talent that rose did. i'm not saying rose sucks, i just think he has a lot of hype going his way because of the system he played in and the coach he had. i think bayless will be a better pro, and that is why i would draft him first.

Bayless is a better shooter, but besides that I have a hard time figuring out what else he does better than Rose.

Defense? Bayless is way too weak on defense, and gets pushed around out there. Rose does not. Yes he is not consistent but he is the better defender. edge to Rose

Rebounder? Not close, edge to Rose

Assists? Not close, edge to Rose

Penetration? both are cat quick, and both seem to be good at finishing at the rim, but Rose is better because of his frame. Jerryd does draw more fouls though. edge ill say even, though i feel like the edge is Rose.

Leadership? No idea on Bayless but i know Rose is a great leader on and off the court. edge cant say dont have an opinion on Bayless.

Ball handling? edge to Rose

decision making? Earlier in the year i would have given it to Bayless but the 2nd half of the year Rose was very good at his decision making. edge even.

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Old 05-17-2008, 12:17 PM   #20
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

I am a huge Bayless fan, but saying he was just as good of a leader as Rose is crazy. To me that is the biggest knock on Bayless. When you are supposed to be a PG taken in the top 5, you better be able to lead your team. However, when Nic Wise got hurt the team went 2 and 5. Bayless cranked up the scoring, but forgot how to pass, and it hurt his team.
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Old 05-17-2008, 12:31 PM   #21
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

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I am a huge Bayless fan, but saying he was just as good of a leader as Rose is crazy.

I couldn't agree more. In the mid-season Rose wasn't necessarily that much ahead of Bayless as a leader, but I think that was one aspect of his game where Rose really improved between November and March. And if Memphis didn't play that kind of a free flowing system, and Rose didn't have those guys around him, he probably would have kept the ball more in his own hands and people would rate him as a better leader than they do now.
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Old 05-17-2008, 01:57 PM   #22
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

I think Rose's leadership is a bit over-stated. What he did down th stretch was not so much leadership as it was him realizing that DJ Augustin and Darren Collison simply could not stop him from getting around the court.

To me leadership is more about making sure your team maintains its composure or sticks to the game plan (ie. when TNT did the sounds of the game segment were Lamar Odom kept yelling to the Lakers that they ball was moving too slowly in Game 3 against Utah)

Rose's play in the tournament showed me he had far more "big dawg" in him than I originally thought but leadership is still not something he's ready to start showing.

Out of all the freshmen the guy that actually showed the most leadership to me was Mike Beasley. Every game I caught he would routinely take a teammate aside during a timeout and explain something to them.

Last edited by Da KO King : 05-17-2008 at 02:03 PM.
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Old 05-19-2008, 05:23 PM   #23
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

jerryd bayless is going to be SICK.
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Old 05-19-2008, 06:45 PM   #24
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlThornton
Bayless is a better shooter, but besides that I have a hard time figuring out what else he does better than Rose.

Defense? Bayless is way too weak on defense, and gets pushed around out there. Rose does not. Yes he is not consistent but he is the better defender. edge to Rose

Rebounder? Not close, edge to Rose

Assists? Not close, edge to Rose

Penetration? both are cat quick, and both seem to be good at finishing at the rim, but Rose is better because of his frame. Jerryd does draw more fouls though. edge ill say even, though i feel like the edge is Rose.

Leadership? No idea on Bayless but i know Rose is a great leader on and off the court. edge cant say dont have an opinion on Bayless.

Ball handling? edge to Rose

decision making? Earlier in the year i would have given it to Bayless but the 2nd half of the year Rose was very good at his decision making. edge even.

you're getting quite carried away with those bolded statements...bayless is a strong and solid defender and doesn't get "pushed around"...as far as the rebound and assists, take a look at their stats and it's not that far off - rose averaged about 2 rebounds more, but only 1 assist more while averaging 5 fewer points on much worse overall percentages...they both had the same amount of steals and turnovers as well...considering the type of team he had around him, rose shoulda been averaging at least 6 assists and i was expecting him to be pushing close to 8 assists this season...what it comes down to is that although rose averaged fewer assists than i expected, he is still the better PG prospect while bayless is a superior scorer still learning when to be a PG...as far as leadership, i actually think for most of the season bayless was a better leader considering the role he took for zona and the intensity and confidence he brought to that role when someone like budinger or mcclellan shoulda been that leader...rose moreso led by example while dorsey and cdr were better vocal/demonstrative leaders...
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Old 05-20-2008, 02:26 AM   #25
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Default Re: Big Board of Top 115 NBA Draft Prospects, by Position, w/Analysis

KO, I agree with your post. In college basketball you have some great leaders, but a lot of times it is not the PG. But I think if you are going to be a great NBA PG, you at least have to show some leadership, even if it is just finding ways for your team to win. That is all Rose did. I would actually say in the Tournament he was a lot like Kobe in that he just does what he needs to do. Going to the basket at will like he did shows that he does that "big dawg" thing you mention, but I think that also shows good leadership. Again, I'm not saying he is a great leader at this point, or that he was even the leader of the Memphis team, but for a freshman he showed a lot of potential in that area.
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