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Old 07-09-2008, 01:46 AM   #16
bokes15
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
That's the part I think is debatable. The way the Sixers played at the end of the year, I would've put them over the Raptors going into this season if neither team made a change.
They certainly outplayed us at the end of the season, as most teams did.. but I wouldn't say they HAD the better team, rather that they, as u noted in your previous post, PLAYED better and played to their strengths. It didn't help us that Bosh went down for a significant period of time, along with the TJ/Calderon starter situation when he came back from injury. Philly had a full, healthy, cohesive team that gelled at the right time. Were they better? my personal opinion is no.
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Old 07-09-2008, 11:16 AM   #17
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

Philly is going to be really good. Brand has had basically 1 injury his entire career. He'll be fine. Thad is a stud and SG is fine as Iggy will man the SG spot. Shooters an issue, but transition, D and half court they will be very good.

It's the same as when Boston got KG and Ray and people in this forum were actually giving the "lets wait to see them play a game" stuff then too when it was painfully obvious they were going to be sick.
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Old 07-09-2008, 11:38 AM   #18
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by RapsFan
Philly is going to be really good. Brand has had basically 1 injury his entire career. He'll be fine. Thad is a stud and SG is fine as Iggy will man the SG spot. Shooters an issue, but transition, D and half court they will be very good.

It's the same as when Boston got KG and Ray and people in this forum were actually giving the "lets wait to see them play a game" stuff then too when it was painfully obvious they were going to be sick.
Your forgetting that the Celtics got KG (20/10 career, defensive monster), Ray Allen (20/5/4, the greatest shooter this game has seen since Reggie), and Pierce who was a 20/5/6 guy... among others (Posey, Cassell, House, Brown, etc.) So you're comparing apples and oranges here.

Iggy is a near 20 point scorer, but outside of him they didn't have much..and as we saw in the pistons series, it mattered when it counted. Elton adds some spacing on the floor, but as noted, no perimeter shooters. Also, he's not been known as a defensive powerhouse in his career. With that said, i'm not saying the Sixers are not gonna be a threat, but what I am saying is don't overrate who they currently have on their team because of Brand's arrival. Young talent and potential doesn't automatically = a top 3 team in the East.
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Old 07-09-2008, 11:52 AM   #19
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by bokes15
Your forgetting that the Celtics got KG (20/10 career, defensive monster), Ray Allen (20/5/4, the greatest shooter this game has seen since Reggie), and Pierce who was a 20/5/6 guy... among others (Posey, Cassell, House, Brown, etc.) So you're comparing apples and oranges here.

Iggy is a near 20 point scorer, but outside of him they didn't have much..and as we saw in the pistons series, it mattered when it counted. Elton adds some spacing on the floor, but as noted, no perimeter shooters. Also, he's not been known as a defensive powerhouse in his career. With that said, i'm not saying the Sixers are not gonna be a threat, but what I am saying is don't overrate who they currently have on their team because of Brand's arrival. Young talent and potential doesn't automatically = a top 3 team in the East.

I think you mis-read my post. People were underestimating the Celtics (which is my point), just as I think people are downplaying the Sixers. It's day 1 of free agency....you don't think Philly will address it's outside shooting? People were going nuts about the Celts lack of a bench on day 1 of free agency last year too....and obviously it was going to be addressed.

Brand is a very good defender...not sure where you're getting your comment about his D. Philly also played the Pistons very well and their young guys will be a year older and more experienced. Thad Young and Louis Williams have huge potential, but a lot of that has already been realized. They also have depth on their bench with guys like Evans, Smith, Green and Williams. Let's take off the purple blinders.
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Old 07-09-2008, 12:05 PM   #20
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

The Sixers may be wishing they kept Kyle Korver, cause they'd be able to really stretch the defence then. Be scary really....

I'd have them equal with the Raps for the start of the season. Boston,Cleveland and Orlando being at the top then the Sixers & Raps.. I believe the Pistons will finish below all these teams..
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Old 07-09-2008, 02:00 PM   #21
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by power works
Minus 3 yrs and 48 million. Huge difference. If things don't work out with JO, Raps wait another year. With Sixers, it's like 2014.

How much money he makes doesn't have an effect on whether the Sixers are a threat in the Eastern Conference.
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Old 07-09-2008, 02:14 PM   #22
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

The Atlantic Division is the only good division in the East. And this year it's even better, I like what the raps have done to shore up their defense with O'neal, and get rid of the distracting Ford. The 6'ers just got alot better as well, but I still give the raps the upperhand on this one. They have more scoring threats, and if they can play better defense this season they will be a team to be reckoned with.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:43 PM   #23
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by AZfan4Life4
The Atlantic Division is the only good division in the East. And this year it's even better, I like what the raps have done to shore up their defense with O'neal, and get rid of the distracting Ford. The 6'ers just got alot better as well, but I still give the raps the upperhand on this one. They have more scoring threats, and if they can play better defense this season they will be a team to be reckoned with.
That's what i'm saying. I'm not totally sure about better defense than the sixers, that's yet to be seen. But offensively, the Sixers were among the bottom of the league (23rd) in scoring. And its hard to say they had excellent defense because their point differencial was only +.41 96.62 ppg, 96.20 points allowed. Granted, i'm sure that Brand will improve these areas for them a great deal, but I doubt it's enough to put them in the category of the Celtics, that's just ridiculous.
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Old 07-09-2008, 09:48 PM   #24
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

The Phillies are now the 3rd best team in the east.


IMO Andre Iguodala gives them the edge as the Raps have nobody even in the same universe as him and combined with the underrated Andre Miller, who Jose only has a slight edge on and Bosh/JO have only a small edge over Dally/Brand.
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Old 07-09-2008, 11:39 PM   #25
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

Good comments. Brand - wow that's a big contract. Wonder if they signed him mostly to keep Iggy happy.

Gotta agree though that the Raptors finishing 41-41 was more a factor of the team collapsing or not finishing games, rather than other teams being superior.

At the end of the season, the PG's played poorly, Moon fell off, Kapono was rifing the pine, Bargnani was useless. Just by these guys playing back at their level the Raptors get better.
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Old 07-10-2008, 10:28 AM   #26
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by Dr.Funk
The Phillies are now the 3rd best team in the east.


IMO Andre Iguodala gives them the edge as the Raps have nobody even in the same universe as him and combined with the underrated Andre Miller, who Jose only has a slight edge on and Bosh/JO have only a small edge over Dally/Brand.

I agree. And I bet there are many GMs/fans/coaches etc that would pick Miller over Jose and the Brand/Dal frontcourt over ours. I bet it is a toss up.
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Old 07-10-2008, 10:32 AM   #27
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

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Originally Posted by Good Old Willy
Good comments. Brand - wow that's a big contract. Wonder if they signed him mostly to keep Iggy happy.

Gotta agree though that the Raptors finishing 41-41 was more a factor of the team collapsing or not finishing games, rather than other teams being superior.

At the end of the season, the PG's played poorly, Moon fell off, Kapono was rifing the pine, Bargnani was useless. Just by these guys playing back at their level the Raptors get better.

I don't think people sign Elton Brand to make another player happy. They sign Elton Brand because he is an elite big in the NBA, a incredibly hard worker and has many good years left.

As for the Raps end of season, our PG play will be fine with Jose, but there is no guarantee any of Moon (lack of skill), Kapono (terrible offensive gameplan by Mitchell) and Bargnani (bust) will improve at all. Their 'level' might be what we see.

People always talk about the Raptor guys getting better, or going from crap to their normal level, but never give the same credit to another team. Thad Young could exlode, Iggy could continue to improve as he has, same with Dalembert having Brand with him. Louis Williams has tons of talent and can get better.....etc etc etc. It works both ways.
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Old 07-10-2008, 02:59 PM   #28
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RapsFan
I agree. And I bet there are many GMs/fans/coaches etc that would pick Miller over Jose and the Brand/Dal frontcourt over ours. I bet it is a toss up.

Miller is a solid player, and could be considered by some to be better than Jose, but I wouldn't call that a key matchup as there's not a significant diff between the two. As for Bosh/O'neal vs. Dalembert/Brand I wouldn't call that a tossup. Two 20/10 guys vs. a 20/10 guy and a 10/10 guy. Defensively, D/B are on par with Bosh and O'neal, but offensively its not even close. Dalembert gets most of his points from putbacks, rebounds, and alley-oops which will be a lot harder with O'neal clogging the paint. On the other side, if Dalembert guards O'neal I believe that O'neal would have a strength advantage. I don't know which team i'd give the overall edge to,but i'd take healthy JO and Bosh over Brand and Dalembert.
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Old 07-11-2008, 01:39 AM   #29
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

This is one of the better threads I've seen here in a while, congrats to you all.

I give the edge to the Raps in this match, but it's and edge not an acre. The diference will be coaching. Can Sam get this team to play togetherr? Cheeks has had as many coaching issues as Sam has had. Sam's not a good X and O type coach we all know, but Sam might be able to coach this grind out kind of game that we should be better at playing if JO is healthy.

So as odd as this may sound I think the series is won by Sam's coaching.

Now let me have it..
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Old 07-11-2008, 01:04 PM   #30
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Default Re: shiiiiit... Brand signs with the Sixers...

Quote:
Originally Posted by b4ball
This is one of the better threads I've seen here in a while, congrats to you all.

I give the edge to the Raps in this match, but it's and edge not an acre. The diference will be coaching. Can Sam get this team to play togetherr? Cheeks has had as many coaching issues as Sam has had. Sam's not a good X and O type coach we all know, but Sam might be able to coach this grind out kind of game that we should be better at playing if JO is healthy.

So as odd as this may sound I think the series is won by Sam's coaching.

Now let me have it..

I think how Sam handles the sub patterns will be more important than his X's and O's. We all know Jose can play pick and roll with the best of them and we'll see lots of isos with Bosh or O'Neal. I just hope he utilizes our SF tandem properly.

I'm not concerned with who's starting (prefer Moon) but hopefully Sam can mix and match the lineups a bit more. Too many times last season we would see pretty much the entire second unit out there at the same time which is retarded at best.

I've given up on your playcalling Sam, just put some decent lineups out there
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