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Old 06-30-2008, 10:00 AM   #1
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Default People with a clue about euro prospects

I often hear a name and people type them up. I go to check out thier stats and its weak. So are euro prospects like a Batum, Rubio based off of potential/upside similar to that of a high schooler? I'm trying to figure out how these euros are rated so highly yet thier production screams otherwise.

Basically how is a euro prospect evaluated/broken down? Similar to a high schooler?
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:07 AM   #2
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

They are broken down similar to highschoolers now. The hype machine causes scouts to not pay attention to what they are actually doing on the court. The things that are being said about Rubio were being said about Roko Leni Ukic, Sergio Rodriguez, Milos Vujanic, Americans Sebastian Telfair, Kenny Anderson,and Randy Livingston

In the past you had to be a bonafide star in Europe to be drafted to the NBA. Dirk kinda changed that, even though it was obvious that if he moved up to the better divisions he would still be the man.

Stats differ in Europe because the games are shorter and stats are tabulated differently. Assists are rung up the way the NBA did them during the Cousy era. The ability to goal tend affects shooting percentages, and the closer three point line makes the 3 a joke.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:10 AM   #3
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Ricky Rubio got his pro-debut in the ACB at age 14, on one of the top teams. What do you expect to judge him on other than potential at that point, see many 14 year olds playing on top Div. I schools ? At this point he's still only 17 and playing against grown men, what american prospect could you compare him to in a fair manor ?
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:18 AM   #4
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTicket
Ricky Rubio got his pro-debut in the ACB at age 14, on one of the top teams. What do you expect to judge him on other than potential at that point, see many 14 year olds playing on top Div. I schools ? At this point he's still only 17 and playing against grown men, what american prospect could you compare him to in a fair manor ?

Bad example using Rubio (forgot his age)
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:24 AM   #5
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

I love how people on these boards get excited off player comparisons though. That worked out well for Darko.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:25 AM   #6
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Not sure I always try to read up on these guys, and you always hear how they have worked themselves up to become contributors on their team during Euroleague play, but then see their stats and they're only getting 15-20 mins a night. A lot of these guys end up impressing at the Reebok camp or the Nike Hoop summit, and then catching teams eye in workouts (a la Alexis Ajinca).
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:28 AM   #7
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOBB
Bad example using Rubio (forgot his age)

and the fact that he is one of the top players in the ACB league at age 17. Also has lead the league in efficiency among other things
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:35 AM   #8
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by plowking
I love how people on these boards get excited off player comparisons though. That worked out well for Darko.

Darko ended up being such a bust its funny. I remember Chad Ford saying he was proven against the top leagues in Europe. Look at this article

http://espn.go.com/nba/columns/misc/1490974.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Ford
Milicic, who is actually six months younger than LeBron, is trying to get his arms around the hype. "He's like Magic?" he asks. "Kind of," I respond. "Like Jordan?" he counters. "Sort of," I say. "What about Kobe," he says. "Maybe" is the best I can do.

The truth is, we still don't know what James is. He dominates high school competition like few ever have. But he's playing against boys every night. Kwame Brown was beating the stuffing out of boys like that a few years ago.

Milicic smiles even wider as I struggle to explain LeBron to him. He is rubbing a sore calf muscle. He's just hours removed from banging in the low post against a bigger, stronger 28-year-old defender.

"I play against men," he says matter of factly.

Then he drops the bomb. "So who do I remind you of?"

Uh-oh. Milicic had just dropped one his most impressive performances of the year against a Euroleague team.

Milicic scored 14 points, grabbed 10 rebounds, blocked five shots and handed out three uncredited assists (they don't count assists the same way in Europe as they do in the U.S.) in just 15 minutes. He picked a good time to put on a masterpiece. Scouts from the Pistons, Sonics and Bucks were also in attendance.

Darko keeps pressing. He wants comparisons.

Vlade Divac. Pau Gasol? Dirk Nowitzki? Arvydas Sabonis. He doesn't like any of them.

Milicic, who stands 7-foot and carries a solid 245 pounds, is tough to pin down. He's still too young to play for the national team, so he hasn't had much opportunity to work with Divac or Peja Stojakovic. He knows them and respects them, but he doesn't try to be them. He is his own player. Comparisons quickly escape him. Is he Gasol? No, he's much stronger. Is he Nowitzki? Again, he's stronger and a much more physical player. Maybe Sabonis? He laughs and puts his head in his hands.

So who exactly are you, Darko Milicic?

"I like Kevin Garnett," Milicic begins. "He plays like Yugoslavian players play, with heart."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Ford
"When you look at 17-year-old big men in the States, you're basically looking at kids trying to grow into their body," one NBA scout told ESPN.com. "They are so much bigger than the local competition that they just end up being lazy and dunking all of the time. Darko's biggest advantage is that he's played against players who are his equal or better for a long time. That's how players, especially big men, get better. LeBron lapped his competition sometime last year."

Unlike the Nuggets' Nikoloz Tskitishvili, the fifth overall pick last summer, Milicic is actually playing for his team. NBA scouts feel that he'll have a much smoother transition -- think Gasol -- than most young players.

But what really excites them is his mature low-post play. "More than Nowitzki, Gasol or even Divac, Darko has a nasty streak in him that will help him succeed in the post," a league executive said. "A lot of the Europeans are really threes in the pros. He'll be a true low-post player. His coach is doing us a huge favor by forcing him to develop those skills now. He already has moves that remind me of (Hakeem) Olajuwon in the post. Once we get a hold of him, the sky's the limit."
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:41 AM   #9
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

I honestly think Darko could have become good, perhaps even great, to this day you can still see glimpses of what could have been at time. But the Pistons completely ****ed up his development, I still remember seeing Larry Brown talking to Letterman and just completely humiliating Darko on national tv for no apparent reason, talking about how immature he was. What kind of man, let alone coach, does that to someone he is supposed to help ?
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:43 AM   #10
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Ah yes, Kevin Garnett, then Hakeem.

Who does he remind us of now?...
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:44 AM   #11
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTicket
I honestly think Darko could have become good, perhaps even great, to this day you can still see glimpses of what could have been at time. But the Pistons completely ****ed up his development, I still remember seeing Larry Brown talking to Letterman and just completely humiliating Darko on national tv for no apparent reason, talking about how immature he was. What kind of man, let alone coach, does that to someone he is supposed to help ?

Agreed, I still think he can become a good player. There is no denying that he is one of the better defenders in the NBA. All he needs now is confidence, something a lot of Euro players lack when they come to the NBA, and this is especially the case with a lot of Yugoslavian players.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:45 AM   #12
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Football coaches, drill sergeants, baseball managers, European basketball coaches, hell coaches period berate their charges regularly. Darko is not great because he just sucks. He seems to not have it in him to be special, and no amount of coddling and nutriding is gonna coax specialness out of him.

Of course he has flashes of greatness. The sun shines on a mole's ass every now and again.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:45 AM   #13
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTicket
I honestly think Darko could have become good, perhaps even great, to this day you can still see glimpses of what could have been at time. But the Pistons completely ****ed up his development, I still remember seeing Larry Brown talking to Letterman and just completely humiliating Darko on national tv for no apparent reason, talking about how immature he was. What kind of man, let alone coach, does that to someone he is supposed to help ?

Yeah blame the coach.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:49 AM   #14
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dasher
Football coaches, drill sergeants, baseball managers, European basketball coaches, hell coaches period berate their charges regularly. Darko is not great because he just sucks. He seems to not have it in him to be special, and no amount of coddling and nutriding is gonna coax specialness out of him.

Of course he has flashes of greatness. The sun shines on a mole's ass every now and again.

You forgot one thing, all the ones you listed berate you in private and defend you in public, as they should. Larry Brown berated him in public, which is altogether different.
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:50 AM   #15
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Default Re: People with a clue about euro prospects

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTicket
I honestly think Darko could have become good, perhaps even great, to this day you can still see glimpses of what could have been at time. But the Pistons completely ****ed up his development, I still remember seeing Larry Brown talking to Letterman and just completely humiliating Darko on national tv for no apparent reason, talking about how immature he was. What kind of man, let alone coach, does that to someone he is supposed to help ?

Darko didn't become great because he doesn't have the talent we thought he did. He looked great shooting open jumpers in workouts, but is not a great shooter in games. Also his supposed athleticism was overrated, he blocks shots with his length not his jumping ability. His quickness and footspeed are both average, and his from what I've heard about him he seemed more interested in having fun in America than improving as a basketball player as a Piston. He was nowhere near as special as advertised, and at best at this point his ceiling is last year's version of Andrew Bogut, minus the passing.
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