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Old 08-24-2006, 10:48 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by DeuceWallaces
You being a musician for only 9 years does not qualify you.
I've been a professional musician for 9 years - been playing instruments for 20 years. I was offered full college scholarships on more than one instrument. I'm almost done with my doctorate in music. Point is, I can tell whether or not somebody can play an instrument at a professional level.
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It's not an inference you can make.
No, it's not an inference you can make.

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If you were such a great musician you would realize that pop music is driven by simplicity and clever hooks. Not how well you can shred on a guitar or drop some Liszt on the keyboard.
In this thread, I've stated that A: Andre3000 cannot play any instruments at a professional level, and B: I like Andre3000 lot and have all of his albums. How can you read statements A and B, and then come away from it thinking that I believe pop music is based on guitar shredding and virtuoso piano?

Why do you believe that just because you aren't qualified to make a certain judgement that nobody else alive is either?
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Old 08-24-2006, 10:56 PM   #47
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It mystifies me why people continue to get into arguments about music with adamcz. you will lose everytime.

HE KNOWS MORE THAN YOU. ok??
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Old 08-24-2006, 11:01 PM   #48
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You tell 'em GeeWiz!

And before anybody tries to basterdize what I'm saying, I think Andre3000 is a better musician than I am. There aren't many rappers that I would say that about, but he's one of them. He just doesn't happen to play any instruments really well.

Last edited by adamcz : 08-24-2006 at 11:04 PM.
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Old 08-24-2006, 11:03 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by geeWiz15
It mystifies me why people continue to get into arguments about music with adamcz. you will lose everytime.

HE KNOWS MORE THAN YOU. ok??

A lot of people on here talk about music as if they know it, when in acutality they are more counter-culture or saw a special about the topic on VH1 and are inclined to believe they are experts. I can talk about music, but by no means do I talk about it like I hold the final word. I've taken a couple music classes at a university with a top music program and listen and love pretty much any and all music, so I can atleast see more than one side of teh story.
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Old 08-25-2006, 12:53 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by Suns4Life
A lot of people on here talk about music as if they know it, when in acutality they are more counter-culture or saw a special about the topic on VH1 and are inclined to believe they are experts.

Buy Admanz album, then decide what he knows about music.

There is a solid point here. You can't always tell how good an artist is instrumentally by what the choose to put on a record. But it is possible to take an educated guess.

Think about a journalist. If this writer writes an AP wire story, the skill he shows will be very low. But if he then decides to write a book, he's probably going to use more skill. You can't judge how good a writer he is by the AP story.

I'm going to agree with Admanz, that he could not play on a Profesional level as far as Classical or Jazz. His skill is as a pop-writer. Writing a good pop song is incredibly underrated. Writing a good, original, and innovative pop song is rare. OutKast are very good at what they do. I like them a lot.
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Old 08-25-2006, 01:20 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by xxxSuperStar
If you take the songwriting and musical talent of mainstream bands and put it toe to toe with "indy" bands, in almost every case the mainstream people are better singers, better on their instruments, better performers and better songwriters. That's why they get record deals.

A lot of indy and non mainstream bands are really good, but by and large there is a flaw in something they do (songs sound similar, they don't have the capacity to produce more than one good album, they have internal problems, ect)

I'm leaving bubble gum pop and AMerican Idol stuff out of this because a lot of that is based on looks and appearence, but country, rock, punk, heavy, alternative, adult contemporary, jam bands, hip hop and everything else the mainstream people are amazing.

You musn't know what to listen to if you think that's the case. That's a rediculous statement you've just made. Lyrically mainstream lyrics are just that appealing to the mainstream. I'll give you some of the musical talent is better, but it depends on what style you're looking at. The problem with mainstream bands is their songs sound "too similar".
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Old 08-25-2006, 02:10 AM   #52
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back to idlewild... haven't heard it yet, have heard 'morris brown' and 'mighty o', though. to me, nowhere near as good 'aquemini', which is one of my fave albums of all time.

@ adamcz - you can judge his proficiency based on the technicality of his work, but eh... if all musicians played to their "musical potential", nobody would write simple songs... and sometimes simple songs are the most beautiful.
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Old 08-25-2006, 07:34 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by playtetris
@ adamcz - you can judge his proficiency based on the technicality of his work, but eh... if all musicians played to their "musical potential", nobody would write simple songs... and sometimes simple songs are the most beautiful.
Not true. Lots of guys who can really play still write simple songs. Stevie Wonder, Charles Mingus, I could name 100.
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Old 08-25-2006, 07:40 AM   #54
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Good to hear a professional's opinion of Andre's skills. The man can definitely sing, though - now there's no doubt that he's a class unto himself in that regard.
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Old 08-25-2006, 07:56 AM   #55
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The other thing about him that you guys may have noticed but not thought about is that he is not tied down to the beat. Almost every rapper (and musician in general) uses rhythms that are almost rigidly locked down to the beat. Simple divisions of two and three. Check out "Return of the Gangster": after he says the words I put in quotes, he frees himself from the beat, and meets up with it later. Sounds simple, but I've been around music long enough to know that not many feel comfortable doing that. He does this a lot at a really subtle level - placing his words right where he wants to, ahead or behind of the beat.

And like somebody else said, writing good pop songs is a very underrated skill. If everybody could do it, they would. I know I would if I could.
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Old 08-25-2006, 08:01 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamcz
The other thing about him that you guys may have noticed but not thought about is that he is not tied down to the beat. Almost every rapper (and musician in general) uses rhythms that are almost rigidly locked down to the beat. Simple divisions of two and three. Check out "Return of the Gangster": after he says the words I put in quotes, he frees himself from the beat, and meets up with it later. Sounds simple, but I've been around music long enough to know that not many feel comfortable doing that. He does this a lot at a really subtle level - placing his words right where he wants to, ahead or behind of the beat.

And like somebody else said, writing good pop songs is a very underrated skill. If everybody could do it, they would. I know I would if I could.

Playing the flute good dosen't make you an expert at music. Back when i was in High School I could play that thing like a wizard. Got so many awards and everything. I've seen what you look like. Thats what I looked like in high school. Skinny, glasses ,red hair, acne. Those days are long gone for me, but you obvisloly haven't got past that playing the flute gets you nowhere in the music buisness these days.
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Old 08-25-2006, 09:45 AM   #57
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I never considered them hip hop, songs like "Hey ya" and "Church" seemed more like pop songs than hip hop. but if you disagree, then tell me your definition of hip hop, maybe mine is different.

you only started listening to them since hey ya right? pick up their albums and try to tell they aint hip hop again...


also hiphop is a culture. outkast came from that culture so they're hip hop and making hip hop music. mary j came from that culture. thats why she's considered the queen of hip hop.


you're saying they aint hiphop, now i'm asking you: what's hiphop and why arent they hip hop?

pop music is popular music, which means a lot of hip hop songs can be considered pop. so that, for one, eliminates your post.
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Old 08-25-2006, 09:51 AM   #58
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Kiss Alive II, great double album


Gene
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Old 08-25-2006, 10:01 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamcz
I have all the Outkast albums, so the only way you're right is if he hasn't demonstrated his proficiency on them. Nice guess though.
That's my point. He doesn't really play any instruments on their albums. His supposed proficiency would be outside of his albums.
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Old 08-25-2006, 11:54 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamcz
Not true. Lots of guys who can really play still write simple songs. Stevie Wonder, Charles Mingus, I could name 100.

good call on the mingus. ****'s some of my favourite jazz
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